just back, ettiquete questions

[mb1234]

Wow - I have to say it always amazes me at how fired up people get responding to message boards. When I read the post, I didn't think that he was being overly rude or saying that people are required to offer everyone in his family seats, just that he was surprised that no one did. I could be misinterpreting, but here are my two cents.
We just returned from our first trip since 2004 this May, and overall, I thought that Disney was a much more difficult place to travel too than in the past. The common courtesies of the past seem to be much fewer and further between and everyone in our party was dissappointed because that really adds to the appeal of Disney and the best experience of that type of environment. We went with our 11 month old son (whether that was right or not, I know gets discussed to no end, but it was so that we were able to participate in a family reunion and I don't regret that decision!). I didn't expect preferential treatment because of having a child - there are tons of kids at Disney (as there should be!), but I was very disappointed at the overall mentality and attitude of the overwhelming majority of guests.
I notice a lot of posts describing difficulties that others may have, but I don't think for the most part, people question the difficulty of having any type of disability, visible or not, but it would also surprise me if every single person on a bus was in that situation. And as for all of the angry people saying to wait for a less crowded bus, we ended up in a situation where our resort was in the middle of the bus line, so that was impossible for a Magic Kingdom bus. Our worst bus experience of the trip (thankfully it only happened once) was when we got onto a bus, not knowing how full it was...before we could have had an opportunity to get off the bus speeds away from the bus stop. I have to say I was very surprised at how long it took for someone to offer their seat to my Mom who was holding my son. I'm not saying that it should be required, but I do think that the spirit of the action means much more than the actual seat. We had 7 adults in our party and often got up to offer our seats for everyone but the person holding my son. At the risk of sounding naive, I just think that it would be nice if people could be more supportive, which would probably lead to better understanding, than automatically responding with anger.
As for the parades, I'm thinking that I won't even try with those anymore, everything we tried still resulted in a frustrating experience - those are CRAZY crowded!! I think next time we'll try for early November ;-)

 

[ntikos]

I am a 62 year old very able bodied woman. When I get on a bus after a very long day I know I have to assess the situation. If I am boarding a very crowded bus I know I have a decision to make. I can get on the bus and stand or wait for the next one and have a seat. If I board a crowded bus I don't expect anyone of any age to give me their seat. If for some reason I don't feel standing is an option for me and I have waited for the next bus I don't feel I should give up my seat to anyone who made the choice to board the bus that was crowded and not wait for the next one.

It's very simple everyone has the choice to get on the bus that is there or if that bus doesn't fit their needs they can wait for the next bus.

This is the proper attitude! Thank you!

If you get onto a bus with no seat available with the expectation that you will get special treament for whatever reason - you will feel that you are entitled to a seat. In your mind, that seat that I am now sitting on is really yours and you now feel that I am "rude" for sitting in your seat. If I do offer you my seat you're really not that appreciative since you felt it was really your seat to begin with. BAD KARMA.

Now - if a person comes onto a loaded bus with no expectation of being treated special and somebody does offer their seat out of chivalry or "kindness", in your mind you have been given a "gift" by a total stranger and both of you benefit from that act. GOOD KARMA.

btw - As a 42 year old male - If I have a seat on a crowded bus I will seek out the elderly women or the desperate mother with 2 kids clinging on her to offer my seat to. I've also trained my 13 year old son to do the same. It's mostly for selfish reasons, because the feeling you get by helping somebody outweighs the tired feet. I generally can tell however those that feel "entitled" to a seat vs. the more humble and appreciative riders.

 

[kaytieeldr]

And as for all of the angry people saying to wait for a less crowded bus, we ended up in a situation where our resort was in the middle of the bus line, so that was impossible for a Magic Kingdom bus.

Angry???? Really?? All I see is realistic responses.
Since your resort was in the middle of the bus line, you would have had to have been staying at All Star Music. You could have walked to the All Star Sports bus stop. I'm not being critical and hindsight is 20/20, but sometimes we have to adjust our actions instead of expecting the world to adjust for us.

