Pickup truck/SUV owners intentionally blocking electric charging spaces in parking lots

[GreatLakes]

Considering 99% of the cyclists we see on the road are riding on weekends, it’s a pretty fair assumption.

And you can NOT be serious about the late for work thing! Boo hoo, the cyclist could be late for work if they pulled over for faster traffic!?!? How about all the people who WILL be late for work because ONE cyclist is holding up dozens of cars!?!? I’m sorry, but when you CHOOSE to travel in a manner that automatically creates inconvenience for EVERYONE ELSE, it’s YOU who needs to be accommodating. Again, if a farmer - who by definition is already AT WORK while moving equipment - can do it, so can cyclists. Period.

Quite frankly, you’re basically proving my point for me. If you want to know why so many motorists have a bad attitude toward cyclists, go back & read everything you’ve said. You give courteous riders a bad name.

Yes, it’s a 2-way Street on sharing. I am fully committed to safely operating my vehicle in the vicinity of your bike. I will give you (and motorcycles) additional space whenever necessary. I know your presence on the road WILL cost me time and I’m fully prepared to lose it. Now, is it too much to ask that you do your part to ensure the amount of time I lose BECAUSE OF YOU is a “reasonable” amount of time?

As for the diesel pump, it works like the handicapped stall in the bathroom. If it’s busy, it’s expected that there will be a car of some kind at every pump. OTOH, if there are 16 empty pumps, and the ONE diesel pump is vacant, the courteous thing to do is not block that pump if your car isn’t diesel.

Cyclist are much like drivers, some are better and more courteous than others. The majority are good and courteous but the ones that aren't stand out. If you don't ride often there are some aspects of road cycling that you might not be aware of. For example, riding as far right as is safe is something cyclists should do and most do ride as far right as possible. There are times and roads where as far right as safe is the middle of the road. If you have gutter sewers you can't ride over them with a 23mm wheel. You also can't ride with road debris that car tires can handle. The tires aren't made to handle that kind of debris and in the spring, after all the winter snow melts and before the rain has a chance to clean it out, you very well might not be able to ride too close to the side of the road.

There is also the safety aspect of taking the lane when necessary. If you are on winding roads where it is unsafe to be passed you have to take the lane from time to time to keep a car from trying to speed past you on a blind turn.

The courteous thing to do is move over to the side when it is safe to do so but stopping every time there are cars behind you is a non-starter and there are no laws to my knowledge that necessitates that. Outside of specific laws that grant different rules to cyclists than cars (like an Idaho stop) cyclists should obey the laws. If they go through a stop sign and a police officer sees them they should get a ticket just like a driver that goes through a stop sign.

The vast majority of cyclists are just out there trying to use the road as safely as possible and aren't trying to hold anyone up. The reality of physics means they can only go so fast and can only move over when the road conditions allow for it. Patience from everyone is needed. If it is not safe to pass a cyclist for a few miles that means you don't do it. If it means the cyclist needs to move over when it is safe and stop in line at lights that is what they need to do.

 

[Klayfish]

I'll agree that most cyclists I encounter are courteous. But then there's always the knucklehead that thinks they're a car. Ride smack in the middle of the lane, no matter what. Pull up behind another car at a red light, as if they were a car. When light turns green, start riding in the center of the lane...and cause a huge back up.

Then again, there are car drivers who do that too. Go 55mph in the left lane.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

A farmer can pull over in places a cyclist can not. Period (I can play this game as well).

Traffic can make anyone late. Traffic in the Denver/Boulder area has increased greatly over the past 10 years. We've just learned to add time to our commute. It has nothing to do with cyclists on the road. Many cyclists who commute know where the bike lanes and paths are located and will take those and avoid streets without bike lanes. You cannot tell me that if you have a ten-mile commute a cyclist is going to stay in front of you for miles without you being able to pass safely or them turning somewhere.

You will give additional space whenever necessary? What does that even mean?

One more time on the diesel pump thing - it has nothing to do with being courteous or not paying attention. It's that people DO NOT KNOW that the green pump is the diesel pump. I just learned that a few years ago and I'm 53! A friend was complaining about the exact same thing you are and every one of us looked at him and said we had know idea that the green pump was for diesel.

