***Official*** Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge Information Thread *** Contains SPOILERS ***

[MickeyMinnieMom]

If it helps things flow I think people will be okay.

Not sure I agree.

I’m not sure I buy that in this setup, my wait would be shorter than if they offered FP AND I actually showed up with a FP. As I have for every trip with FoP, for instance.

I can imagine that this is better for those who wouldn’t have gotten a FP though.

I think a year sounds like a REALLY long time for them not to offer FP. If they offer ONLY a paid version, I can imagine a lot of screaming.

 

[Rach3975]

And here's where it gets interesting. If I recall properly, they shortened hours at some other parks to make up for all the additional hours at AK. Surely they know better than to do that with SW?

Nooo!!! I really hope they don't do that. When we're going (early Nov.) it's mostly 9 am openings and relatively early closings (8 for AK/HS, 9 or 10 for MK and EP). How much more can they shorten them, especially since MK already closes at 6 for parties a few nights a week?

 

[rteetz]

I really HOPE it doesn’t take them a year before adding FP. (Edited my original post)

If it works well without FP I could see them doing that.

 

[rteetz]

Not sure I agree.

I’m not sure I buy that in this setup, my wait would be shorter than if they offered FP AND I actually showed up with a FP. As I have for every trip with FoP, for instance.

I can imagine that this is better for those who wouldn’t have gotten a FP though.

I think a year sounds like a REALLY long time for them not to offer FP. If they offer ONLY a paid version, I can imagine a lot of screaming.

Your standby wait likely will be long but instead of 5 hours it will be 2-3. It’s a proven fact that FP slows the standby line.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Your standby wait likely will be long but instead of 5 hours it will be 2-3. It’s a proven fact that FP slows the standby line.

I totally get that -- that's what I mentioned. But I don't care. I would never do these rides standby.

This setup strikes me as helping those who would have ridden standby, and likely penalizing those who would have prepared ahead and shown up with a FP.

 

[rteetz]

I totally get that -- that's what I mentioned. But I don't care. I would never do these rides standby.

This setup strikes me as helping those who would have ridden standby, and likely penalizing those who would have prepared ahead and shown up with a FP.

Then you are going to have to book a tour or special event in order to do so until FP comes online.

Disney is emphasizing no FP initially in these rides. I don't see that as a penalty.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Then you are going to have to book a tour or special event in order to do so until FP comes online.

Disney is emphasizing no FP initially in these rides. I don't see that as a penalty.

I understand all of this. I'm disagreeing with this.

Imagine they remove FP today for FoP. If I had a FP for FoP before that change, am I now going to wait LESS time or MORE time since that change? I'm pretty sure the answer is MORE. So that change would, by definition, be penalizing me as someone who plans far ahead and comes with a FP.

Unless I'm wrong about that assumption (entirely possible), it's not a matter of opinion that it's a penalty to someone in my position. It would be a fact -- IF I'm correct in my assumption about a shorter wait with FP than in a system without.


ETA: For opening I understand this. They want a shorter AVERAGE time for the masses so as not to have horrible word of mouth from the majority (standby). But I'd expect them to shift out of that before a year has gone by. That strikes me as too long to penalize planners. They created us by forcing us to plan FP so far in advance!!

 

[rteetz]

I understand all of this. I'm disagreeing with this.

Imagine they remove FP today for FoP. If I had a FP for FoP before that change, am I now going to wait LESS time or MORE time since that change? I'm pretty sure the answer is MORE. So that change would, by definition, be penalizing me as someone who plans far ahead and comes with a FP.

Unless I'm wrong about that assumption (entirely possible), it's not a matter of opinion that it's a penalty to someone in my position. It would be a fact -- IF I'm correct in my assumption about a shorter wait with FP than in a system without.

Disney isn't removing FP from these attractions though. They are opening without it and adding it later so I don't see that as a fair comparison.

In my eyes and I think most others doing it this way is more fair for everyone. You and I both know if they opened with FP they would automatically be the hardest to get FP ever.

There is no penalizing anyone because everyone is on the same playing field going into this. You rope drop for a shorter wait, wait or buy some sort of tour/add on.

There was a Disney before FP was invented and people did just fine. Sure it may have not been as crowded but this is about having things run smoothly operationally.

