Help DIS Homeschoolers Help me convince my DH

[noodleknitter]

Again, at some point, your kids are going to have to join the world, and you won't be able to control every minute of every day.

Why do you have so little faith in your kids that they would choose the right path?

My kids are out in the real world everyday. They deal with real people everyday. Just not 30 other 12 year olds. Kids learn many skills in dealing with life and its choices. They know more, and can make more informed choices at 16 than they can at 13. Pretty simple logic.

I hope your faith in yours proves true, and you don't wind up in an ofc. like mine wondering how your sweet child went wrong.

 

[jodifla]

My kids are out in the real world everyday. They deal with real people everyday. Just not 30 other 12 year olds. Kids learn many skills in dealing with life and its choices. They know more, and can make more informed choices at 16 than they can at 13. Pretty simple logic.

I hope your faith in yours proves true, and you don't wind up in an ofc. like mine wondering how your sweet child went wrong.

My DS is a preschooler, so I doubt we'll be in an office like yours anytime soon.

It sounds like your job has jaded you pretty severely. You think because some kids in PS need your help, most PS kids are really screwed up. The logic doesn't follow. I imagine there are plenty of homeschooled kids who could use counseling, but they don't have any opportunities to get it.

 

[KJMAX1]

Any person who thinks schools arent filled with drugs, and sex are blinded and not looking at the real world. The national average to try smoking was 5th grade. The average for pot was 6th, as was oral sex because most kids think you cant get pregnant from it so why not. However, you can get AIDS, and other STDs. Also, if you think that kids arent doing these things or being offered these things then you ought to be in foster care. I am a trained foster care professional as well as educator. I have over 300 hours of training and experience. I cannot tell you how many babies addicted to drugs are born each and every day in our state (number nearing 2,000) to teens. In fact I just had a 12 year old girl give birth a few weeks ago. Some kids can handle public school, they are strong, have strong opinions, but there are those like my daughter who trusts everyone because she has a good heart. However, the tone on this board is that we are abusing our children for making the choice to homeschool. We live in America with freedom for all, even those who choose homeschooling.

 

[noodleknitter]

I still hope your little guy makes it.

You call it jaded, I call it realistic. The older you are, the more life skills you have, the better decisions you can make. As I said earlier, seems like pretty strong logic.

This is all beside the fact that my kids are getting/have received a better education than they would have received in the PS. For us, and all of the families I know, it is working.

 

[KJMAX1]

My DS is a preschooler, so I doubt we'll be in an office like yours anytime soon.

It sounds like your job has jaded you pretty severely. You think because some kids in PS need your help, most PS kids are really screwed up. The logic doesn't follow. I imagine there are plenty of homeschooled kids who could use counseling, but they don't have any opportunities to get it.

OK I am going to get personal on this one. You have continued to resort to personal attacks on each and every poster regarding homeschooling. Its easy for you to sit back behind your computer, spewing trash about how bad homeschooling is when you have a preschooler. Well just wait...When your kid is in HS and dealing with all the issues of drugs, guns, gang, sex, and worse then Id love to hear what you have to say. I highly doubt youve worked in a public school, or spent any great amount of time in one. We have been called control freaks, our kids have been called retarded, ignorant, pompous, just come out and say it, you want to call us all bigots, and the Christian right. Well guess what....My choice had NOTHING to do with your secular humanism, or your left wing radical self righteous pompous ignorant homeschoolaphobic attitude! You may fear us, and the one reason I see that fear is because you have to defend your public schools. Homeschooling is growing by numbers so scary to the public education system that they have closed 9 schools in one district here because they arent getting enough funding. They have created homeschool public school here, and its guess what, its growing! The day parents can pick any school no matter what type of school it is I say FINALLY we have equality. If I want my kid to go to a school where they have teachers of all walks of life, or a school with nuns, it will be a great relief for my children to no longer be slaves to an outdated, system of education. We are no longer leaders in this world, we are followers in education. You think the world looks at us any longer as a leading nation in education?! They LAUGH. Why dont you prove how great your schools are....Lets see you post some statistics....Or better yet, show me one article that praises how fantastic our public school system is and how our kids are so smart. You claim that the public school is SOOOOO wonderful tell us your experience...Tell us how you know this.....Are you a teacher? Do you have a kid in public school?? Are you working for a public school? Probably not....you're just some liberal, closed minded homeschoolaphobe. So while you sit behind your little computer screen surfing the net, while you think your preschooler is happily playing at his preschool, just remember one day you too will have an adult child...I really hope your child is as strong and as open minded as you really think he will be...Oh yeah...and he wont do a single thing wrong.