As I stated earlier, I prefer to do most of my riding in the basement now. When I do ride it will be in bike-friendly areas between my home north of Denver and in Boulder. I am not going to ride in Weld County because frankly many of the drivers have the same attitude as you - even if a cyclist is in a bike lane. There were several cyclists killed on the roads here last year. All were due to the drivers not paying attention or were drunk when they hit the cyclist. One driver claimed the cyclist crossed over in front of him before making a left turn. However, that was proven false in court.

Once again, I am not denying that there are cyclists who are problems and I have even said what the heck are you doing? Maybe it's a difference where we live because I don't see the huge issues that you do.

No, you can’t play that game. I have both ridden bicycles and and operated farm equipment. The notion that it’s somehow easier to make space for faster vehicles on a tractor than it is on a bike is completely ridiculous. Stopping a tractor basically qualifies as an event in comparison, even more so when dealing with implementations.

As for the space, that should be pretty self explanatory. I’m not going to tailgate you, nor clip you with a mirror when pulling around.

And to be clear, I have no attitude toward cyclists. I have an attitude toward RUDE cyclists. Thankfully, while they’ve exceeded the 2% suggested earlier, they are still very much in the minority. And to be clear, I would never treat my car as a weapon, even to the absolute worst case scenario cyclist.

 

[BrianL]

Wow, this is so crazy. I know a lot of people feel that any environmentally friendly act though is somehow "un-American" or just wrong in some way. They feel threatened by a changing world I guess. I have tried to eliminate some plastic waste on my own, and I get accused of it. It's really weird.

As for pick-up trucks and such, I totally get if someone likes to drive them, but I don't really understand those who buy a big truck and never actually use it as one. Haul something in that payload, buddy! That's what it's for.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Cyclist are much like drivers, some are better and more courteous than others. The majority are good and courteous but the ones that aren't stand out. If you don't ride often there are some aspects of road cycling that you might not be aware of. For example, riding as far right as is safe is something cyclists should do and most do ride as far right as possible. There are times and roads where as far right as safe is the middle of the road. If you have gutter sewers you can't ride over them with a 23mm wheel. You also can't ride with road debris that car tires can handle. The tires aren't made to handle that kind of debris and in the spring, after all the winter snow melts and before the rain has a chance to clean it out, you very well might not be able to ride too close to the side of the road.

There is also the safety aspect of taking the lane when necessary. If you are on winding roads where it is unsafe to be passed you have to take the lane from time to time to keep a car from trying to speed past you on a blind turn.

The courteous thing to do is move over to the side when it is safe to do so but stopping every time there are cars behind you is a non-starter and there are no laws to my knowledge that necessitates that. Outside of specific laws that grant different rules to cyclists than cars (like an Idaho stop) cyclists should obey the laws. If they go through a stop sign and a police officer sees them they should get a ticket just like a driver that goes through a stop sign.

The vast majority of cyclists are just out there trying to use the road as safely as possible and aren't trying to hold anyone up. The reality of physics means they can only go so fast and can only move over when the road conditions allow for it. Patience from everyone is needed. If it is not safe to pass a cyclist for a few miles that means you don't do it. If it means the cyclist needs to move over when it is safe and stop in line at lights that is what they need to do.

I don’t really take issue with any of this. To be clear, I’m not suggesting a bike immediately pull over & stop the second a car approaches from the rear. Farmers don’t, either. They may get 3 or 4 cars behind them before pulling over (same for the mailman). Hopefully, there will be a clear spot at the next straight stretch & they’ll wave the car around without having to stop at all. I don’t think being stuck behind a bike for 1/2 a mile is unreasonable. Being stuck behind one for 2-3 miles with 20 other cars IS unreasonable, IMO.

 

[GreatLakes]

I'll agree that most cyclists I encounter are courteous. But then there's always the knucklehead that thinks they're a car. Ride smack in the middle of the lane, no matter what. Pull up behind another car at a red light, as if they were a car. When light turns green, start riding in the center of the lane...and cause a huge back up.

Then again, there are car drivers who do that too. Go 55mph in the left lane.

The bolded exactly the right thing to do. When you come up on a line of cars at a light you take your place in line. If you are 5th your stay 5th. The wrong thing to do is move over and pass the cars and the unsafe thing to do is be passed after the light turns green in the intersection. You also don't want to be over on the right approaching the intersection or in the intersection so cars don't turn right and not see you.

Once you are through the intersection it is right to ride as far right as is safe just like any other time but at the light and through the intersection the bolded above is 100% the right way to ride.

