Woman Arrested for Dragging Child in Epcot

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As others have mentioned, my son was smart enough when he was younger to figure out how to get out of the stroller. He would also defeat baby proofing gadgets around our home as well.

My son has Asperger's and when he was younger, he had sensory issues (thankfully, grown out of.) He was also a runner, and a very fast runner. He could make a break from you quickly. Much more quickly than you would expect. When he became too big to carry and could get out of the stroller, we had to use a harness on him.

We would occasionally get dirty looks in public, but we just smiled back and thought "if you only knew...."

Fortunately, the harness helped break him of running. He hated wearing it with a passion. We finally were able to reason with him and say, if you hold our hand and don't run away, we won't use the harness. It worked.

Thank you for your post. We are planning a family trip for Jan 2020 and my third grandchild, my son's little boy has the same issues. It sounds like you are talking about my grandson. He will be 4 when go on our family trip and I'm thinking a harness may be a good idea for him but I'm not sure how my daughter-in-law will feel about it. I'm thinking I will bring up the subject with my son when we are closer to the trip. He can talk it over with his wife, I don't want to start any trouble but I do want my grandson to be safe.

I'm so glad to hear that your son grew out of his issues, I'm praying for the same result for my grandson. We all only want the best for our children and grandchildren.

Pixie Dust to you. pixiedust:
 
The struggles my wife and I have faced as we raised our four brings humility. I can look at another parent's struggles with compassion. There is a line there certainly. But I am less quick to judge today, without more information than a five second sound bite or 5 word headline. My hat is off to all parents, who raise children to be contributing members of society, despite and with so many quirks and personalities and struggles to fit in the "norm". In this particular story the head butt to the patrol car says more about her state of mind than anything else.
I had the police called on me, when two kids sleeping in a car with windows wide open and me not more than 10 feet away changing a tire. Took less than 10 min for someone to make a judgement without getting out of their car.
 
I don't mean to start trouble but isn't there a famous saying "Spare the rod, spoil the child"? I don't condone slapping or beating a child but an occasional smack on the behind is sometimes in order. My parents didn't beat/slap me but I did on very rare occasions receive a smack to my bottom (that I'm sure was deserved) and I grew up just fine, no emotional scares. I knew my parents loved me and they required me and my siblings to follow the rules. I learned to respect my parents and adults in general, follow the rules and have personal accountability for my actions. This learning starts at a very early age and unfortunately in todays world to many children don't learn these lessons. Parents today are afraid to discipline their children for fear that they will be turned in to social services and possibly loose their child.

While I was raising my children I didn't resort to hitting my children unless it was absolutely necessary. When they were bad I would make them "stand in the corner", on very rare occasions I did give them a smack (1) on their backsides. I raised two very good children who have grown up to be responsible and productive members of society.

My daughter doesn't believing in hitting her children saying how can I tell them not to hit if I am hitting them? This is a very valid point but sometimes a good swift smack to the bottom is in order. My daughter was telling me about taking her 4 year old daughter to pre-K on the first day of school, her daughter didn't want to hold her mothers hand in the parking lot and didn't even want her mother to walk her into school. She was throwing a temper tantrum in the school parking lot with all the other parents watching. I asked her why she didn't just give her a good swift smack to the behind, she said "because there were all the other parents around, I didn't want someone to turn me in and possibly have my daughter taken away from me". This is how it is today, people react to what they see without knowing all the facts. I'm sure if my daughter gave her daughter a quick smack on her behind she would have straighten up pretty fast, end of story.

I hope these comments will be taken in the way they are intended. I'm not trying to judge anyone else on how they feel a child should be disciplined and I don't want anyone to judge me for my thoughts. Sometimes when we are at Disney and I see the crying children and upset parents I think to myself "this is supposed to be the happiest place on earth". I think people need to learn to take Disney in small bites especially when they are traveling with young children.

I hope everyone has a "Magical Day"! pixiedust:
I specifically excluded spanking, FYI. Slapping a child across the face in anger is not spanking for discipline, it is abuse.

As far as actual discipline goes, different things work for different kids and I don't judge. Although no matter the method, consistency is the key a lot of parents lack.
 
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I specifically excluded spanking, FYI. Slapping a child across the face in anger is not spanking for discipline, it is abuse.

As far as actual discipline goes, different things work for different kids and I don't judge. Although no matter the method, consistency is the key a lot of parents lack.

