LET THE FLAMES BEGIN>>>adult only dining

[robinb]

{sniff}

Nobody likes me.
Everybody hates me.
I'm gonna eat some worms!

 

[Cinderella37]

How did you learn to drive? Did you immediately take the car on the Interstate and hit 70 mph the first time you were behind the wheel?

If you learned to sew, was your first project a wedding gown?

When you learned to cook, was your first project a five course meal?

I really doubt that you immediately were immersed in the new situation. You had to have a training period before you jumped into the real thing. So why can't parents take their children to a less adult restaurant to teach them how to act in a restaurant? After they master that, then try a more upscale restaurant. Or maybe when the parent masters the act of parenting, they can bring the child to a more adult venue.

How do you know the child in question wasn't just having a bad day? It could have been his/her twentieth experience in an upscale restaurant. On top of the fact that any time I've been to Jiko it hasn't been too quiet. I also wouldn't use the above instances to compare a child being unruly at a restaurant. It doesn't matter what type of restaurant you visit with kids - the rules should be the same. Allowing them to act differently at different types of restaurant just confuses kids. Also, I don't think parenting can ever be mastered. People make mistakes as parents, as spouses, as employees, as bosses. Parenting is not a skill to be mastered; it's a journey that allows one to learn from his/her mistakes and adjust behavior accordingly. My point is, you never know what's going to cause a change in a child's behavior. Children psychologically and physically do not have the same control over their behavior as adults do.

 

[Bird-Mom]

You mean, the breast-feeding in public, co-sleeping, signature restaurant taking parent club? I thought I was the only one.

Sign me up!

 

[Wee Annie]

Chobie -- you're getting popular!

 

[chobie]

Chobie -- you're getting popular!

I feel like Jan Brady when she got the wig!

 

[Wee Annie]

a great episode, I must say.

 

[justhat]

How do you know the child in question wasn't just having a bad day? It could have been his/her twentieth experience in an upscale restaurant. On top of the fact that any time I've been to Jiko it hasn't been too quiet. I also wouldn't use the above instances to compare a child being unruly at a restaurant. It doesn't matter what type of restaurant you visit with kids - the rules should be the same. Allowing them to act differently at different types of restaurant just confuses kids. Also, I don't think parenting can ever be mastered. People make mistakes as parents, as spouses, as employees, as bosses. Parenting is not a skill to be mastered; it's a journey that allows one to learn from his/her mistakes and adjust behavior accordingly. My point is, you never know what's going to cause a change in a child's behavior. Children psychologically and physically do not have the same control over their behavior as adults do.

I think that's a very insightful, accurate post. Well said!

Just wanted to add my daughter loves your photo with Mike and Sully! She's a huge fan of character, and loved Sully, and she immediately recognized him in your photos and squealed. That reminds me, if there's ever a restaurant my daughter will cry in, it's those character meals! She loves them so much and has such a hard time waiting her turn and gets very sad when they leave our table. We'll be at 4 during our April trip so beware!

 

[wdw4life]

I feel like Jan Brady when she got the wig!

a great episode, I must say.

I've been just lurking on this thread but if it turns into a Brady Bunch one I may have to join in!

 

[nwdisgal]

Chobie and Robinb - You rock!

I've been lurking on this post for a bit too. Finally had a bad hair day today or maybe it's PMS acting up, and want to add my two cents. WDW is a kid place and that's why I love it so much - watching little kids and big kids experience the joy and fun of the place. If I want privacy without kids and five star restaurant accomodations I expect that at French Laundry or maybe the Ritz Carlton. Anything at Disney is fair game in my opinion. Yah, parents should be in control of their kids, but I've experienced a lot more rude adults at WDW than screaming kids in restaurants. Kids need to learn restaurant etiquette and WDW is a great environment for teaching that. The one given is that you have to be 21 to get into the bars - definately won't find any screaming kids there, but maybe screaming adults

 

[jdmccol]

First of all if your tired of the way people act at Disney, then don't go. As far as a restaurant being "adult", if they offer a kid's menu than it is not an adult restaurant. That's my opinion and apparently the opinion of many other parents at WDW. If you don't share that opinion, too bad. I much rather deal with "naughty" kids than condescending judgmental adults.