Personally I do see it as an opinion. I don't see this as a penalty at all.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Disney isn't removing FP from these attractions though. They are opening without it and adding it later so I don't see that as a fair comparison.

In my eyes and I think most others doing it this way is more fair for everyone. You and I both know if they opened with FP they would automatically be the hardest to get FP ever.

There is no penalizing anyone because everyone is on the same playing field going into this. You rope drop for a shorter wait, wait or buy some sort of tour/add on.

There was a Disney before FP was invented and people did just fine. Sure it may have not been as crowded but this is about having things run smoothly operationally.

Personally I do see it as an opinion. I don't see this as a penalty at all.

You're making more an emotional point as to whether this is "fair" for more people or "penalizing" for the sake of being punitive -- that's not what I'm talking about at all.

I'm simply making a purely logical systems point wrt my FoP example -- it is irrelevant for that point whether they have ever offered FP before or not. It's a basic logical point about wait time:

• My wait time as someone who WOULD have shown up with a FP is now going to be longer because they've chosen not to offer FP. Unless I'm wrong about that fact, that "penalizes" someone who would have had a FP.
• I understand why they are doing this at open. They want a shorter wait time ON AVERAGE for more people -- so the masses that would have ridden standby won't wait as long as they would have if FP would have been offered. I get that.

In addition,

• I think that if they offer a paid option without a free option, that could get ugly but they may do it anyway.
• I think that because Disney has CREATED so many planners and gotten them used to FP, I think that group would expect a FP option well before a year has gone by. Could be wrong.

I'm not saying Disney is being mean to me (!!) or that they don't have a good reason for it. But I think it's probably uncontroversial that if I'm someone who WOULD have gotten a FP, I'm going to be waiting longer in this setup. That's all I'm saying.

 

[rteetz]

You're making more an emotional point as to whether this is "fair" for more people or "penalizing" for the sake of being punitive -- that's not what I'm talking about at all.

I'm simply making a purely logical systems point wrt my FoP example -- it is irrelevant for that point whether they have ever offered FP before or not. It's a basic logical point about wait time:

• My wait time as someone who WOULD have shown up with a FP is now going to be longer because they've chosen not to offer FP. Unless I'm wrong about that fact, that "penalizes" someone who would have had a FP.
• I understand why they are doing this at open. They want a shorter wait time ON AVERAGE for more people -- so the masses that would have ridden standby won't wait as long as they would have if FP would have been offered. I get that.

In addition,

• I think that if they offer a paid option without a free option, that could get ugly but they may do it anyway.
• I think that because Disney has CREATED so many planners and gotten them used to FP, I think that group would expect a FP option well before a year has gone by. Could be wrong.

I'm not saying Disney is being mean to me (!!) or that they don't have a good reason for it. But I think it's probably uncontroversial that if I'm someone who WOULD have gotten a FP, I'm going to be waiting longer in this setup. That's all I'm saying.

I don’t think I am. I don’t think what you are saying is a penalty to guests. I would’ve made a FP too if they were an option but I don’t feel it’s a penalty they aren’t. This seems like a rather silly argument. Disney isn’t offering FP because from an operational standpoint it makes the lines run less efficiently making crowds even worse.

Your waiting on August 29th until they offer FP is whatever the standby wait time is. There is no theoretical wait time with or without FP in play here. If there was FP and you had a FP yes your wait would likely be shorter but that’s not the point. Everyone is on the same playing field here in that you have to wait standby or buy something that will get you in without standby.

Disney is doing this because it will work better overall. You may feel that’s a penalty but I don’t.

I am fairly certain if given the opportunity for a FP everyone would take it but that’s not the case. There is no FP so you have to wait or buy an add on it’s pretty simple.

That’s how it worked pre-FP.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I don’t think I am. I don’t think what you are saying is a penalty to guests. I would’ve made a FP too if they were an option but I don’t feel it’s a penalty they aren’t. This seems like a rather silly argument. Disney isn’t offering FP because from an operational standpoint it makes the lines run less efficiently making crowds even worse.

Your waiting on August 29th until they offer FP is whatever the standby wait time is. There is no theoretical wait time with or without FP in play here. If there was FP and you had a FP yes your wait would likely be shorter but that’s not the point. Everyone is on the same playing field here in that you have to wait standby or buy something that will get you in without standby.