 

[disneyfan2kids]

I'm so amazed at the # of posts on here that say things like "Tough for you (elderly/kids/etc)... you don't get my seat I need it just as much as you!" and "you want a seat... wait for another bus!"

YET - so many of these posters have siggy's with things like "Spread the pixie dust!" in their signature lines...

I suppose the pixie dust spreading only applies with it's being thrown in YOUR direction hunh?!

 

[mb1234]

You know, it's funny, for as much planning that I tried to do to make our trip go smoothly - we couldn't for the life of us remember the order of the buses. We were actually staying at the Boardwalk, and I think the way it could have been avoided was to go to the Swan to catch the bus there, but we always got confused about which bus went in which order and sometimes ended up catching the bus at the swan when really it went to the Boardwalk first. We had to laugh about it, I think the heat was frying our brains. I shouldn't have used the word angry - that's way more confrontational than I meant to be. I just think there are two seperate issues. People shouldn't feel like they are required or expected to give up a seat, I can just honestly say that I was surprised at the general attitude of the masses, very me first - which I guess we should be used to by now! That being said, we met some wonderful families along the way - and I didn't expect anyone to give up their seat - I'm used to carrying lots of stuff, I can hold my son on a moving bus, I just was a little surprised that we had too. And that being said, someone did end up letting my Mom sit, which was very generous!

 

[mrbghd]

As to the first part, some people are just jerks. As for the giving up a bus seat issue my take is this: I will gladly give up a seat to an elderly person, or a person that has an apparrent difficulty. I will not give up my seat for a physically capable female (welcome to equality) nor will I give up my seat to a family with kids. If the family wants seats they can wait for the next bus and get on it. I am sorry but "my kids are tired" is not a reason for me to give up a seat to you and yours.

 

[LovesHauntedMansion]

I haven't read all of the responses, but out of the ones that I did read the responses were that they thought that situation #1 was out-of-line. I do agree that the person did not have to respond to you rudely, but I think that they may have been misinformed. They may have honestly thought that no one would be able to sit there so they were saving you the trouble of waiting there then later on being asked to move by a CM. I would have said the same thing (but not rudely) if I thought that it was an illegal spot to stand for parades.

As far as situation #2 goes, I don't think that all males should automatically give their seats to all women. It depends on the situation. Unfortunately both parties involved don't know the other person's situation. When we go to the park, we are there from rope drop until they kick us out at night. Chances are you probably won't be getting a seat from any of us.

 

[MeanestMomEver]

Just to put a positive spin on it all...

When I see a gentleman offer his seat to anyone at all, he kind of becomes a prince in my eyes. I think, "wow, what a genteman. His wife is a lucky woman. I bet he is a great dad." etc. (LOL, when it's my husband, I am kind of proud of him too but I sort of expect it so there isn't that wow factor.)

And if I see a little boy or a teen offer his seat, well, I am trying to hide my tears and I think, "What great parents he has!"

And to the poster who remarked you'd never see a woman or child standing on a SOG bus, she's right. It's true. The whole atmoshere is different on those busses. I know this sounds corny, but I think the common experiences, hardships and losses bond you with other military families no matter where you are.

 

[stacyp9]

My two cents:

1. I think there was no problem with your family sitting in front of the planter people.

2. Parents that believe that their children cannot safely stand on a bus, should not get on a bus that is standing room only. People in the seats may have gotten them by skipping a bus so that they could have a seat.

 

[sabrecmc]

I don't expect anyone to give up their seats on the bus to me or my 4 year old. Everyone is tired. If I feel it isn't safe for her to ride standing up, we'll wait.

On the other hand, one thing that drives me batty is when a young child (say 3 or 4) is in a seat to themselves next to the parent when the bus is standing room only. Put that child in your lap! Ok, that's my grumble...now feel free to tell my that child is as entitled to their own seat as much as anyone else...

 

[dzorn]

I'm so amazed at the # of posts on here that say things like "Tough for you (elderly/kids/etc)... you don't get my seat I need it just as much as you!" and "you want a seat... wait for another bus!"

YET - so many of these posters have siggy's with things like "Spread the pixie dust!" in their signature lines...