 

[noodleknitter]

KJMAX, don't let folks take away your tiggerific mental attitude. The world is too full of people who want to rain on other's parades! They have a need to put others down to see themselves in the right.

People who aren't involved don't understand HSing. I was wretched to my family when they were doing it in the 80's. I was close-minded and as a Psychologist believed I knew more than any parent what was best for their kid!

Take care!

eta: Not meaning to sound bossy, just concerned!

 

[jodifla]

OK I am going to get personal on this one. You have continued to resort to personal attacks on each and every poster regarding homeschooling. Its easy for you to sit back behind your computer, spewing trash about how bad homeschooling is when you have a preschooler. Well just wait...When your kid is in HS and dealing with all the issues of drugs, guns, gang, sex, and worse then Id love to hear what you have to say. I highly doubt youve worked in a public school, or spent any great amount of time in one. We have been called control freaks, our kids have been called retarded, ignorant, pompous, just come out and say it, you want to call us all bigots, and the Christian right. Well guess what....My choice had NOTHING to do with your secular humanism, or your left wing radical self righteous pompous ignorant homeschoolaphobic attitude! You may fear us, and the one reason I see that fear is because you have to defend your public schools. Homeschooling is growing by numbers so scary to the public education system that they have closed 9 schools in one district here because they arent getting enough funding. They have created homeschool public school here, and its guess what, its growing! The day parents can pick any school no matter what type of school it is I say FINALLY we have equality. If I want my kid to go to a school where they have teachers of all walks of life, or a school with nuns, it will be a great relief for my children to no longer be slaves to an outdated, system of education. We are no longer leaders in this world, we are followers in education. You think the world looks at us any longer as a leading nation in education?! They LAUGH. Why dont you prove how great your schools are....Lets see you post some statistics....Or better yet, show me one article that praises how fantastic our public school system is and how our kids are so smart. You claim that the public school is SOOOOO wonderful tell us your experience...Tell us how you know this.....Are you a teacher? Do you have a kid in public school?? Are you working for a public school? Probably not....you're just some liberal, closed minded homeschoolaphobe. So while you sit behind your little computer screen surfing the net, while you think your preschooler is happily playing at his preschool, just remember one day you too will have an adult child...I really hope your child is as strong and as open minded as you really think he will be...Oh yeah...and he wont do a single thing wrong.

What "trash" have I "spewed" exactly? I have called no child ignorant, pompous or retarded, and wouldn't dream of it. I don't feel I've called anyone names, though I was snarky toward the poster who claimed he/she could teach any subject.

I am not a teacher, but my son is in a public preschool. We live in a not-great public school district. I put my son in this year, but we will probably send him to the pre-K neighboring school district, which is great, next year. When kindergarten comes, we'll evaluate our options. Maybe public, maybe private. I don't see us homeschooling, because I don't think it would be the best fit for us.

Their are certainly failing school systems (like the district we live in.) And there are really good ones, like the ones around us.

When I read through these posters, it's the homeschoolers who are the ones calling folks names. Any mention that homeschooling isn't perfect for every kid gets screamed down.

 

[Maybelle]

You make many good points. But underlying this all, you are a teacher by experience and trade, and that's going to make a difference. It's not like someone picking up a manual and teaching kids without any background on the educational process or the subject.

So while you may be well qualified to teach, it's not a stretch to think that lots of homeschooling parents whose main desire is to keep their kids from all us secular humanists out there have no business teaching their kids.