Disney is doing this because it will work better overall. You may feel that’s a penalty but I don’t.

I am fairly certain if given the opportunity for a FP everyone would take it but that’s not the case. There is no FP so you have to wait or buy an add on it’s pretty simple.

That’s how it worked pre-FP.

Ok. I tried to make my logical argument about wait times. Obviously didn’t work out. I’ll leave it at that.

 

[yulilin3]

You're making more an emotional point as to whether this is "fair" for more people or "penalizing" for the sake of being punitive -- that's not what I'm talking about at all.

I'm simply making a purely logical systems point wrt my FoP example -- it is irrelevant for that point whether they have ever offered FP before or not. It's a basic logical point about wait time:

• My wait time as someone who WOULD have shown up with a FP is now going to be longer because they've chosen not to offer FP. Unless I'm wrong about that fact, that "penalizes" someone who would have had a FP.
• I understand why they are doing this at open. They want a shorter wait time ON AVERAGE for more people -- so the masses that would have ridden standby won't wait as long as they would have if FP would have been offered. I get that.

In addition,

• I think that if they offer a paid option without a free option, that could get ugly but they may do it anyway.
• I think that because Disney has CREATED so many planners and gotten them used to FP, I think that group would expect a FP option well before a year has gone by. Could be wrong.

I'm not saying Disney is being mean to me (!!) or that they don't have a good reason for it. But I think it's probably uncontroversial that if I'm someone who WOULD have gotten a FP, I'm going to be waiting longer in this setup. That's all I'm saying.

I understand your point. I think the decision to not offer fp is multi faceted.
First even though you might have an onsite reservation, you might not get a fp because others had longer stays or because the system crashes (totally Disney's fault btw) with everyone login in at 7am, then those onsite guests are left feeling deceived by the fact that they paid more money and still didn't get a fp
Second the majority of people coming to the parks are off site and local guests. They are def. going to benefit from the no fp attraction
Third it is proven that an attraction without fp moves the line faster

Now I understand people not wanting to wait multiple hours, no one wants to do that, but the fact of the matter is that people are doing it right now, look at FOP, still multiple hour wait times everyday after 2 years being open and with a fraction of what the SW fan base is

So Disney, and obviously this is all just guessing in my part, decided to go with the lesser of 2 evils. Either open with fp and have most guests angry at the long wait plus on site guests angry that they couldn't get a fp OR open without fp and have everyone wait the same amount of time

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I understand your point. I think the decision to not offer fp is multi faceted.
First even though you might have an onsite reservation, you might not get a fp because others had longer stays or because the system crashes (totally Disney's fault btw) with everyone login in at 7am, then those onsite guests are left feeling deceived by the fact that they paid more money and still didn't get a fp
Second the majority of people coming to the parks are off site and local guests. They are def. going to benefit from the no fp attraction
Third it is proven that an attraction without fp moves the line faster

Now I understand people not wanting to wait multiple hours, no one wants to do that, but the fact of the matter is that people are doing it right now, look at FOP, still multiple hour wait times everyday after 2 years being open and with a fraction of what the SW fan base is

So Disney, and obviously this is all just guessing in my part, decided to go with the lesser of 2 evils. Either open with fp and have most guests angry at the long wait plus on site guests angry that they couldn't get a fp OR open without fp and have everyone wait the same amount of time

Agreed!!

Disney has made a trade off: those who WOULD have had a FP will now wait longer than they would have otherwise, but the MASSES who wouldn’t have had a FP (who far outnumber the former) will now have a shorter wait than they would have otherwise!! Yes — exactly!!

And I totally get that and that reasoning. Doesn’t negate or change my previous point — it’s totaly consistent with it.

 

[rteetz]

Agreed!!

Disney has made a trade off: those who WOULD have had a FP will now wait longer than they would have otherwise, but the MASSES who wouldn’t have had a FP (who far outnumber the former) will now have a shorter wait than they would have otherwise!! Yes — exactly!!

And I totally get that and that reasoning. Doesn’t negate or change my previous point — it’s totaly consistent with it.