I couldn't agree with you more. I always tell my children, don't make a threat to your child that you aren't will to carry out. Children are very smart and they will figure it out very quickly that "oh boy here we go again, mom is saying she's going to do x, y, z but we all know she isn't going to do anything". Parents need to be very careful about what they tell their children the punishment will be because they have to carry it out once said if they want their children to believe them. I'm glad my children are all grown up and I have four beautiful grandchildren to love. Happy parenting everyone.
 


It is never okay to physically assault a child, a woman, or an animal. I don't care what the lead up to it is. If you ever get to the point that you feel the right answer is physical violence, it is time to get out of that situation any other way possible and if it is a reoccurring issue you probably need to seek anger management. It is better to leave a kid screaming on the bathroom floor and walk away for a few minutes, than to resort to physical abuse.

There is a huge difference in telling a kid if they don't behave that you won't take them to the pool and slapping them across the face. There is even a huge difference in proper spanking and slapping them across the face. I don't think anyone would ever try to justify a husband hitting his wife, regardless of the lead up, so why on earth should anyone ever try to justify an adult hitting a toddler?

I do agree in general that a few lines in an article don't give a clear picture and it could be overblown, and I agree a lot of negative interactions you see between parents and kids is a very small segment in time and the parent yelling a little is probably the worst it ever gets. However, in this case, a women bashing her head against a car hood hard enough to dent it, probably was being pretty rough with the child as well.

I said she shouldn't have slapped the child. No, slapping shouldn't be done. All I'm saying is that while parents probably shouldn't slap their kids I also don't think they should have CPS called on them because they had a momentary lapse in a theme park famous for exhaustion and over stimulation either.
 
I couldn't agree with you more. I always tell my children, don't make a threat to your child that you aren't will to carry out. Children are very smart and they will figure it out very quickly that "oh boy here we go again, mom is saying she's going to do x, y, z but we all know she isn't going to do anything". Parents need to be very careful about what they tell their children the punishment will be because they have to carry it out once said if they want their children to believe them. I'm glad my children are all grown up and I have four beautiful grandchildren to love. Happy parenting everyone.
I 100% agree. Luckily my in-laws were great parents and taught us this long before DD. My brother and SIL are terrible at disciplining their kids (he is a very loving parent, though), and provides a good example of what not to do, especially with the over the top threats that are never followed through on.
 
I said she shouldn't have slapped the child. No, slapping shouldn't be done. All I'm saying is that while parents probably shouldn't slap their kids I also don't think they should have CPS called on them because they had a momentary lapse in a theme park famous for exhaustion and over stimulation either.
That is what I disagree with. People that have a momentary lapse, typically have multiple momentary lapses, leading to a pattern of abuse that gets worse. If violence is your (I am using you/your in general, not directed at you personally) go to emotion when you get upset, you should probably seek professional anger management. How many spouse abusers have only abused their spouse once? I've been more upset at work that any child could ever make me, but if I hailed off and hit someone I'd be arrested, probably go to jail, lose my job and at least lose my kids while in jail. If I can't hit an adult that can defend themselves when I am upset, why would it ever be okay to hit a completely defenseless child? (Again, I am not talking about spanking)

My SIL's BIL just hospitalized his 18 month year-old and 5 year, his violent behavior towards them didn't start when he threw the baby across the room into a wall, it started with small acts of violence and abusive language years before the baby was born. Thankfully, DHS finally pulled the kids out of that house.

To clarify, I am not saying if you slap your kid once that you should lose them, but it is a warning sign that you probably need help either with anger, parenting or both. Justifying it as the child's fault is a massive warning sign though, and is how all abusers justify their violence towards others.

Edit: I know you are not saying to it is okay to beat kids. I just personally don't think there should ever be an attempt to justify any level of child abuse, domestic violence, or animal abuse. I do think there should be flexibility in parenting/discipline methods, but hitting a child in anger isn't a discipline method, it is an expression of rage. If I saw a guy hit his wife I would call the police, I see no difference with a child.
 
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I said she shouldn't have slapped the child. No, slapping shouldn't be done. All I'm saying is that while parents probably shouldn't slap their kids I also don't think they should have CPS called on them because they had a momentary lapse in a theme park famous for exhaustion and over stimulation either.

