How to get out of Christmas--UPDATED OCT 1 page 5

[HarperLeigh]

No. We won't go. They have been so awful to my husband that getting all of us together is out of the question. Dh is done and I don't blame him one bit. If they suggest coffee somewhere on a day before the holiday, I'd go visit with the kids.

Why? Seriously, you, and especially your kids, deserve better. If you feel you must go, leave your kids out of it.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

Title says "Updated Oct 1" but I don't see anything????

 

[quandrea]

Title says "Updated Oct 1" but I don't see anything????

On page five I posted that I sent the email. No response yet.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

On page five I posted that I sent the email. No response yet.

Oh, well, when I came here, it took me to the end of the thread and I didn't see anything. Maybe put "page 5" after "update" would help.

 

[Mizzoufan]

On page five I posted that I sent the email. No response yet.

no news is good news right

 

[TipsyTraveler]

No. We won't go. They have been so awful to my husband that getting all of us together is out of the question. Dh is done and I don't blame him one bit. If they suggest coffee somewhere on a day before the holiday, I'd go visit with the kids.

Turn the tables here and think about it from your husband's perspective. How would you feel if someone treated you like garbage and not only did your husband want to maintain a relationship with that person, but he also fostered a relationship between that person and your children? Think about how you'd feel every time your family had to split up so he could take your children to visit with people who can't stand you. (Are they bad-mouthing you in front of your kids? How does that make your kids feel hearing someone say those things about their mom?)

You say they've been "so awful" to your husband. What is it teaching your children that you will continue to have a relationship with someone who treats their dad that way, and that they should have a relationship with someone who treats their dad that way? As a parent, your kids trust you to keep them safe. They trust that you will not intentionally bring them around harmful people. But that's what toxic people are -- they are actively harming the integrity of your family unit every time they disrespect your husband, say nasty things to you, place stress upon your marriage, and confuse your children about what love, family, and healthy relationships look like. These are not safe people. Don't reward their horrible behavior towards your husband by giving them access to his children.

Your family is dysfunctional and that's unfortunate, but the answer here is clear -- you need to place your role as a wife and mother over that of being a daughter and sister.

 

[quandrea]

Turn the tables here and think about it from your husband's perspective. How would you feel if someone treated you like garbage and not only did your husband want to maintain a relationship with that person, but he also fostered a relationship between that person and your children? Think about how you'd feel every time your family had to split up so he could take your children to visit with people who can't stand you. (Are they bad-mouthing you in front of your kids? How does that make your kids feel hearing someone say those things about their mom?)

You say they've been "so awful" to your husband. What is it teaching your children that you will continue to have a relationship with someone who treats their dad that way, and that they should have a relationship with someone who treats their dad that way? As a parent, your kids trust you to keep them safe. They trust that you will not intentionally bring them around harmful people. But that's what toxic people are -- they are actively harming the integrity of your family unit every time they disrespect your husband, say nasty things to you, place stress upon your marriage, and confuse your children about what love, family, and healthy relationships look like. These are not safe people. Don't reward their horrible behavior towards your husband by giving them access to his children.

Your family is dysfunctional and that's unfortunate, but the answer here is clear -- you need to place your role as a wife and mother over that of being a daughter and sister.

You are completely right. There is still part of me that doesn't want to rock the boat, that doesn't want to implode the family, but you say it all when you write that their behaviour harms the integrity of my family unit. It is a stress on the marriage. My kids know exactly what is going down and what has been said. Thanks for the reality check. I'm not sure if you are a therapist, but your posts are extremely helpful.

 

[TipsyTraveler]

You are completely right. There is still part of me that doesn't want to rock the boat, that doesn't want to implode the family, but you say it all when you write that their behaviour harms the integrity of my family unit. It is a stress on the marriage. My kids know exactly what is going down and what has been said. Thanks for the reality check. I'm not sure if you are a therapist, but your posts are extremely helpful.

No, I'm just a product of dysfunction.

 

[Wishing on a star]

Ohhhh, that must have been hard!
Keep your chin up!

As far as any other Christmas plans... Don't go....
If you do visit, maybe it should be just you, for some kind of short visit?
It sounds like neither your husband, or your kids, should have to deal with this!

 

[quandrea]

I went to a coffee shop today with my son. I mentioned that I used to go there when my daughter was a baby. He asked who I went with. I told him Grandpa. He said, "Its okay Mama. You've got us." He then went on to say how it makes him sad when he sees how I get sad when they say bad things about me. I see how it hurts him to see me hurt. I've absolutely done the right thing.

Haven't heard from my sisters. I don't expect to hear from them. I figure they've had enough of me and I won't hear from /see them again.

Thanks to all for helping me through this. It's a bit upsetting/embarrassing to me that it took me three years to make this journey.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

I went to a coffee shop today with my son. I mentioned that I used to go there when my daughter was a baby. He asked who I went with. I told him Grandpa. He said, "Its okay Mama. You've got us." He then went on to say how it makes him sad when he sees how I get sad when they say bad things about me. I see how it hurts him to see me hurt. I've absolutely done the right thing.