I suppose the pixie dust spreading only applies with it's being thrown in YOUR direction hunh?!

Not necessarily. Even though we often wait for busses and never expect others to give up seats. DH often does or even put the DD on our laps(thought they are getting pretty big for that) if we are sitting. I will occasionally if my hip is not huring to bad. We wait if we need a seat. Realistically you are responsible for your choices including getting on a crowded bus, that does not mean that somone may choose to give up their seat. You should not expect it. It is not selfish to not give up your own seat it is selfish of the other person to expect it.

Denise in MI

 

[disneyfan2kids]

Just to put a positive spin on it all...

When I see a gentleman offer his seat to anyone at all, he kind of becomes a prince in my eyes. I think, "wow, what a genteman. His wife is a lucky woman. I bet he is a great dad." etc. (LOL, when it's my husband, I am kind of proud of him too but I sort of expect it so there isn't that wow factor.)

And if I see a little boy or a teen offer his seat, well, I am trying to hide my tears and I think, "What great parents he has!"

And to the poster who remarked you'd never see a woman or child standing on a SOG bus, she's right. It's true. The whole atmoshere is different on those busses. I know this sounds corny, but I think the common experiences, hardships and losses bond you with other military families no matter where you are.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I think Disney needs to ask the family members to stand in line with all the other patrons, and when the family arrives at the door to the bus, then the person in the wheel chair can get loaded. Another option is allow one person to board the bus with the person in the scooter/wheelchair. I am not sure I understand why being in a scooter jumps you to the front of the line.

Being in a device that needs to be tied down for the safety of everyone on the bus 'jumps the occupant to the front of the line' for simple logistic reasons - it's easier for everyone to get the wheelchair/ecv on the bus and secured while the bus is empty.

As for the rest of your valid issue: Walt Disney World's official policy is, just as with attractions, the wheelchair/ecv Guest may be accompanied aboard the bus by up to five members of their party. All other members of their party must get in the regular line and board in turn.

Any Guest observing any different practice should note the bus number, driver's name if possible, time, location, bus destination - as much identifying information as possible - and notify Front Desk Management at your respective resorts. The only way officials will know there are legitimate problems is if Guests report the problems.

See? No jumping - just information

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

A bus has to be pretty empty for me to sit. I remain standing until the bus is loaded. If there is an empty seat, I take it (it does happen ). Sure, I am tired at the end of the day and want to sit just like everyone else, but I consider it an act of kindness that costs me nothing and makes me feel a little better about myself when we pull into the resort. 20 minutes or less standing for that warm feeling -

 

[rocio]

We had plenty of experience with crowded buses on our trip this May. We also had plenty of experience with emptier buses and seats for all. Some people were nice and offered us seats and sometimes they didn't. Either way was fine. We had our 6yo daughter and 3yo twins and they were pretty adept and holding on. In fact, they loved it! There were times they wanted to stand and hold on and they didn't need to and we declined seat offers. I think we only took the seats when we had a child asleep. They knew where to hold on and felt so grown up to do it.

I just had to comment about the waiting for another bus to get a seat. One night pretty late, we were on a very crowded Epcot bus and the busdriver was hilarious. She was joking with us that she didn't understand the people that wait for another bus. She said (to paraphrase), "Do they know they are waiting 20 minutes STANDING up just to get a seat for a 10 minute ride back to the resort. You'll be in your room and in bed before they even get on a bus and get a seat." Totally put in perspective for us. Of course, this wouldn't work if you're worried about safety issues, but if you're waiting for a seat because you're tired, it's something to think about.

In some ways, it was nice to have the kids standing on the way back to our resort as they were less likely to fall asleep and have to figure out how to carry all three of them out of the bus (and the stroller) with only two adults. As long as we could keep one awake, we were good.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

I give up my seat for "little" children. any 8 year old who can't balance on a moving bus needs to step away from the x-box and get on the playground more often. but bless you anyways.

