3/20 Show Topic - Service at WDW

[nikmasteed]

As someone who hasn't been to WDW within the last 14 years, but with a trip booked for this August, I was really interested in the topic discussed on the show posted yesterday.

The topic spun off of the major changes in Disney company restructuring, new charges for resort parking, and overall sentiment that customer service has gone way down over time. All of which have been discussed elsewhere on the boards ad nauseam, so I don't intend this thread to be a repeat of any of those.

I respect the opinions of Pete and the team and regard them as experts, but I watched the show and finished it thinking that maybe it was a little bit hyperbolic in tone. I get it, these guys see these parks almost every day and really can notice significant declines over a period of time. I wonder if the perspective is similar from those that see the parks in more of a snapshot, with visits every year or so. I read posts enough to get a sense that frequent guests are displeased with decisions and definitely seem to notice service declines, but the imagery evoked during some of the discussion really went extremely negative. Is it really THAT bad?

I'm mostly talking about Charles' comparison to getting closer to a Wal-Mart experience, and comments such as "trash left all over the place". Comparing to WalMart, I would say, is a pretty extreme comparison-- I remember WDW as being incredible with service many years ago, and while I've read enough to not expect perfection when I go, I certainly do not expect a WalMart experience.

 

[jeminijohn]

I went for the first time back in September a day after hurricane hit and it was awesome first experience for me. The park was empty and the workers were all rested and ready to go. We have been twice since then. We flew out one Friday night from Knoxville and came in on Saturday and flew back next Sunday morning. I am hooked.
I can see Pete’s point about robbing the great experience from guests in the name of cash and profits. I am sure 15 years ago the nastalgia and order was Much better. I wish he would’ve went into more depth in how it was then just for the sake of painting the picture. I don’t mind the price increases cuz I never got to go as a kid and I’ll just pay the piper and still show up 3 times a year.
Things evolve and corporation mindset will infect the magic of the place, but I’ll still show up.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

It is an interesting quesiton about perception and how if you see something often you will notice small differences much more than someone who goes much less frequenty

Also, I think people tend to notice (and thus comment on) negative experiences much more than positive ones and if you are used to amazing experiences the negative things stand out more. On the flip side, when looking back many years at memoreis at overall positive experiences I think you hold onto what made them so positive more than any small thing which took away from it - also making any recent negative things stand out more because you don't remember the negative things that did happen longer ago (hope that all makes sense - sort of connected to recency bias and just how memories work)



We go about once a year - so fairly often but not nearly as much as the DIS team goes - and I don't feel like we see the same "down turn in service" that the team sees. I will say that in more recent years I have seen some full garbage cans (which I feel like we didn't see in the past) and also feel like you do see more rides that have not working animatronics or areas that need pain jobs, etc. One example that stands out to me is on It's a Small World a number of ceiling tiles were missing. Things like that feel like things that you didn't see in the past. At the same time I have never seen a dirty bathroom and have always had great encounters with Cast Members there (though, don't tell Pete and gang but overall I have had much better experience with CMs at Walt Disney World than at Disneyland in CA, so I might be an outlier)

 

[WDW_Ding]

Here is what I can say, as someone who has been to WDW about 20 times in the last 10 years and someone who owns DVC.

In general, the thing I have noticed the most over these 10 years is that the parks are simply more crowded.

We used to be able to go in January and February and the parks would be very empty. Now, there are barely any times when the parks are that empty.

Most of the complaints that the regular visitors have could be mainly attributed to these increased crowds. The crowds increase wait times at the rides, wait times for food, and make walking around slower and harder.

The attractions themselves have gotten better, IMHO. Many of the queues have been upgraded (Haunted Mansion, Poo, Dumbo, Space Mountain, Big Thunder) and various rides have been expanded to handle more visitors (Toy Story Midway Mania, Soarin'). Many rides have been added in the past 10 years (Midway Mania, new Soarin', Flight of Passage, Na'avi River, 7 Dwarfs, Under the Sea, Frozen) too.

