Woman Arrested for Dragging Child in Epcot

[mshanson3121]

I think we can all agree there is never a right way to charge at authorities with a carriage, let alone one holding your, or really anyone's offspring. There's never a right way to headbutt a cop car. These are not the actions of a mentally stable human being. That is concerning.

I'm sorry, that was pretty funny. Just not one of those sentences you really ever expect to read lol

 

[ChipnDale79]

Why use a harness when you can use a stroller?

Before we had kids i'll admit i used to judge parents that did that..."that kid isn't a dog".

Then we had kids, and one that was a "runner". I swear to god I can't tell you how many times we had to snatch his arm to keep him from bolting in a parking lot or in a crowd. It never got to the point where we had to put him in a harness, but i certainly understand why some parents do it.

 

[dreiwhit]

Thank you for your post. We are planning a family trip for Jan 2020 and my third grandchild, my son's little boy has the same issues. It sounds like you are talking about my grandson. He will be 4 when go on our family trip and I'm thinking a harness may be a good idea for him but I'm not sure how my daughter-in-law will feel about it. I'm thinking I will bring up the subject with my son when we are closer to the trip. He can talk it over with his wife, I don't want to start any trouble but I do want my grandson to be safe.

I'm so glad to hear that your son grew out of his issues, I'm praying for the same result for my grandson. We all only want the best for our children and grandchildren.

Pixie Dust to you.

Thank you Ms. Minnie. Your post actually brightened up my day!

I hope that our moderators will allow me the largesse to respond off topically?

If your Grandson is like my son was, the stimuli that come from WDW may be too much for him. We could not take him to the fair when he was 5 and younger because of his senses being overloaded and wanting to flee. And, there's no way we could have taken him to WDW then. You may want to look for some quiet areas to give him a break if needed.

It took years, but my son grew out of his sensory issues and has learned to compensate for his Aspergers. He's now a 16 1/2 year old teenager who is active in amateur radio and taking college CLEP tests. He's come a long way with a lot of work and prayer. I pray that your Grandson will do the same as my son has done!

 

[BabybetterDisney]

Dragging a child into a bathroom stall is definitely an act of desperation, not an act of abuse. It shows how badly you want to be in the bathroom! If the woman behaves badly with the police, fighting with the police, that's falling apart emotionally after getting arrested; doesn't mean she deserves getting arrested. Who knows how many people in Disney in a day would have fallen apart if you had them arrested and threatened to take away their kids? The woman got arrested for dragging a child with a harness and the child fell in the process. The fact that she behaved badly after the arrest makes for interesting news but doesn't justify the arrest.

On the other hand, there's nothing wrong with reporting parenting behavior that one considers abusive. It's not possible for a bystander to know the whole situation, so in the interest of protecting the child just in case, CPS should be called to investigate. That's what they are for. Some of their investigations will turn out to be nothing, others will be well deserved.

So for parents who are not abusive, it's very important that they play it safe in public to avoid getting arrested, especially in Disney, where the day is tough and long, the crowds are overwhelming, and the pressure of "having a magical day because I paid a magical amount of money for this" is intense. It is better to have the situation well thought out ahead -- how should I handle if my kid has a meltdown at the Happiest Place on Earth? What should I do if I have a tough day that I paid $400 for? Then you got a game plan which will make prevent unpleasant CPS visits in Disney World, which is totally going to eat into the $400 day. This is in general true, not just for Disney World but also for the grocery store and the mall.

The first time I went to WDW with my kids, about 8 years ago, I went by myself with my then DS11, DS9, and DS4. On the plan ride to Orlando, the air attendant said, "You are taking 3 kids by yourself to Disney World?" I said yes. She didn't say any more, but she did look like she wanted to turn me in for that! Indeed, all my friends are like "Are you crazy?" or "My husband wouldn't let me do that!"

But I had it all figured out, and I drilled my kids on what to do if they were tired or if they were lost or getting too hot.

For all 8 days we had a wonderful time. Nobody had a melt down or got excessively upset when something went wrong. Then it was time to go home, and all three kids cried. I said don't you guys want to go home and see Daddy? They said no! We don't want to see Daddy! We want to stay at Disney World!

(I so wish my kids were young again!)