 

[bcla]

No, it won't. At all.

I'm just saying that having the vehicle self-drive will be easier than eliminating humans from having ultimate responsibility for the proper delivery of a load.

 

[bcla]

The technology for truly self driving cars is making progress. However, the infrastructure to support them has such an amazingly long way to go. Not just charging stations, but roads, etc... Self driving cars would need the ability to talk to each other...all of them. I'd be skeptical that truck drivers, cabbies or other drivers will be obsolete in 20 years, if ever.

I've been looking to change jobs and one of the companies I've talked to does self-driving technology. There are literally dozens of companies that are working on this around the world, although Google (Waymo) and Uber are the big names in the US.

I can't necessarily go into detail about stuff where I signed an NDA, but publicly available information is that several of these companies are starting with specific routes for self-driving buses where there won't be a lot of traffic. Right now they really need to be individually tailored to the environment where they're driven. At least in the US, drivers tend to follow traffic laws, and cutting off other drivers happens but is relatively rare. Now try doing this in Asia or Europe where fighting for a lane is a bloodsport. One company apparently is starting with a relatively easy use with things such as university/corporate shuttles where it's close to being a closed course, or at least where they're not dealing with ridiculous amounts of traffic.

 

[bcla]

I don't think it's a "crazy" reason, unless the electric charging stations/parking spots are in the back of the lot. I can't say I have much experience with charging stations, but our local Whole Foods has them. They are right up front, next to the handicapped parking. Why should the best general parking be reserved for electric vehicles? It just fits in with the smug and pretentious attitude associated, fairly or not, with drivers of EVs. Now, this doesn't impact my life--I've shopped at Whole Foods a total of once, no intention of going back. But I can understand how this would grate on college kids--especially if parking is at a premium, which it's been on every college campus I've been on.

It's the business's choice where they place them. On top of that, a lot of businesses subsidize those charging stations for their customers with 1 or 2 free hours of charging.

By law there are laws/regulations around where disabled parking spaces are placed and how many. Electric charging is not specifically regulated like that. But obviously the businesses want to place those in a prominent location where people will actually see them and use them. They might even be placed there as an inventive for people to consider electric vehicles knowing that there will be places to charge them.

 

[bcla]

As a cyclist who rode over 2,000 miles outside in 2018 I do agree that there are some cyclists who act like fools (I refuse to use your term). However, 98% of cyclists follow the laws and ride safe because the vehicle will always win.

I used to ride my bike a lot and at least in my area I wouldn't agree that 98% of cyclists follow the laws. I see very little signaling turns, stopping at stop signs, riding down the center of lanes blocking faster traffic. As a driver I've nearly run over cyclists who cut me off, including a couple who blew through a stop sign on my right, and turning left as I was attempting to make a right turn. Even in states that allow cyclists to treat stop signs as yield, that's illegal.

It was a long time ago, but I remember going on rides where I was uncomfortable blowing through stop signs in a tight paceline. One time there was a police cruiser stopped right next to a stop sign, and the president of our college cycling club was leading the group. He specifically shouted out before getting to that stop sign that every rider had to put one foot down at the stop sign. But otherwise there was a ton of stopping at signs.

 

[bcla]

I did state (and you quoted) that those blocking diesel pumps are probably just not paying as much attention as they should.

Depends on how it's set up. I haven't seen a solo diesel pump at a regular gas station in years, but I suppose they're still common at truck stops. I remember when there might be one single-sided pump located maybe where there was air and water. I use a small gas station where the prices are really cheap, and they have a single island (2 double-sided pumps) where all the pumps are dual gasoline and diesel. Some stations might have one island (of two) where the pumps have gas/diesel together.

But I agree with other posters here. They're just pumps. If someone finds one that's open and/or convenient, there's no special duty to make sure they're available for diesel users. The large majority of the use of such pumps is going to be for dispensing gasoline anyways.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Depends on how it's set up. I haven't seen a solo diesel pump at a regular gas station in years, but I suppose they're still common at truck stops. I remember when there might be one single-sided pump located maybe where there was air and water. I use a small gas station where the prices are really cheap, and they have a single island (2 double-sided pumps) where all the pumps are dual gasoline and diesel. Some stations might have one island (of two) where the pumps have gas/diesel together.

But I agree with other posters here. They're just pumps. If someone finds one that's open and/or convenient, there's no special duty to make sure they're available for diesel users. The large majority of the use of such pumps is going to be for dispensing gasoline anyways.