The general atmosphere of the parks and the cleanliness of the parks has perhaps gone slightly down, but I would say that is mostly due to the crowd levels. If I were pressed to state a concrete position on this, I would say it is neutral...that in general, outside of crowds, WDW is about the same as it was 10 years ago in terms of "quality".

Now, I'm not saying that WDW hasn't had its share of negative occurrences. But, generally, the negative things are offset by something else positive, IMHO.

I, too, often tire of hearing various podcasters, commentators, and writers bemoan what they see as the sorry state of WDW and complain that, basically, WDW ain't what it used to be.

But, for me, as someone who has been to WDW at least 2 times per year for the past decade, I would say that WDW has actually improved a bit. The only actual negative I can point to is the crowds. I do wish WDW would do something about how many people they let in to the parks, in general.

 

[jeminijohn]

they are very crowded. We went in February and man alive was it packed. #danceteams. We are going Memorial Day weekend and i am actually looking forward to a jam packed crowd just for the schooling. Because this will be how it’s gonna be from here on out and might as well try and educate myself on how to navigate through.

 

[WDW_Ding]

I wanted to add that I didn't even say anything about FastPass+, which is an upgrade over the paper system, IMHO.

Also, WDW has added great WiFi service to the parks as well.

Those shouldn't be ignored...

 

[DLgal]

If the parks are dirtier it is mostly because people are disgusting pigs and custodial just can't keep up. The cleanliness issue is one that varies so drastically day to day that it can't be blamed 100% on WDW staff. Sometimes the crowrds are simply overwhelmingly full of messy, disgusting people who don't have any sense of how to dispose of their trash and exercise basic human decency.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

That's a good point @WDW_Ding - crowd levels are definitely up and that can just bring more anxiety to guests and CMs - obviously I have no stats but I would guess that the CM to guest ratio is probably a bit lower than it used to be

I do also understand that the training the CMs go through (Traditions) has been cut (I think from 3 days to 1 or less) - sot that can't help. But I agree with you that it is still overall very positive

And it would be great to go back to the 70s and 80s when there were low crowds and you didn't need to make dining reservations earlier that the day you went to the park (when EPCOT first opened there was a phone bank you would go to to make your dining reservations for the day - obviously that wouldn't work today) - but that just isn't happening nowadays ... so i think the question needs to be more "is Disney doing what they can with the crowd levels that are there to make it as positive as possible in this "new reality" " - rather than "why isn't it as good/the same as it used to be?"l

 

[jeminijohn]

I won’t tell Pete. And, yes, fast pass + is awesome. Although a friend of mine says the old system was better, but all good things must come to an end. Everyone’s situation is different.

 

[WDW_Ding]

obviously I have no stats but I would guess that the CM to guest ratio is probably a bit lower than it used to be

I would guess that is correct. And I would guess that some of that is a conscious decision by WDW. :-(

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I won’t tell Pete. And, yes, fast pass + is awesome. Although a friend of mine says the old system was better, but all good things must come to an end. Everyone’s situation is different.

It definitely works better for some and the old system worked better for others. I totally get why they have it (to increase the likelihood of more people can get on at least some of the key rides they want) but also get why people are frustrated about having to plan 30 or 60 days out from their trip in such detail. Personally I would much rather plan and stress prior to my trip and then have at least an idea of a plan and know what rides we have a FP for and what we will have to do standby for, etc. but others loved the idea of rope dropping and running to get your paper FP, etc.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I would guess that is correct. And I would guess that some of that is a conscious decision by WDW. :-(

to some extent I am sure - particularly on what was "slower times" ... but when the parks are at or near max capacity there is only so much room for CMs (I mean, how many can you have behind one Ice cream counter, for example).

 

[WDW_Ding]

but when the parks are at or near max capacity there is only so much room for CMs (I mean, how many can you have behind one Ice cream counter, for example).