 

[BabybetterDisney]

They should look into them. Slapping is abuse. If those same parents slapped a cast member they'd be in jail for assault. Why is it less offensive when it is a young child being slapped? I am shocked at the defense of slapping a small kid.

But if a parent spanked a cast member that would be assault also. But there is a time to slap the kid or hit him in some other odd way.

I once heard this woman tell the story of her son. She was dead set against any kind of spanking and she never hit her kid in any way. Until one day when her kid was 1, she went to visit a friend who had a new born. They sat and talked happily in the yard on a warm day, and the little baby was sleeping peacefully in a carrying basket. Suddenly, her son went over to the baby, bent down, bit the baby on the forehead until the baby was bleeding, and wouldn't let go. The baby woke up screaming, so the woman went up to her son, picked him up by the leg, and hit him on the side as hard as she could. She said she didn't even notice herself doing it, something just snapped inside.

When I was breastfeeding my oldest, an old La Leche League lady taught me to flick the baby on the cheek with my finger should he start biting. I looked at her like "wow where did you get such a horrible idea" until one day when my baby bit me hard while breastfeeding. I flicked him hard on the cheek, and he never did it again. Then he turned 1 and stopped breastfeeding. One day when I was holding him, he bit me hard on the shoulder! So I slapped him on the cheek with my fingers by turning my wrist. He burst out crying, but a little while later a friend was holding him, and he bit the friend, so I slapped him again on the cheek. He burst out crying and never bit anybody again. I never had to slap him after that, though he's had other spankings with the belt. (I started spanking with the belt because when he was 18 months old, I smacked his bottom with my hand for some offense, and he turned and smiled at me.)

My son is 19 now, a happy, confident, hard working, law abiding young man. He says he's had a wonderful childhood.

 

[OSUZorba]

But if a parent spanked a cast member that would be assault also. But there is a time to slap the kid or hit him in some other odd way.

I once heard this woman tell the story of her son. She was dead set against any kind of spanking and she never hit her kid in any way. Until one day when her kid was 1, she went to visit a friend who had a new born. They sat and talked happily in the yard on a warm day, and the little baby was sleeping peacefully in a carrying basket. Suddenly, her son went over to the baby, bent down, bit the baby on the forehead until the baby was bleeding, and wouldn't let go. The baby woke up screaming, so the woman went up to her son, picked him up by the leg, and hit him on the side as hard as she could. She said she didn't even notice herself doing it, something just snapped inside.

When I was breastfeeding my oldest, an old La Leche League lady taught me to flick the baby on the cheek with my finger should he start biting. I looked at her like "wow where did you get such a horrible idea" until one day when my baby bit me hard while breastfeeding. I flicked him hard on the cheek, and he never did it again. Then he turned 1 and stopped breastfeeding. One day when I was holding him, he bit me hard on the shoulder! So I slapped him on the cheek with my fingers by turning my wrist. He burst out crying, but a little while later a friend was holding him, and he bit the friend, so I slapped him again on the cheek. He burst out crying and never bit anybody again. I never had to slap him after that, though he's had other spankings with the belt. (I started spanking with the belt because when he was 18 months old, I smacked his bottom with my hand for some offense, and he turned and smiled at me.)

My son is 19 now, a happy, confident, hard working, law abiding young man. He says he's had a wonderful childhood.

Getting a toddler to stop biting a new born is completely different than slapping a child because you got upset. If a dog bites a kid, there is nothing wrong with kicking the dog or doing whatever it take to make it stop. That doesn't mean it is okay to go kick the dog because you are having a rough day. Flicking a biting toddler on the cheek for biting is basically the same as spanking and is widely given advice from people in the medical industry, again completely different than fully slapping a toddler because you are mad.

I think this is one of those case where in words people can assume the worse or assume the best, while in person it is probably much more clear cut. I doubt anyone called the cops on this lady because she pulled the leash a little hard and the kid fell. It is much more likely that she was dragging him along the ground by the leash in an aggressive way that most people would think was wrong (whether or not it was police worthy would probably still be debated). Just like it is possible to think up situations where slapping a kid might be okay, however seeing it real life most people would probably be able to assess if it had crossed the line. Words just aren't as descriptive as sight, a slap can be anything from a love pat, to a "hey look at me," to a knock out blow.