I think I've only seen diesel only pumps (usually completely separated out) at high frequented truck stop areas and some older gas stations that haven't been redone recently.

But most of the ones I've seen are set up that I've personally seen are with Diesel, Ethanol-free with a different pump but still on the same actual spot as 87, 89, 93 (edited: or 91) which then has its own pump. Sometimes it's just Diesel, 87,89,93 (edited: or 91) without the Ethanol-free option.

Like this is the Murphy gas station (Wal-Mart) by my house:


All the pumps at that Murphy gas station are like that thus no one is blocking anyone.

But I do understand what the PP was talking about when there's just one or two Diesel pumps. But honestly at the same time if that pump is open and others weren't at the time I can understand why someone would use that pump. That exact situation reminds me of Costco where people don't realize that the pumps have extenders and thus you can go on a pump that is opposite of your tank--enough times though a line builds behind cars who don't realize this---I pull on through and use the extender if need be Hopefully though the gas stations that only have 1 or 2 Diesel pumps call those out clearly so people can more see that because honestly I don't spend much time looking over what the other pumps at the gas station look like

 

[Klayfish]

Speaking of gas pumps, can you believe I paid just $1.85/gallon yesterday. Wow!!! I can't remember last time it was that cheap.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Speaking of gas pumps, can you believe I paid just $1.85/gallon yesterday. Wow!!! I can't remember last time it was that cheap.

It's down into the 70s here though some are higher. I think my husband paid $1.71 not too long ago though I think that gas station is now around $1.74 and the Costco closest to us is like $1.76. It's for sure nice.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

I think I've only seen diesel only pumps (usually completely separated out) at high frequented truck stop areas and some older gas stations that haven't been redone recently.

But most of the ones I've seen are set up that I've personally seen are with Diesel, Ethanol-free with a different pump but still on the same actual spot as 87, 89, 93 which then has its own pump. Sometimes it's just Diesel, 87,89,93 without the Ethanol-free option.

Like this is the Murphy gas station (Wal-Mart) by my house:
View attachment 372942

All the pumps at that Murphy gas station are like that thus no one is blocking anyone.

But I do understand what the PP was talking about when there's just one or two Diesel pumps. But honestly at the same time if that pump is open and others weren't at the time I can understand why someone would use that pump. That exact situation reminds me of Costco where people don't realize that the pumps have extenders and thus you can go on a pump that is opposite of your tank--enough times though a line builds behind cars who don't realize this---I pull on through and use the extender if need be Hopefully though the gas stations that only have 1 or 2 Diesel pumps call those out clearly so people can more see that because honestly I don't spend much time looking over what the other pumps at the gas station look like

This is a pretty typical setup around here. It’s unusual to see just one or two diesel pumps here as diesel is very popular. But, friends in other areas whine about it all the time.

At the Murphy station here, the one that only has 2 of 20 is the E-85 pump. Current price $1.35(9).

 

[bcla]

This is a pretty typical setup around here. It’s unusual to see just one or two diesel pumps here as diesel is very popular. But, friends in other areas whine about it all the time.

At the Murphy station here, the one that only has 2 of 20 is the E-85 pump. Current price $1.35(9).

Here's a gas station that I've used. The near island shows no diesel. The far island has diesel available on all four sides. You can see the green hoses/handles on the left, where they aren't on the near pumps. That's not an unusual setup around here.

The photo isn't mine. I found it on Yelp.

Here's another setup near where I live:

This one has diesel on one double-sided pump, but no diesel on the pump on the same island.

 

[Klayfish]

This is a pretty typical setup around here. It’s unusual to see just one or two diesel pumps here as diesel is very popular. But, friends in other areas whine about it all the time.

At the Murphy station here, the one that only has 2 of 20 is the E-85 pump. Current price $1.35(9).

Wait, you're paying $1.35/gallon for 87 regular unleaded??

 

[bcla]

Wait, you're paying $1.35/gallon for 87 regular unleaded??

I thought it said E85. Found this showing E85 prices around the country.

https://e85prices.com

 

[Gumbo4x4]

I thought it said E85. Found this showing E85 prices around the country.

https://e85prices.com

Correct. $1.35 is for E-85
$1.73 for 87 octane

 

[msjprincess]

Wow, regular is about $2.30 near me.