Good point.

 

[Tonyz]

I usually go at slower times, but I've never seen trash overflowing, dirty bathrooms, cast members behaving badly, etc. I think people have a way of really exaggerating the bad at this place, especially someone like Ryno who instantly compares it to the perfection that is Disneyland.

I stayed at Animal Kingdom Lodge during Hurricane Irma. I told my story here, but during one of the most stressful times in the history of the park, cast members not only met my expectations but easily beat them. I saw the very best of cast members and Disney service in a very difficult time. So forgive me, but I don't care if an occasional cast member is grumpy during a peak day in the middle of summer. There is a level of entitlement when you expect every cast member to be at the top of their game every moment of the day, and then feel free to complain about how bad this place has gotten when they don't meet those expectations. They're allowed to have bad/off days just like everyone else.

 

[loves to dive]

I've been going since 1983 or 1984 (can't remember I'm old) and yes, I've seen a little decline in overall service but it's not horrible. Like others, I feel it's probably due to crowd levels. I can't imagine trying to deal with the level of people coming and going and the attitude of most of those people is "it's all about me". I would get down right mad and might even get rude every once in a while and I'm southern, it takes a lot to make us rude. I don't think in all my years of going I've had a rude CM, I've had some bad service in the restaurants yes it happens, I've had some CMs who were doing there job and not always smiling but never rude. I've seen some bathrooms that were less than clean but at the same time have seen CMs trying to keep up with the nasty people throwing toilet paper on the floor or not flushing. We used to tease that we were pretty sure pixies came into the parks at night and cleaned them up and even during the day you could plop down on the street and not get dirty. While it's not that clean, again it's very crowded and hard to keep up the massive amount of people who can't walk a foot over to throw their trash in a can and would rather throw it on the street. Does it cost more than it did back then? Of course, what doesn't. Is it expensive, yep, it always was for us. I was a single mom working as a secretary, I had to save for 2 years to go. Have they started charging to extra experiences? Of course but they always did, there was always something you could pay extra for. Yes, we loved the days you would go to GS in the morning and book your ADRS for that day, remember the little TVs at Epcot where you talked to someone? Loved that. Frankly, we still do it day of, we don't book anything 120 days out, usually not even our resort is booked that far in advance. You aren't forced to make ADRs that far in advance, we book them day of just about every day and have always been able to find somewhere to eat. Do you have to stand in lines? You bet ya. Again, if you want to hark back to the good ole days, you stood in line then. I can remember standing line a hour to ride a ride and not thinking a thing about it. Things change, it's the way of the world. I can't think of anywhere we vacation or even go out to eat that hasn't slightly declined through the years. Ever tried to get a real customer service person on the phone for anything and have them be polite and actually help you? Nigh on to impossible.

 

[ParryOttertheChosenBoy]

I appreciate the Dis team input and especially liked Ryno's sentiments. Very well said.

We just went at the beginning of December and had a really good experience. There were a few bathrooms that were not great, but all of our service at the hotel, restaurants (almost exclusively quick service), and attractions was overall good. Listening to the show and knowing what I now know about what cast members are paid, there were a few times I noticed standout CMs and was so impressed with their attitude despite the crap end of the deal they probably get from Disney. It made me happy to see such a good employee, but on the flip side it also made me sad to know that they probably aren't being paid their "worth."

Even though our experience was a good one, we were also so excited to be there that I'm sure there are things we overlooked. I'm sure people who experience Disney more frequently would be coming from a different place and would be better positioned to notice declines in service and quality.

I will say, it was definitely WAY more crowded than we expected even after checking the crowd calendars. We had 3 people in our party and the odd-man-out was never paired with a stranger on rides, even ones with long wait times. At the time I thought it was nice, but now after listening to the show with Len I wonder if this is just part of the "operating well under capacity" thing.

 

[kbelle8995]

I just recently got back. Now for the most part CMs are still polite and greet you with a grin but once in a while. The bathrooms in Epcot were pretty clean.