Isn't it up to CPS/other authorities to determine if it was "a momentary lapse in a theme park famous for exhaustion and over stimulation?" Onlookers shouldn't be the ones to judge that, it's their job to alert the authorities that something concerning happened.
 
Isn't it up to CPS/other authorities to determine if it was "a momentary lapse in a theme park famous for exhaustion and over stimulation?" Onlookers shouldn't be the ones to judge that, it's their job to alert the authorities that something concerning happened.

You have a reasonable point. But I also think one of the reasons you hear stories about kids that have died due to neglect and abuse that went on for years is because all the social workers are too busy looking into the 35 parents who got fed up and slapped their child one day while on vacation.

ETA: I also come back to my original point and say we only see that small picture, that one moment in time. And a single slap is not clear cut abuse to the level that CPS would open a case. If it were ongoing abuse, people that know the family in their regular lives would be aware of it. Teachers, doctors, neighbors, etc. Mandated reporters who have been trained on what to look for and would likely be aware of when it is time to involve CPS and when it isn't.
 
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I don't understand why parents find it necessary to take young children and babies to Disney. I guess we take them because we want to share our excitement or because we wanted to go when we were young but our parents didn't take us. Our adult children's memories of Disney vacations starts when they were 8 years of age, not their earlier vacations. We witnessed an overheated tired melt down of a very small child in a stroller. The Mother had finally had enough and yelled, "stop crying, you are in the happiest place in the world, damn it".

:earsboy: Bill

My youngest is 7. Next April will be his 10th trip to WDW. Thinking back over all those trips I can't think of a single meltdown. When he or his brother need a break we take a break. When they need to sleep in we sleep in. If they want a pool day we take a pool day. Not pushing ourselves to the breaking point is what we do to help us avoid the meltdowns and really enjoy ourselves.
 
You have a reasonable point. But I also think one of the reasons you hear stories about kids that have died due to neglect and abuse that went on for years is because all the social workers are too busy looking into the 35 parents who got fed up and slapped their child one day while on vacation.

They should look into them. Slapping is abuse. If those same parents slapped a cast member they'd be in jail for assault. Why is it less offensive when it is a young child being slapped? I am shocked at the defense of slapping a small kid.
 
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So is there a leash law in Florida?

???

My youngest is 7. Next April will be his 10th trip to WDW. Thinking back over all those trips I can't think of a single meltdown. When he or his brother need a break we take a break. When they need to sleep in we sleep in. If they want a pool day we take a pool day. Not pushing ourselves to the breaking point is what we do to help us avoid the meltdowns and really enjoy ourselves.

Exactly, WDW needs to be enjoyed in small bites. Overdoing it takes all the fun out of it. I understand that WDW is very expensive and some people only get to go once so they want to see and do everything but unfortunately that is the wrong way to enjoy WDW.

My SIL's BIL just hospitalized his 18 month year-old and 5 year, his violent behavior towards them didn't start when he threw the baby across the room into a wall, it started with small acts of violence and abusive language years before the baby was born. Thankfully, DHS finally pulled the kids out of that house.

This is so sad, I hope everyone is ok.
 
WDW needs to be enjoyed in small bites
My wife and family have been able to go several times. However most families who make the national average (or less!) in wages may not have the opportunity to go more than once in a lifetime. Making the most of what little time there is puts enormous pressure on a parent, to where they may act out. Not that it is OK. But in this time span of rising prices, and waiting lines you cannot do anything about, and lack of rides geared toward toddlers, and FL heat / sun / dehydration / etc. creates the perfect storm. The "take it in small bites" is good advice, but unfortunately many are not able to decide what is a small enough bite to consume the total trip cost. A mom or dad that gave up cell phones, cable tv, new tires, skipped a mortgage payment to go for a "get away" may not be willing to do small bites, no matter what the kid wants.
 
My wife and family have been able to go several times. However most families who make the national average (or less!) in wages may not have the opportunity to go more than once in a lifetime. Making the most of what little time there is puts enormous pressure on a parent, to where they may act out. Not that it is OK. But in this time span of rising prices, and waiting lines you cannot do anything about, and lack of rides geared toward toddlers, and FL heat / sun / dehydration / etc. creates the perfect storm. The "take it in small bites" is good advice, but unfortunately many are not able to decide what is a small enough bite to consume the total trip cost. A mom or dad that gave up cell phones, cable tv, new tires, skipped a mortgage payment to go for a "get away" may not be willing to do small bites, no matter what the kid wants.