I'm 30 years old, and cannot balance well on a moving bus. I have a muscle disorder that you cannot see by looking at me. I'm fine with standing, honestly, but step on a LOT of feet when I get jostled around, which is pretty much every day on the NYC subway I take to work.

 

[Cheshire Figment]

Scooters/wheelchairs - I am probably going to get jumped for this but here goes. After EMH at MK, we found our way to our bus line, and waited our turn. 2 buses came and went, and we were the third family in line to get on the next one. There was no one in the wheelchair line until about 2 minutes before the bus arrived. Once it did, the driver and CM member loaded not only the people in the scooters, but ALL the family members that were with them, which took up more than half the seats on the bus.

I think Disney needs to ask the family members to stand in line with all the other patrons, and when the family arrives at the door to the bus, then the person in the wheel chair can get loaded. Another option is allow one person to board the bus with the person in the scooter/wheelchair. I am not sure I understand why being in a scooter jumps you to the front of the line.

As an ECV user if I do use a bus I will tell the driver how many people are actually with me. I have seen, and others I know have also seen, total strangers come up to join the ECV/wheelchair party to be able to get on the bus ahead of the people in line.

 

[disneyfan2kids]

Not necessarily. Even though we often wait for busses and never expect others to give up seats. DH often does or even put the DD on our laps(thought they are getting pretty big for that) if we are sitting. I will occasionally if my hip is not huring to bad. We wait if we need a seat. Realistically you are responsible for your choices including getting on a crowded bus, that does not mean that somone may choose to give up their seat. You should not expect it. It is not selfish to not give up your own seat it is selfish of the other person to expect it.

Denise in MI

The only people I "expect" it from are married to me or those that I gave birth to

I don't "expect" it...as I said, I deny if offered... but will also think differently of those that "offered" vs those that did not. And to echo a previous poster, my thoughts are typically - "what a gentleman! What a lucky wife he has!"

To each his own... I'll continue to offer, as will my husband and kids. It's all about the pixie dust.

When in this situation - We (my family) don't analyze "who is more deserving? who needs it more? who is most impaired?" We simply offer our seat out of the kindness of our heart.

If, in others' eyes, that makes us "pushovers"...so be it... because in my eyes, it simply makes me proud of my DH and my little "men."

 

[DisneyMim]

Here we go again. As for the parade situation, no you didn't do anything wrong, the people were being unreasonable, but this is the reason we don't ever wait for parades anymore. We are sick of waiting for over an hour just to have people push and shove their way in front of us or "just want their kids to see". Well, you should have been there earlier. I also hate people who put their kids on their shoulders. The block everyone even though they want to believe they are not.

As for the bus.....I grew up in a major city using public transportation every day. I would never give up my seat for a child. Most times people aren't even looking around they are so tired. We ALWAYS rent a car and don't use the Disney buses for that reason. The times I have used them I always seem to have to stand. My husband knows Disney so well that he can get us from one point to another much more quickly than a bus. I think it depends where you are coming from. Some people who don't use public transportation much think they they are entitled to a seat, but in reality you are not. My family would always give up a seat for an elderly person or someone who needs it, but a child, no. I have fibromyalgia and although I do not LOOK like I need a seat, standing on a bus (or monorail) is very difficult for me. And that is another side of the story, don't be too quick to judge people. Most kids have more energy than adults. If you want a seat for your child I would suggest to not wait until closing to leave a park. Much too crowded.

 

[kamik86]

As a woman I don't know why some expect men to offer them a seat. I can stand perfectly fine, my husband would stand before me but that is becasue he has better balance... he is weird and actually finds standing kind of fun!

In Oct. I'm taking a trip with extended family and there is a understood order of taking seats for our party of 9 (Mom sits first as bad knees make it hard to balance, Dad or my sister with a bad back next, then pretty much anyone else as by that point we are all able bodied and between the ages of 8 and 40 so we can stand gender plays no part in this)

I would personally never even think about offering my seat to a child on the bus, espeically one over 4 or 5. Heck when I was that age we used to like standing on the school bus and thought that was fun... and then we had seats and were being told to sit! Pregnant, Elderly, handicapped, or carrying a baby I would get up for though.