Haven't heard from my sisters. I don't expect to hear from them. I figure they've had enough of me and I won't hear from /see them again.

Thanks to all for helping me through this. It's a bit upsetting/embarrassing to me that it took me three years to make this journey.

Just keep on the path. You're doing it as you should, slow and steady. No impulsive movements. Yes, 3 years can be a long time, or a short time in the whole scheme of things.

 

[leebee]

I went to a coffee shop today with my son. I mentioned that I used to go there when my daughter was a baby. He asked who I went with. I told him Grandpa. He said, "Its okay Mama. You've got us." He then went on to say how it makes him sad when he sees how I get sad when they say bad things about me. I see how it hurts him to see me hurt. I've absolutely done the right thing.

Haven't heard from my sisters. I don't expect to hear from them. I figure they've had enough of me and I won't hear from /see them again.

Thanks to all for helping me through this. It's a bit upsetting/embarrassing to me that it took me three years to make this journey.

Keep moving forward, quandrea. Sometimes it's sad, but necessary, to move away from toxic family members. I know... we are going through something similar, but it's only been going on for about 10 months. No need to surround yourself and your family with ugliness- they don't deserve it and neither do you. Your son sounds like a real sweetie!

 

[RC Fan]

I’ve been in a similar situation. You need to know none of this is your fault. For your sake and your family’s sake, get out and don’t look back.

This article helped me: http://www.jenimawter.com/the-sibli...tsy-wuebker-and-becky-blanton/comment-page-1/

 

[quandrea]

I’ve been in a similar situation. You need to know none of this is your fault. For your sake and your family’s sake, get out and don’t look back.

This article helped me: http://www.jenimawter.com/the-sibli...tsy-wuebker-and-becky-blanton/comment-page-1/

Thank you. I read the article. My sisters, most recently, and my father and brother accuse me of all the things a narcissist is, but I see it so clearly in my father and brother. They make me think, "Am I the crazy one? Am I the bad one?" I don't think so, but this whole thing sure tests my self image and esteem.

No word from my sisters this week and I suspect I won't hear from them again. I think they've had enough of me. Amberpi said a page or so back how her ex's family thought they were so awesome because they spent all their time together. They were proud of their enmeshment! That's my family. They think I'm the loser, the troubled one because I've forged me own path, made my own life. They just can't accept or approve of that. They actually tell me I need therapy to deal with my problems!

Intellectually I know that they are screwed up and that my desire to be independent is reasonable. Wanting to maintain my own values is okay. However, having my whole family walk away is tough. I know I'll never meet their expectations and trying to could have very well ruined the family life I've worked so hard at. It saddens me that my family wants to tear that down instead of celebrating it.

Anyway, I'm rambling. It's been a hard week coming to terms with that fact that it's done with all of them now. I told dh last night that I sent the email and that I don't expect to hear from them again. He was silent, but the look of disgust on his face spoke volumes. He holds his tongue, but I know he is appalled by their behaviour. I know he can't believe two sisters would cut ties over a change in Christmas plans.

 

[bellebud]

Well, I sent the email today. Told my sisters that I won't be hosting Christmas Eve this year. I said we would be busy that evening and that I couldn't schedule dinner and company that night. Said I wanted to let them know far in advance so they could make other arrangements.

Now I wait for the fallout.....or maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised and there won't be any.

It was a hard email to send. I know I had to do it, but I still feel like I'm being the bad guy. Crazy, I know.

Not crazy to feel guilty, it's normal. Just don't act on those feelings, and you'll be fine. You did the right thing.

 

[RC Fan]

Thank you. I read the article. My sisters, most recently, and my father and brother accuse me of all the things a narcissist is, but I see it so clearly in my father and brother. They make me think, "Am I the crazy one? Am I the bad one?" I don't think so, but this whole thing sure tests my self image and esteem.

No word from my sisters this week and I suspect I won't hear from them again. I think they've had enough of me. Amberpi said a page or so back how her ex's family thought they were so awesome because they spent all their time together. They were proud of their enmeshment! That's my family. They think I'm the loser, the troubled one because I've forged me own path, made my own life. They just can't accept or approve of that. They actually tell me I need therapy to deal with my problems!

Intellectually I know that they are screwed up and that my desire to be independent is reasonable. Wanting to maintain my own values is okay. However, having my whole family walk away is tough. I know I'll never meet their expectations and trying to could have very well ruined the family life I've worked so hard at. It saddens me that my family wants to tear that down instead of celebrating it.

Anyway, I'm rambling. It's been a hard week coming to terms with that fact that it's done with all of them now. I told dh last night that I sent the email and that I don't expect to hear from them again. He was silent, but the look of disgust on his face spoke volumes. He holds his tongue, but I know he is appalled by their behaviour. I know he can't believe two sisters would cut ties over a change in Christmas plans.

Narcissists always blame others! It will always be your fault in their eyes. Keep telling yourself it in reality is not your fault.

Based on what you have written, I can tell you are not the narcissist here. Narcissists don’t entertain the thought that they may be wrong.