 

[mshanson3121]

Thank you for your post. We are planning a family trip for Jan 2020 and my third grandchild, my son's little boy has the same issues. It sounds like you are talking about my grandson. He will be 4 when go on our family trip and I'm thinking a harness may be a good idea for him but I'm not sure how my daughter-in-law will feel about it. I'm thinking I will bring up the subject with my son when we are closer to the trip. He can talk it over with his wife, I don't want to start any trouble but I do want my grandson to be safe.

I'm so glad to hear that your son grew out of his issues, I'm praying for the same result for my grandson. We all only want the best for our children and grandchildren.

Pixie Dust to you.

I too, will diverge for a minute. Our oldest has Sensory Processing Disorder and Tourette Syndrome, and our youngest has Autism and health issues. They were 8 & 5 when we went. I will say, it definitely was difficult for them. Interestingly enough, my daughter with ASD did better than my son with SPD (he had far more severe sensory issues than she did), but it was still overwhelming for both of them in many ways. My son quite honestly, did not enjoy the rides nearly as much as we had anticipated, and he would have done better if we would have waited another year or two. I really hope to get back soon, as I know that he will get more out of it now (his issues have improved greatly as he's gotten older). We didn't experience any in park meltdowns but I credit that only because we were uber-cautious. Some of the things that helped us:

- We used ear plugs at all times for both kids, and headphones for our son during any fireworks etc. The noise in the park can be extremely overwhelming because it's loud and constant.
- We had a stroller for both of them to use so they could curl up and take a break - both physically, as well as from the crowds etc... Kind of a "safe space".
- We used the DAS which was more for my daughter as she gets very overwhelmed in large crowds and definitely could not cope with waiting in long lines. We didn't use it a tonne (we made use of rope drop which really helped with wait times), but when we did it was invaluable.
- We typically did not do long days. We rope dropped and then left by 1 or 2 and took the rest of the day off. Two days we did a mid-day break, so we rope dropped, stayed till 12 or 1, then went back and rested. We re-entered the park around 5 and stayed till close. Those days were both followed by a rest day with no parks at all. We also had another rest day in between as well. Rest days were crucial and in all honesty, we could have used another one.
- We stayed off site. This too was crucial to the success of our vacation. There is no way the children could have coped staying in a hotel room for 10 nights. Staying off site allowed us to take a break from the sensory overload that is Disney, allowed a more calming environment that more reflected home, allowed separate bedrooms so better sleep, a place to go and unwind etc... We could make our own meals so that meant we were all eating better (which affects their behavior), and just generally allowed us to keep more of a natural routine. The 24' private pool and games room were a bonus

Hope that helps some!

Dragging a child into a bathroom stall is definitely an act of desperation, not an act of abuse. It shows how badly you want to be in the bathroom!

While I don't necessary agree with the rest of your assessment on whether this woman was abusive or not, I do concede the point that it is hard for outsiders to judge what is actually going on. To be fair, there are times I'm sure that if an outsider saw my daughter and I, they might think something was amiss. There are several times that I have had to grab her by the arm, and literally sprint her to a bathroom in a store etc... People observing I'm sure would have all sorts of judgemental comments and questions on my behavior and/or choices - especially if she did happen to trip and fall. What they don't realize is that she has a bowel disorder, that unfortunately when it flares, has left her with very little control, so when that urge hits, not only does she have significant pain until she can go, she has about 30 seconds to a minute tops, to get to a bathroom, otherwise.... When she was younger I used to just pick her up and run, but now that she is getting older (8 years old), heavier and taller, it is too hard for me to carry her and run and it just slows us down, so I grab her hand so we don't get separated and basically just try to make sure she doesn't run into people/things in her haste, doesn't get lost etc... But no one observing would understand any of that.

 

[Snap Crackle Pop]

We took the kids twice this year. They had a blast, and minus my terrible food poisoning, we did too. We wanted to vacation as a family, so we went to WDW. We had 0 meltdowns at the parks, but we didn't press the kids and did lots of late nights to keep the kids out of the sun and heat as much as possible and let them sleep in as late as they wanted. We were also using World Showcase as a way to really get the kids interested in international travel which we're doing next year with them. Some people would say they don't understand why you'd take the kids on such long trips, but we're stoked about it.

mmhmm.. likely story.