I agree - you are going to run into families with children in WDW. It's not Las Vegas. Even though I am very critical about my kids behavior at restaurants, I think that I am more tolerant now about other peoples children than when I didn't have children. It's easy when you don't have experience to be critical about other people's children. While I am talking about families VS adults only, I don't understand the point of WDW having an adults only PI. I don't see it fitting into the family atmosphere of WDW. Would Walt have agreed to it?

 

[ladysoleil]

wow. this thread has gone on forever. As a newbie, I'm almost scared to post.

DH and I are child-free. This doesn't mean we don't like children, or don't enjoy their company. If we were kid haters, I don't think WDW would be the best vacation choice for us.

We'll be celebrating our anniversary at CG. I must say that I'm hoping that any kids there will be well-behaved that night, and let us enjoy our special outing, but realistically, we're dining at Disney. I expect that there will be kids there.

Honestly, as someone without kids, I would really be interested in an adult-only restaurant, but it wouldn't make or break my vacation. That said, if we do get our meal disrupted, I will admit that I'd be disappointed, but I knew it was a risk when we booked it. caveat emptor, right?

 

[JLS]

In my mind, the issue is not even the fact that Jiko is an expensive restaurant, but just the behavior that will be tolerated by the parents in any establishment where there are other people around. Everyone can or should be able to understand that kids can have meltdowns and that cannot always be controlled or effectively stopped immediately. The main problem here is the adults who allow their children to run around the tables and engage in other activity that is inappropriate for ANY restaurant. If I was at Chili's in my neighborhood, I would not expect that someone's children could just run screaming through the restaurant or be throwing food or coming up to my table, etc. I do not expect that someone will allow their children to run screaming down the aisle of an airplane, which is behavior that I have seen. Does that mean that an airplane should be "adults only" or that kids don't belong there? No. Does that mean that you should "expect" there to be no bad behavior from kids (i.e. crying, meltdowns, some excessive noise, etc.)? No. What is means is that there can and should be an expectation by others that adults will know what is appropriate to allow their children to do in public places where some decorum is called for (obviously this would not apply to parks, playgrounds or other places where running around is encouraged).

 

[TDC Nala]

How about a child-only restaurant?

We've got another thread here where someone says they called to book an Akershus princess lunch in April for two adults and was told they could not book this meal because there were no children in their party.

They said they would check back and make sure that's true, but if it is, closing off an entire WDW restaurant to adult-only parties would be as wrong as telling adults they can't dine with their children.

 

[agnes!]

Nala -

I saw that post too - the one where the poster was told by the Dining CM that adults-only parties were not allowed to book the Princess Meal/Norway(sorry, can't quite remember the actual name!). Hope it's not true...I may have to check that news out myself to make sure!

agnes!
PS - Yeah, Nala, *that* agnes .

 

[TDC Nala]

Hi, Agnes!

How'd you know it was me? I can't imagine.

BTW, the other poster called back about the no-adults thing and said it was erroneous information.

 

[Nadine and Fred]

How did you learn to drive? Did you immediately take the car on the Interstate and hit 70 mph the first time you were behind the wheel?

If you learned to sew, was your first project a wedding gown?

When you learned to cook, was your first project a five course meal?

I really doubt that you immediately were immersed in the new situation. You had to have a training period before you jumped into the real thing. So why can't parents take their children to a less adult restaurant to teach them how to act in a restaurant? After they master that, then try a more upscale restaurant. Or maybe when the parent masters the act of parenting, they can bring the child to a more adult venue.

 

[chobie]

 

[Nadine and Fred]

Hi Nadine and Fred,

Just offering a different perspective here Whilst I agree that it can be annoying to sit through a meal with a loud, screaming child nearby I would say it totally depends on the individual circumstances and the particular reason why the child was crying! If the child is just plain badly behaved, shouting and screaming continuously in a 'spoilt-brat' kinda fashion (" I want a new toy **NOW**"!!!) with the parents doing nothing to deal with this behaviour well then, yes, having to put up with that would bug the hell out of me.