I don't mean to be callus but it sounds like a family that shouldn't go. If your choosing between making your mortgage payment or having safe tires on your car versus a WDW trip I would say there is no contest, you shouldn't go to WDW. Having a home and a safe car to drive is much more important than a WDW trip especially if the parents aren't going to care what the kids want. Just saying...
 
So....

Is everyone done telling others here how to parent with a stroller/harness? Are we all done here complaining about the bad CPS?

Because, if so, maybe we could focus the attention to a lady who (reportedly) dragged her kid in to a bathroom stall and (according to LEO's on the scene) became combative with them and also headbutted the police vehicle? I mean, we aren't really disputing that we shouldn't 'jump to conclusions' in her case and surely we aren't somehow trying to overshadow the safety of this child in the care of a woman who clearly isn't stable with stupid arguments about whether or not someone is parenting right by using a harness? Right?...

You must be new here. LOL (I'm kidding) This is what this board does.

And you are absolutely right. There is a right and a wrong way to use a child harness. Whether or not it works for parent a or b is irrelevant.

And while I'll agree CPS can be a handful, it is a necessity and isn't really what should be discussed here.

I think we can all agree there is never a right way to charge at authorities with a carriage, let alone one holding your, or really anyone's offspring. There's never a right way to headbutt a cop car. These are not the actions of a mentally stable human being. That is concerning.

My God this thread has flown right off the rails...lol.
 
@Ms.Minnie You are absolutely right, which is why I have not set foot in a park (that I paid for anyway) due to the cost in over 10 years. Are you 100% sure that every parent in WDW can say the same? Is it possible the example given in the headlines is also battling other issues, such as financial ones? Now if business puts me near a park, and I can take a weekend, and the only cost is admission ;)
 
@Ms.Minnie Is it possible the example given in the headlines is also battling other issues, such as financial ones?

I'm a little confused here. Why would this matter in the slightest?

A woman who may or may not have drug her child on the ground became combative when confronted, and allegedly tried to strike officials with a stroller which in turn caused her other kid to allegedly fall out of the stroller. She then, allegedly, head butted the cop car.

Which part of this is justified by financial issues?
 
I am just going to say let's stay on topic and not go into financial concerns as well as how individuals should parent. If we cannot stay on topic I will have to close the thread.
 
This absolutely breaks my heart. Poor little ones!

When we were in Disney in May, we saw a woman open palm slap her daughter across the face. The daughter had been asking something to the effect of - can we please go back to the hotel room, I'm tired. The mother went on an absolute TIRADE about being thankful to even be in Disney World and stop whining about being tired, and proceeded to wallop her poor child. My husband spoke up and I got a cast member. We left once the CM showed up, so no idea the outcome.... but goodness. My son was so upset about it. We ended up taking him over to the Plaza for an ice cream and sat down to explain about abuse and why it's not okay. It turned into a nice teaching moment for him, but I still worry over that poor little baby.

If a parent is willing to act this way in public, just imagine how horrible they are at home!?
A few years ago we were in MK waiting in line for the Jungle Cruise when I heard some loud *****ing and screaming and lots of cursing from a guy behind us. There was a small group behind us, a guy and lady in their 20s, one of their mothers and a child. The F bombs just kept going very loudly, people were petrified and didn’t know what to do, they stood there and covered their child’s ears but did nothing. Finally I had enough and turned around and said you drop one more F bomb and I’m going to drop you. I thought either the girlfriend/wife or mother would’ve talked some sense into him, instead they even louder and protected him while he ran his mouth from behind them. Others around still refused to do nothing and did nothing to support me as I took one for the team. I told my wife to go get security while I dealt with them, but then they started their personal attacks on her and she didn’t leave. So we get on the cruise and on our way back before the ride ends I can see this group of people talking to security. Of course they called the security on me and claimed I singled out this poor veteran dealing with PTSD and I was harassing him and they should file charges against me. Unfreakingbelievable!!! I explained my side to the officers, but it was a he said she said. Luckily there was a family nearby that explained to the officers what down. So I’m not surprised the idiots that pay $1000s to go somewhere and act like straight trash and/or try to ruin the experience for others witnessing their inappropriate behavior.
 
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