Of course they have a business teaching their kids....they are THEIR kids!!!!!, not yours, and not belonging to the public at large. Unlike a great number of people now-a-days, there are still some of us that believe it DOES NOT take a village. Instead, it takes a loving family looking out for the best interest of their beloved offspring, and doing what THEY feel is best for them.

By the way, just one quick point...

Statistics show homeschoolers doing better than the general ps student population on standardized tests of achievement. I wonder how many of the parents of these tested homeschool students have teaching degrees??

Do some research.

 

[KJMAX1]

What "trash" have I "spewed" exactly? I have called no child ignorant, pompous or retarded, and wouldn't dream of it. I don't feel I've called anyone names, though I was snarky toward the poster who claimed he/she could teach any subject.

I am not a teacher, but my son is in a public preschool. We live in a not-great public school district. I put my son in this year, but we will probably send him to the pre-K neighboring school district, which is great, next year. When kindergarten comes, we'll evaluate our options. Maybe public, maybe private. I don't see us homeschooling, because I don't think it would be the best fit for us.

Their are certainly failing school systems (like the district we live in.) And there are really good ones, like the ones around us.

When I read through these posters, it's the homeschoolers who are the ones calling folks names. Any mention that homeschooling isn't perfect for every kid gets screamed down.

Thanks for your response and I applaud your investigation into your child's future. However, our kids have been called retarded among other things and its on page 3 I believe. Maybe it wasnt you, I apologize if it wasnt. The underlying tone of the non-homeschoolers on here has been horrible. Some public school bashers have been as well, but it seems its more anti-homeschool. However, I think every parent should have the right to choose an education they think is best. That being said, no one should be put down for making that decision.

 

[Maybelle]

I hope it's ok to post these links relevant to standardized test results for homeschooled kids vs. PS kids. I know someone will tell me if it's not ok!

For those interested...check out these links...

http://www.geocities.com/nelstomlinson/research.bibliography.html

http://eric.uoregon.edu/publications/digests/digest151.html
(great article...scroll down to the section on academics and socilization if you don't want to take the time to read it all. Also good infor on educational status of homeschool parents.)

http://www.highschoolscience.com/conf/why_high_aus.pdf
(nice info on why to continue to homeschool into hish school.)

http://www.ericdigests.org/2000-3/home.htm

 

[hsmamato2]

Actually,jodifla, you did get personal a number of times, to a lot of people. And the 1st personal attack was,not you, about post #3,(can't remember exactly) which talked about some story about a sad kid alone crying at a fence,and his horrible parents who were keeping him from the joys of public schools,at which point you and some others jumped on the 'bash another persons lifestyle' bandwagon.
Yes, we homeschoolers got defensive, but not because we just love to argue, but because here,on our beloved boards, we were personally attacked as creating a terrible way of life for our kids.
Would you (or anyone else here who has an issue with anyone defending their life choices)feel ok with it if some here started a thread entitled" going to public school is abusive?"
Saying derogatory things about something so personal is going to cause flared tempers,and accusing people of ignorance and pride or insinuating that I ,or others have posted shocking statements when I do believe that most were simply trying to share their viewpoint, ...
There is no need to argue, there's good and bad in all of our choices, that's just life! It really needs to be left at that- I do hope that anyone who truly thinks about homeschooling educates themselves on the subject,and gets to know other people who've done it. That's the only way to truly know.

 

[Mouse House Mama]

Any person who thinks schools arent filled with drugs, and sex are blinded and not looking at the real world. The national average to try smoking was 5th grade. The average for pot was 6th, as was oral sex because most kids think you cant get pregnant from it so why not. However, you can get AIDS, and other STDs. Also, if you think that kids arent doing these things or being offered these things then you ought to be in foster care. I am a trained foster care professional as well as educator. I have over 300 hours of training and experience. I cannot tell you how many babies addicted to drugs are born each and every day in our state (number nearing 2,000) to teens. In fact I just had a 12 year old girl give birth a few weeks ago. Some kids can handle public school, they are strong, have strong opinions, but there are those like my daughter who trusts everyone because she has a good heart. However, the tone on this board is that we are abusing our children for making the choice to homeschool. We live in America with freedom for all, even those who choose homeschooling.