The Parking Trams however need to replaced or rehabbed. They seem like they have been beaten to death. That wouldn't have happened years ago. And no I don't go everyday. Maybe once or twice a year. I live in Florida but not locally.
But it was unbelievable crowded which I expected Spring Break. But it seems like the park more crowded on most days than they used to be.

I now prefer to Stay at Cabana Bay. The all-stars and Pop just seem so run down in comparison.

 

[*NikkiBell*]

In all honesty, I haven’t watched the show in quite some time (other than a snippet or segment here or there), so I didn’t see the discussion you’re referring to. With that being said, I think those who are local and frequent the parks may notice differences more so than those that go once a year. Similarly, if your job has been to cover, and thus analyze, a resort, park, event, or attraction, it forces you to look for the faults and make comparisons to the past whether or not you realize you’re doing it. I know this from experience and feel that may be what is happening here.

I visit WDW three times a year and have noticed a decline in cast member service and trash cans overflowing, at times. However, it is not such an issue that it detracts from the regular guest experience. Part of me believes that I had heightened awareness of these concerns due to coverage on the show. I don’t necessarily think I would have had the same view otherwise. Again, when you are looking analytically at something, the negative becomes a focus either intentionally or unintentionally.

You will have a wonderful trip. Enjoy it!

 

[Spencer Wright]

It is an interesting quesiton about perception and how if you see something often you will notice small differences much more than someone who goes much less frequenty

Also, I think people tend to notice (and thus comment on) negative experiences much more than positive ones and if you are used to amazing experiences the negative things stand out more. On the flip side, when looking back many years at memoreis at overall positive experiences I think you hold onto what made them so positive more than any small thing which took away from it - also making any recent negative things stand out more because you don't remember the negative things that did happen longer ago (hope that all makes sense - sort of connected to recency bias and just how memories work)



We go about once a year - so fairly often but not nearly as much as the DIS team goes - and I don't feel like we see the same "down turn in service" that the team sees. I will say that in more recent years I have seen some full garbage cans (which I feel like we didn't see in the past) and also feel like you do see more rides that have not working animatronics or areas that need pain jobs, etc. One example that stands out to me is on It's a Small World a number of ceiling tiles were missing. Things like that feel like things that you didn't see in the past. At the same time I have never seen a dirty bathroom and have always had great encounters with Cast Members there (though, don't tell Pete and gang but overall I have had much better experience with CMs at Walt Disney World than at Disneyland in CA, so I might be an outlier)

I more or less totally agree with you and also go annually. I think that the WDW magic has been slowly chipped away, and it appears this trend might be accelerating. I have noticed little things, such as on Splash Mountain last year there was a child's hat on Brer Bears club from the first day to the last day of the trip. These details quickly add up to cause a serious decline in quality.

To me, the restuarants especially have great service and the CM's in them are absolutely wonderful! Also, many of the resorts, such as the AKL still offer wonderful service. All of the negative threads and stories coming out (its far from just the DIS or even hard core Disney people) is seriously starting to make me feel bummed about my trip in August, which I have been counting down to from last August's trip! However, on the trip reports board there are still overwhelmingly positive reviews. Also, people coming back are reporting positive experiences.

Yeah, maintenance is down and crowds are poorly managed, but as of now, we still seem a ways off to a tipping point where people say forget Disney, and try something else.

 

[Spencer Wright]

If the parks are dirtier it is mostly because people are disgusting pigs and custodial just can't keep up. The cleanliness issue is one that varies so drastically day to day that it can't be blamed 100% on WDW staff. Sometimes the crowrds are simply overwhelmingly full of messy, disgusting people who don't have any sense of how to dispose of their trash and exercise basic human decency.

I once asked my sister how bad can women's rooms really be at WDW (one day a couple of Junes ago she walked in one and turned right around and walked out). I almost immediately regretted it! People really are pigs!!!