However, if the child is crying due to perhaps banging his head or some mishap then I'd understand that. Furthermore (and this is the point I am so long-windedly trying to make!) I would add that the child might have special needs, some of which are impossible to detect to an outsider. For example, when my eldest child, who is now almost 11, was 3, he suffered from autism (I say 'suffered' past tense because due to intensive therapy, his symptoms have diluted to the point where he is no longer autistic in a diagnostic sense). Whilst some situations were a total no-no for him, other situations were hard to avoid, for example, trips to restaurants whilst on holidays (we always went self-catering but even so we couldn't *always* eat-in due to scheduling etc).

When choosing a restaurant, we had to do our best to avoid crowds and loud noise as it was too upsetting for him and would bring on violent tantrums so therefore (and ironically) the last places we could choose would be kiddie places because the noise and crowds were bound to be more intense, thereby greatly upsetting him. We would choose quieter, more sedate places with calmer atmospheres. Having done that we would then do all in our power to prevent tantrums but of course, lo and behold, despite our best efforts, something unexpected like a sudden noise, an alarm, an overly-friendly waiter trying to chat to our son or a million other things from the shape of the plate to the strength of the lights in the room might set him off and we're there with a 3 year old screaming on the floor with eye-rolling and tut-tutting in abundence from neighbouring tables!!! Now, we would then try to depart as quickly as possible having packed up our food and tended to our other still-hungry baby (now 8).

An exaggurated likelihood I know but I guess my main point is that it truly depends on the reason behind the tantrum and that's not always evident. But I know I have been judged often during our then occasional restaurant trips, walking down the street (with screaming son lying on ground having meltdown!) and almost anywhere else you care to think of!! People do sometimes jump to the worst possible conclusion i.e. "that child is a brat" as opposed to "perhaps that child has special needs".

Please don't think I'm saying that you are jumping to the wrong conclusion. I'm just putting a different perspective out there

Thanks for your thoughtful comment. I too, would be sympathetic to a child who had hurt himself and who was crying from pain. I do not think that this was the case with this child. I also do not think this child was "special needs" or at least I hope not (by virtue of the way the parents were talking to the child)

 

[justhat]

Just thought I'd share my experience at a restaurant tonight. My daughter and I are home alone since my husband is on call tonight, so I figured we'd go out to eat. So off we went to the restaurant across the street, an upscale Chinese restaurant (no takeout, more like Nine Dragons in Epcot). I brought our large stroller, so I kept her in that during the meal, no need for a high chair, but had her facing me and behind me a window. We were seated across from the podium where you check in and the owners, an elderly Chinese couple, kept looking in our direction and then finally came over and started talking to my baby and me. They had a granddaughter born 10 days after my daughter so they were very interested in her and had a great time playing with her. Everytime they went back to the podium to seat someone or answer the phone, my daughter would peer around the back of her stroller to see where they went. If they had to stay at the podium awhile they'd smile, wave, and play peek a boo with her from where they were, across the restaurant. Apparently they didn't think it was rude to do this in their restaurant, and since they own it I'd imagine they have a good idea of what annoys most people and if they thought playing with a baby did they wouldn't do it. So without reading this thread, that experience would have cemented it in my mind that interacting with a baby is acceptable.

 

[chobie]

Just thought I'd share my experience at a restaurant tonight. My daughter and I are home alone since my husband is on call tonight, so I figured we'd go out to eat. So off we went to the restaurant across the street, an upscale Chinese restaurant (no takeout, more like Nine Dragons in Epcot). I brought our large stroller, so I kept her in that during the meal, no need for a high chair, but had her facing me and behind me a window. We were seated across from the podium where you check in and the owners, an elderly Chinese couple, kept looking in our direction and then finally came over and started talking to my baby and me. They had a granddaughter born 10 days after my daughter so they were very interested in her and had a great time playing with her. Everytime they went back to the podium to seat someone or answer the phone, my daughter would peer around the back of her stroller to see where they went. If they had to stay at the podium awhile they'd smile, wave, and play peek a boo with her from where they were, across the restaurant. Apparently they didn't think it was rude to do this in their restaurant, and since they own it I'd imagine they have a good idea of what annoys most people and if they thought playing with a baby did they wouldn't do it. So without reading this thread, that experience would have cemented it in my mind that interacting with a baby is acceptable.