Umm excuse me but you are very close minded and quite ridiculous here. Thanks for all the stats on sex, drugs, disease etc. The bottom line is that even if you HS your kids can still do all of the above. The only thing a parent can do is the best they know how and hope their kids make the right choice when these things present themselves. I pray everyday that my kids will be strong enough to say no to the things they don't believe in. It is MY JOB to give them the self esteem for this. So while I am not against HSing, if you think that by giving them their formal education at home is going to prevent them from ever being exposed to making hard choices then you are wrong. That is unless you never let them experience anything outside of your home. Also- nobody thinks you are abusing your children, but you in particular have certainly made it clear that if anyone's kids attend PS then they are horrible parents who are sure to have children who are engaing in sex parties and selling drugs! You want people to respect your choices but you don't respect anyone else's. I think there were alot of good points made here for both sides. I have said numerous times through this thread that each family has to make the right choice for their kids. You on the other hand have done nothing but bash anyone who doesn't agree with you. You get mad if people have real experiences with HSing that weren't positive. Well, not every HS kid is blossoming just like not every PS kid is blossoming. There will always be success stories and failures. I live in a great district. We have a great success rate. I also know people who HS, and I know people who homeschool one of their kids but not the other. No one way is perfect for everyone. From your posts I get the impression that you are an angry person who teaches your child that PS kids are bad news. Hey-if that's what you are doing that is your perrogative. They are your children. If I am wrong then please correct me. I just feel that you have an opportunity to tell others the good points of HSing like others here have but instead you seem hellbent on pointing out how horrible PS is! If you want respect then you have to give it too.

 

[KJMAX1]

Umm excuse me but you are very close minded and quite ridiculous here. Thanks for all the stats on sex, drugs, disease etc. The bottom line is that even if you HS your kids can still do all of the above. The only thing a parent can do is the best they know how and hope their kids make the right choice when these things present themselves. I pray everyday that my kids will be strong enough to say no to the things they don't believe in. It is MY JOB to give them the self esteem for this. So while I am not against HSing, if you think that by giving them their formal education at home is going to prevent them from ever being exposed to making hard choices then you are wrong. That is unless you never let them experience anything outside of your home. Also- nobody thinks you are abusing your children, but you in particular have certainly made it clear that if anyone's kids attend PS then they are horrible parents who are sure to have children who are engaing in sex parties and selling drugs! You want people to respect your choices but you don't respect anyone else's. I think there were alot of good points made here for both sides. I have said numerous times through this thread that each family has to make the right choice for their kids. You on the other hand have done nothing but bash anyone who doesn't agree with you. You get mad if people have real experiences with HSing that weren't positive. Well, not every HS kid is blossoming just like not every PS kid is blossoming. There will always be success stories and failures. I live in a great district. We have a great success rate. I also know people who HS, and I know people who homeschool one of their kids but not the other. No one way is perfect for everyone. From your posts I get the impression that you are an angry person who teaches your child that PS kids are bad news. Hey-if that's what you are doing that is your perrogative. They are your children. If I am wrong then please correct me. I just feel that you have an opportunity to tell others the good points of HSing like others here have but instead you seem hellbent on pointing out how horrible PS is! If you want respect then you have to give it too.

Um, the OP asked about how to make homeschooling work. I did that...The next thing I know this thread had turned into how bad homeschooling is for kids..Did she ask that? NO...She asked how can you make kids socialized. Then our kids were called stupid, retarded, and we were called ignorant, and self righteous. If you think I am hateful or angry then you dont know me..That is a fact. However, when you attack my kids, and all but call us abusers because we homeschool our kids then I get mad. People arent allowed to get mad anymore?? I sure know a lot of people getting mad on 9/11 when some people in the world didnt agree with our point of view of life. My best friend chose to send her son to Public School and he is with me every day because she works...My daughter uses the public school for certain activities, but you probably didnt read that. I dont know all the kids at public school, I know some....and some of them are great kids. However, that does not erase the growing decay in public schools. I dont gamble. Therefore Im not going to take a risk to find out if my daughters gets a good education or not...Im more of the preventative parent...you know, the ones who put plastic covers on the outlets...Id like to see MY bashing you claim of, Ive said that there are fantastic public school teachers. The problem is in the upper offices....My original post was nice and informative...I did not like being called ridiculous when I told them my daughter went to a co-op for socialization with friends, and to learn subjects I cannot teach. So it got personal via another post, and I will defend my kids, and our choice to homeschool. Sorry if you cant handle my defense, but I totally think name calling of children, or parents is horrible!