You do absolutely have a right to your own life, free from toxic, controlling, and manipulative people! I know it is hard, but it will be worth it.

 

[mousefanmichelle]

I feel you 100%. I have 2 older sisters and my oldest one and her children are the worst. Narcissistic to the bone every single one of them. It caused my only living parent great distress last April/May. My oldest sister who basically took advantage of my dad, treated him terribly after an incident that happened btwn her son and my middle sister. My dad just wanted his family to get along as his saying was always - family is all you got. Well my oldest sister sent some hateful texts to me about how my dad could rot in hell etc... right after all of that my dad got very sick. Long story short the oldest sister came around to take care of him but then my dad passed away late July, last year. That same sister who claimed to hate our father was all boo-hoo, poor me blah blah and then took to what he left behind like white on rice. All she wanted was what he had left and I was the trustee of the estate. That made her angry and I got even more hateful texts and messages and harassed by her. I have posts about that from last year you can find and read. She made my life miserable. She still does but I have cut her and her kids out of my life. I don't have space in my life for their drama and poor me crap.

Christmas was always hosted at my house. I couldn't do it last year. I let all of my side of the family know (mostly my oldest sister and her kids) that I wouldn't be doing Christmas anymore. I was beaten up by them about how my parents would want us to be together because someone has to keep the family together and since they were no longer around it was my job..... Ya well I said too bad. You want to have Christmas with everyone then go ahead and host it but I am not. It was really hard on me and you know what? My kids who are adults (18, 20, 22) said it was the best Christmas ever! We went and got Chinese food and saw Star Wars! It was so calm and relaxed and I am really looking forward to the same this year.

Do what is best for you and your family. That is who matters!

 

[Wishing on a star]

You are NOT a narcissist!!! (that I can tell, at all)
You have done absolutely nothing wrong.

What you have described... is exactly and very predictably what people with NPD will do.
This is, actually, one of the very, hallmark, diagnostic things with NPD. The person(s) with NPD will take absolutely NO responsibility, and/or accept NO fault with anything.
They struggle constantly, very very very hard, on a day-by-day, moment by moment, basis, to continuewith, and to justify, their belief that they are 'perfect', that they are 'superior'. (And, having a chosen subjective 'victim' is a very big part of that.)
They can process nothing other than this in their mind.

If you choose to believe, or do, anything other than they give you permission to, then YOU are the narcissist, because you, (naturally and normally) sometimes put your individual needs first.
They will, always and forever,believe that the other person is the 'narcissist'.
They can accept absolutely NO blame or responsibility, and the words 'I am sorry', is simply NOT in their vocabulary.

The response to this, by other people and loved ones, is to think... Won't they ever 'see' this. Won't they ever be 'sorry'.
And, just neurologically, this is just not eve possible. It is just not going to happen.

Also, by not hearing back from your sisters...
A person with NPD truly believes that by ignoring or cutting somebody else off, they are 'punishing' them.
They really do.

None of these things are reasonable or sane.
That is the nature of the beast!!!!

 

[quandrea]

You are NOT a narcissist!!! (that I can tell, at all)
You have done absolutely nothing wrong.

What you have described... is exactly and very predictably what people with NPD will do.
This is, actually, one of the very, hallmark, diagnostic things with NPD. The person(s) with NPD will take absolutely NO responsibility, and/or accept NO fault with anything.
They struggle constantly, very very very hard, on a day-by-day, moment by moment, basis, to continuewith, and to justify, their belief that they are 'perfect', that they are 'superior'. (And, having a chosen subjective 'victim' is a very big part of that.)
They can process nothing other than this in their mind.

If you choose to believe, or do, anything other than they give you permission to, then YOU are the narcissist, because you, (naturally and normally) sometimes put your individual needs first.
They will, always and forever,believe that the other person is the 'narcissist'.
They can accept absolutely NO blame or responsibility, and the words 'I am sorry', is simply NOT in their vocabulary.

The response to this, by other people and loved ones, is to think... Won't they ever 'see' this. Won't they ever be 'sorry'.
And, just neurologically, this is just not eve possible. It is just not going to happen.

Also, by not hearing back from your sisters...
A person with NPD truly believes that by ignoring or cutting somebody else off, they are 'punishing' them.
They really do.

None of these things are reasonable or sane.
That is the nature of the beast!!!!

You described my father. I know you are right! Just have to have resolve during this difficult time. It occurred to me last night that the first fight dh and I ever had in our marriage was about my brother. My brother was verbally abusing my sister (both much younger than me) one afternoon while my parents were on holiday. My sister called me for help and I drove the forty five minutes to their house to referee. Classic enmeshment now I see. Dh was not pleased. I've since moved on from that but in hindsight, much of the conflict in my marriage has been rooted in my family. I've broken from the enmeshment and my family is not pleased!

 

[marcyleecorgan]

I've broken from the enmeshment and my family is not pleased!

Good. You keep up that healthy self-care and maintain those boundaries!

Not sure if we can post links, but there are a number of Reddit sub-forums for support with NPD families if you would like to find others who can help you through similar experiences...