 

[Average Joes]

I saw a mother open slap her daughter of perhaps 7-8 in the face at Blizzard Beach this past September. She cried after of course. Others were around watching this. Later the mother ran after her a few steps with her arm raised to strike her. Luckily she was a bigger women and couldn't catch the daughter. I felt terrible for that kid. I thought about calling the police and then thought about the time that would take out of our vacation and having to give evidence when I lived in Canada. It was assault plain and simple. I justified it that it was probably part of their culture and did nothing. Not my greatest moment.

 

[mshanson3121]

mmhmm.. likely story.

Is there something about this that is just impossible for you to imagine, or do you just like being rude?

 

[Guyton dis lover]

Your child isn't a dog.

Dogs don’t deserve this treatment either.

 

[Guyton dis lover]

When I grew up I got beat with a belt. I did spank my child but I did it when it was needed. My daughter is a well adjusted college educated woman who I am proud of . This was not abuse. I could get more with a look that I ever did with a spanking. Slapping a child or for that matter anyone is not acceptable. Allowing a child to fall and not protecting the child is unacceptable. Violence in any way toward anyone is not acceptable. Children need and should be protected.

 

[Jennasis]

We saw a mother open hand slap her teen daughter in line for Soarin' at Epcot. DH and I were in line and the family was in front of us. Mom, dad and teen daughter and teen son. The two teens were quietly talking and laughing amongst themselves. Not loud or rude or anything. Just happily giggling. I had my back to them and was talking to DH who suddenly turned white and his eyes bugged out. He said the mom, totally unprovoked, hauled off and slapped the girl. All the people behind DH saw it too and everyone in line around them went silent. I turned to look at the family and the girl was now just leaning against the wall, her head hanging, with tears rolling down her face. Nobody in the family spoke another word for the remainder of the wait.

 

[Average Joes]

A few years ago we were in MK waiting in line for the Jungle Cruise when I heard some loud *****ing and screaming and lots of cursing from a guy behind us. There was a small group behind us, a guy and lady in their 20s, one of their mothers and a child. The F bombs just kept going very loudly, people were petrified and didn’t know what to do, they stood there and covered their child’s ears but did nothing. Finally I had enough and turned around and said you drop one more F bomb and I’m going to drop you. I thought either the girlfriend/wife or mother would’ve talked some sense into him, instead they even louder and protected him while he ran his mouth from behind them. Others around still refused to do nothing and did nothing to support me as I took one for the team. I told my wife to go get security while I dealt with them, but then they started their personal attacks on her and she didn’t leave. So we get on the cruise and on our way back before the ride ends I can see this group of people talking to security. Of course they called the security on me and claimed I singled out this poor veteran dealing with PTSD and I was harassing him and they should file charges against me. Unfreakingbelievable!!! I explained my side to the officers, but it was a he said she said. Luckily there was a family nearby that explained to the officers what down. So I’m not surprised the idiots that pay $1000s to go somewhere and act like straight trash and/or try to ruin the experience for others witnessing their inappropriate behavior.

Of course their language was offensive and totally inappropriate. I don’t know the law in Florida. Where I live if you threaten to assault someone it is a crime. I don’t disagree with what you did, just be careful.

 

[BeefSqueezins]

In my midwestern neighborhood growing up, our friends parents would crack us if we got out of line, call our parents after, and then we’d get it worse when we got home. God help you if a teacher had to call one of our parents. We were taught early and often that we were not on equal footing with adults. It might have taken a few “lessons” but once you figured it out, it was smooth sailing.

I’m not saying you should beat children for sport or entertainment, and yes, dragging a child in a harness across pavement isn’t right. But, five across the cheek really cuts down on the amount of backtalk and disrespect children are prone to when testing boundaries.

 

[ELLH]

So let's summarize everyone's inputs, shall we?...

1) (enter poster's screenname) is a better parent than everyone else
2) 'Back in the day' (poster) would have been thrown off a cliff for looking at a parent sideways
3) If you use a stroller for your kitten you're sane but if you put a harness on your child you're a nutcase
4) If you have never been to the bathroom then you have no room to judge anyone



Oh, the original post? Who cares?!

 

[fbarker]

Your child isn't a dog.

And a dog should not be abused either.