 

[KJMAX1]

Oh yeah, the public school we have up the street had a kindergarten kid bring a gun to school for a 6th grader for two weeks in a row! Maybe you heard about it on the news a year ago!

 

[noodleknitter]

So, OP, glad you brought up the subject? It gets nasty, for certain. People are mean hearted, and judgemental, and relatively clueless about the facts if they are not personally involved, and you will hear the worst of it.

OTOH, you can explain to your husband that children learn social skills at home. They practice them with others and it is a parent's job to make sure they learn the skills you want them to. Burping the "ABC's" as opposed to saying "please and thank you!" (An example from our lives!)

Homeschool groups, churches, scouts, 4-H, theatre and music groups, dance, karate, city soccer leagues, and the beloved neighborhood children all give a chance to play with others. Among a bagillion others!

If you have more than one HS group around, I would check them all out. The first group we visited was less diverse than the one we settled into, and another was irritatingly cliquish.

I have found homeschooling to be one of the most rewarding processes in my life. It isn't for everyone, but it can be a good life if you hit it right!

 

[sha_lyn]

I think the bigger question is why so many of you either HS or send your kids to private school. Why do you tolerate such a lousy public school system? Why are you not demanding reform?

Who says we aren't demanding reform? I fought with the PS for 3 yrs. I was tired of my son's education failing while I fought with the school. Basically what happened wasDS had a very rough yr (personally, deaths in the family, severe illness in the family, moving, new baby etc). The last week of school he got in trouble so the principal decided DS had ADHD. The ped evaluated DS that summer and said he did not have ADHD, he was mildly depressed over the death of 1 great grand mother and the stroke/illness of another. Well the principal was very upset the following yr when DS wasn't on Meds. I told him that the Ped wanted certain evaluations done by the school. The P told me that the school didn't test for ADHD, that any good Dr would just write the prescription to see if the meds did anything. Well P seemed to have forgotten the mom of one of DS's classmates was a psychologist with the school systems. She was the one who administered the test the P claimed that the school did not give. When I confronted him with the truth, he back peddled and claimed he just meant that they were so far behind that it would be better if I found a Dr that would go ahead and write a prescription. He even offered to get the name of a Dr for me. When I refused DS was basically labeled as untreated ADHD and I was labeled as an uncooperative uncaring parent.

Over the next 2 years the school system lost accreditation, the superintendent was fired and sued. It was found that many teachers had received promotions, pay raises etc when they were not qualified. The schools were very short of teachers, and DS's school was at 178% of capacity. A large number of kids who entered middle school from DS's elementary school went from AB honor roll to remedial classes.

I refused to keep DS in a broken system any longer. Why should I let his education suffer?

 

[FayeW]

Who says we aren't demanding reform? I fought with the PS for 3 yrs. I was tired of my son's education failing while I fought with the school. Basically what happened wasDS had a very rough yr (personally, deaths in the family, severe illness in the family, moving, new baby etc). The last week of school he got in trouble so the principal decided DS had ADHD. The ped evaluated DS that summer and said he did not have ADHD, he was mildly depressed over the death of 1 great grand mother and the stroke/illness of another. Well the principal was very upset the following yr when DS wasn't on Meds. I told him that the Ped wanted certain evaluations done by the school. The P told me that the school didn't test for ADHD, that any good Dr would just write the prescription to see if the meds did anything. Well P seemed to have forgotten the mom of one of DS's classmates was a psychologist with the school systems. She was the one who administered the test the P claimed that the school did not give. When I confronted him with the truth, he back peddled and claimed he just meant that they were so far behind that it would be better if I found a Dr that would go ahead and write a prescription. He even offered to get the name of a Dr for me. When I refused DS was basically labeled as untreated ADHD and I was labeled as an uncooperative uncaring parent.