Which to me seems more fair for everyone. Yes it may be a longer wait for you but you always have that option to offer up extra money for access. If that’s not something you can or want to do than you wait like everyone else. It’s not that I don’t get what you are saying I think like @yulilin3 said they are going with the most fair option available for all.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Which to me seems more fair for everyone. Yes it may be a longer wait for you but you always have that option to offer up extra money for access. If that’s not something you can or want to do than you wait like everyone else. It’s not that I don’t get what you are saying I think like @yulilin3 said they are going with the most fair option available for all.

Agree with that!

But you were making a FAIRNESS argument (which I totally get and agree with!) and I was just making a LOGICAL point that I’ll be waiting longer given their choice.

But I am NOT arguing against them making the choice they have — it gives a better experience to MORE people (and a worse experience to a much smaller number). Seems like the right call for early on.

 

[Runnsally]

Ok. I tried to make my logical argument about wait times. Obviously didn’t work out. I’ll leave it at that.

Good call

 

[Runnsally]

We may never see typical FP in SWGE. May be part of a new tier that’s paid FP only.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Good call

Don’t be cranky. We worked our way to clarity above thanks to @yulilin3 . Read a couple of posts above yours.

 

[crvetter]

Your standby wait likely will be long but instead of 5 hours it will be 2-3. It’s a proven fact that FP slows the standby line.

While it slows the standby line it hasn’t increased wait times in the standby line by its very nature. Yes it increases the capacity of the standby line but by removing the capacity of the of the FastPass. If those people that were in FastPass move to standby the standby wait time should be the same as shown below:

So consider this ride that has a 100 rider per hour capacity.

Under FastPass
1) 90 people are assigned to the FastPass line for each hour
2) There is X people in standby line with an X/10 hour wait.

Remove FastPass
1) Now you have to add 90*X/10 people to the standby line
2) Resulting in X+90*X/10 people in the standby line which simplified to 10*X people in the line.
3) Resulting in the wait time of 10*X/100, which simplified to X/10 same as without FastPass

So under the assumption everyone in the FastPass rides the ride then the wait time won’t drop.

The only argument for why it may have increased standby lines is people in the FastPass line would never ride the ride without FastPass. But a fair amount of them would have to not ride to result in a 50-60% reductions in the wait time. In fact 60-70% of them would have to not get in the standby line, which I’m not sure you’ll get that many dropping off from riding.

Also I believe many sites that track wait times have shown wait times haven’t increased significantly with FastPass. Actually without FastPass you are likely going to see wait times be inconsistent throughout the day but the wait time through the day will average the same.

 

[rteetz]

While it slows the standby line it hasn’t increased wait times in the standby line by its very nature. Yes it increases the capacity of the standby line but by removing the capacity of the of the FastPass. If those people that were in FastPass move to standby the standby wait time should be the same as shown below:

So consider this ride that has a 100 rider per hour capacity.

Under FastPass
1) 90 people are assigned to the FastPass line for each hour
2) There is X people in standby line with an X/10 hour wait.

Remove FastPass
1) Now you have to add 90*X/10 people to the standby line
2) Resulting in X+90*X/10 people in the standby line which simplified to 10*X people in the line.
3) Resulting in the wait time of 10*X/100, which simplified to X/10 same as without FastPass

So under the assumption everyone in the FastPass rides the ride then the wait time won’t drop.

The only argument for why it may have increased standby lines is people in the FastPass line would never ride the ride without FastPass. But a fair amount of them would have to not ride to result in a 50-60% reductions in the wait time. In fact 60-70% of them would have to not get in the standby line.

Yes the capacity doesn't change whether there is FP or not but the standby line is constantly moving instead of stopping to allow FP in. Doing this not only makes the standby line more efficient it is better for the CM working the line. Instead of constantly counting and watching to cut off the line at the merge points they just keep the standby line flowing which also makes for less angry guests.

So with the increased flow your wait is theoretically less. There is no way to guarantee your wait is less with or without there being FP but the constant flow makes everything more efficient. That is the biggest advantage to doing this. I am sure many of us have seen disgusted faces on guests as FP guests move through and standby has to wait for them.

To me starting it this way is the best possible option for Disney and guests. If you want a shorter wait you are going to have to take your chances at rope drop or buy an add on/tour.