Over the next 2 years the school system lost accreditation, the superintendent was fired and sued. It was found that many teachers had received promotions, pay raises etc when they were not qualified. The schools were very short of teachers, and DS's school was at 178% of capacity. A large number of kids who entered middle school from DS's elementary school went from AB honor roll to remedial classes.

I refused to keep DS in a broken system any longer. Why should I let his education suffer?

I completely agree. You did the only thing you could do. Regarding ADHD meds, the favorite refrains seems to be that the meds only works to treat ADHD, therefore, if it works, your child must have ADHD! Why then, is there such demand for Ritalin on the black market? My understanding, and please correct me if I'm wrong, is that teenagers/college students crush Ritalin tablets and snort it because it helps them concentrate better! Are we to believe that ALL of these people illicitely using this drug are undiagnosed ADHD patients??? My daughter takes Concerta (a time release form of Ritalin), and we are going through additional medical testing now because I suspect that she was misdiagnosed originally. Of course the ped. says no, because "it only works for ADHD!

 

[KJMAX1]

I completely agree. You did the only thing you could do. Regarding ADHD meds, the favorite refrains seems to be that the meds only works to treat ADHD, therefore, if it works, your child must have ADHD! Why then, is there such demand for Ritalin on the black market? My understanding, and please correct me if I'm wrong, is that teenagers/college students crush Ritalin tablets and snort it because it helps them concentrate better! Are we to believe that ALL of these people illicitely using this drug are undiagnosed ADHD patients??? My daughter takes Concerta (a time release form of Ritalin), and we are going through additional medical testing now because I suspect that she was misdiagnosed originally. Of course the ped. says no, because "it only works for ADHD!

Did you look into a brain scan? I read this recently in a book about ADHD and how sometimes its lack of being able to keep nutrients in a system and it looks like ADHD, and other times it is true ADHD where the brain is not activated fully as a normal functioning. This is why Ritalin, which is from the cocaine family works. If you ever had a child addicted at birth to cocaine most pediatricians will tell you not to place them on these drugs because it continues the addiction. However, it does work for kids with true ADHD but probably also those just wanting the effect. I recently saw on the local news a segment of these brains scans I read about. They said given certain testing tools while under the scan they can see if the brain becomes active or not in certain areas.

We too thought as well as the local public school teacher my daughter was ADHD. I took her to the peditrician and she refused to give me a prescription. She told me we needed more testing. We basically found out she has sensory integration disorder, and it affects her hearing, vision, and touch response. She is now in therapy through the local school, as well as private, but it became so bad that even the therapist said a classroom setting on a daily basis would not allow her to learn, hence why we came to the conclusion of homeschooling. Hope you find out whats going on and can help!


Forgot to mention we put DD on Omega Three DHA supplements and while it didnt take all of her behaviors away it really helped after a week. Evidently sometimes children can be missing this important nutrient in their systems. I bought the chewable capsules strawberry flavor at Whole Foods!

 

[Mouse House Mama]

I have to agree here with the PP's. I truly think so many kids are labeled ADHD falsely. It drives me crazy that the schools are so quick to medicate kids. Who are they to tell you that you have to medicate your child? When I went to school overactive kids (for lack of a better way to describe them) just learned things a little differently. The teacher had to adjust. Now of course if a child is a huge disruption to the class that is one thing but I still don't think meds are always the answer. That child may need services. The school should provide them. I know that not every district offers them but they should. JMHO.

 

[disneyjunkie]

I have to agree here with the PP's. I truly think so many kids are labeled ADHD falsely. It drives me crazy that the schools are so quick to medicate kids. Who are they to tell you that you have to medicate your child? When I went to school overactive kids (for lack of a better way to describe them) just learned things a little differently. The teacher had to adjust. Now of course if a child is a huge disruption to the class that is one thing but I still don't think meds are always the answer. That child may need services. The school should provide them. I know that not every district offers them but they should. JMHO.

School's can't take it upon themselves the medicate a child.

There's a long process that's required before a child can be medicated.