Prices just hit my threshold :-(

[bpadair32]

Heres


What happens, however, is that with more increases, people move from group to group. People from #1 slide to #3. People from #3, slide to #2. Disney will have to entice more consumers to join group #1. Currently, they are doing this with luxury offerings. Those that are not into the luxury offerings, are rumbling that we are being moved and not lured back or kept in #1 by increased capacity, or other offerings of interest.

You are misunderstanding my point. Group #1 is not going to change, no matter what. Group #3 is not going to change no matter what. Group #2 is where the flux is, and some of them will still go and some will not. Some will move from one side to another within that group, but Group #1 and Group #3 will never change. Thats my point.

 

[dlavender]

You are misunderstanding my point. Group #1 is not going to change, no matter what. Group #3 is not going to change no matter what. Group #2 is where the flux is, and some of them will still go and some will not. Some will move from one side to another within that group, but Group #1 and Group #3 will never change. Thats my point.

I disagree. I love Disney, but can still move from "will always go" to "on the fence". I think the two groups "will always love and go" and "will never go", and would never change, are very small groups.

 

[eliza61]

when I have gone to Walt Disney World lately, I have seen no shortage of young families. I guess some are anticipating that will change.

Actually I don't think it will change but it could produce a very real unintentional backlash. Small business owners face this all the time.

Usually a family has a budget for vacations, it's usually a total dollar amount, so when you raise the price in one area, some thing else in another area gets effected.

If you have a budget of 4000K, you say ok we're spending A dollars on lodging, B- dollars on tickets, C-dollars on food and souvenirs. Now ticket prices have gone up

A few options can happen

1) You can try to lower your cost by moving to a lower cost time period (this is what disney hopes)
2) You can try to absorb the cost of the increase. Not happening so much in this economy. healthcare up, food up, no raises. my vacation budget has not increased.
3) You can lower your cost by spending less in other areas. this is the easiest and possible the most damaging possibility. I'm a young family, I've planned on going to the world for a year and now I've got an additional 400 dollar charge. Now the easiest way for me to bring that down? Ok hon, we're skipping breakfast at BOG, 90 bucks for 4 people and the youngins probably won't eat that much. Ok hon let's cut the dessert party. on and on and on.

So now you've got a possibility of not lowering the attendance and people are spending less.

apologies for the change in font size. my laptop is old and going bonkers.

 

[mom2rtk]

1) You can try to lower your cost by moving to a lower cost time period (this is what disney hopes)

That's already been going on in a very big way I expect. That's what brought about all the "What happened to the low crowds in September" threads.

 

[bpadair32]

That's already been going on in a very big way I expect. That's what brought about all the "What happened to the low crowds in September" threads.

Thats probably part of it, but I think a much bigger part is people hearing so much about how low the crowds are in September. Therefore, a lot of people decided to go during "low crowd times" and they turned them into normal crowd times.

 

[mom2rtk]

...Disney and any other company can charge what they want....Our family decides if we are okay with paying it...be it for park tickets, plane tickets, hotels...cars..eating out etc...everyone decides what's best for their family

Glad to know you're ok with it. I'm not.

I give wide berth to companies to charge what they want in a free market. I love the free market. But I believe there does reach a point where they go too far into sheer unadulterated greed. (Evidenced by that question about Disney being greedy on the recent AP survey).

 

[eliza61]

That's already been going on in a very big way I expect. That's what brought about all the "What happened to the low crowds in September" threads.

I wondering if it's sustainable mom, the only reason why I say that is because from some of the grumblings on the budget boards, Disney greatly reduced the discounts that use to move people to September.

which once again, has me questioning the real story behind this tiered pricing scheme. seems to me as easy way to get folks to go during slow times would have been to simply give them 45% of their room rates.

 

[dlavender]

So now you've got a possibility of not lowering the attendance and people are spending less.

This is what happens. I know for us, we went from Moderate to Value. Then if it continues, it will go Value to Off Site. The budget doesn't change, but the trip does.

 

[goofy4tink]

Disney owes you the ability to use your points for the same value that you could in 2001. They are giving you that. There was nothing about joining DVC that required Disney to give you anything else.

True. Assumptions were made. When we buy APs, we expect to be able to use them when staying at our 'home away from home'. Now, we have to choose between paying a bit more but living with blacked out dates or paying a lot more and getting 365 days.
Please, come back here, in a few years, after paying a pretty hefty chunk of change to buy DVC, and let all of us know how you like the changes Disney makes. They have been myriad since I bought DVC. And all those changes have made my DVC experience less than it was when we purchased.

Heres the simple truth. This change is going to have very little overall effect on Disney, especially in a negative way and here is why.

There are a group of people that love Disney, love everything about being there, and are going to go to Disney. This won't change.
There is a group of people that do not love Disney, have no desire to go to Disney, and were never going regardless of changes. This won't change.
There is a group of people who were on the fence, either about going in the first place or continuing to go. Some of these people will go, and some won't.

Overall its not going to change much.

You have forgotten a very large group...those that love Disney, who have significant time and money spent, but who are disappointed in the way Disney is making changes. Yes, it's a business. No, not everyone can afford to go. We get that. And yes, we know things change. But.....when Disney increases prices, yet makes it a lesser experience, all while telling us they are making changes to provide their guests with a better experience? Yep. Some of us see through that, and are so disappointed in Disney. Many of us have been through this same type thing with Disney over the years. And most of the time, it has not been 'better'. I could give you many examples. I just don't have the time at the moment.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

My issue is with the cost of the shorter tickets. Essentially, there's no discount until you get to a 4-5 day ticket. It makes it difficult to find the value in a 1 or 2 day visit. We're currently Sea World annual pass holders & would have loved to have squeezed in a day or two at WDW this year and next.

 

[Disneychick75]

At one time, Disney was considered a vacation for those who were, if not wealthy, then certainly comfortable. Seems that is the direction they're heading again because with the price increases, only those people will be able to afford it OR Disney will once or maybe twice in a lifetime trip for most.

 

[wendyt_ca]

I would love if the prices were lower but honestly it won't stop me from going at all. Realistically this is impacting people going multiple times and if my biggest problem in my life is that I can only go to Disney once in a year then I'm lucky. I still will buy the AP's though because we plan our trips within a 12 month span and it is still cheaper than buying park passes on each trip. It isn't just Disney raising their prices, it is everywhere. This is how the economy works and the value of money changes. I honestly find more people than ever are going to Disney. Growing up I never got to go to Disney and knew very few people who did. The ones who did were considering insanely lucky. Now I am regularly hearing about people I know or co-workers going to Disney. So I don't think Disney is concerned.

 

[lugnut33]

For America’s middle-income vacationers, the Mickey Mouse club, long promoted as “made for you and me,” seems increasingly made for someone else. But far from easing back, the theme-park giant’s prices are expected to climb even more through a surge-pricing system that could value a summer’s day of rides and lines at $125.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ke-disney-world-left-the-middle-class-behind/

 

[GreatLakes]

I believe that Disney has adopted a Vegas mentality. They would rather have one "Whale" family visit than 10 value-conscious, repeat customers.

I think this as well and it makes sense. The cost of

For those who say, "I hope the price increases mean less people in the parks", I want you to take a look back at previous price increases in Disney history and see what that has done to the crowds. OK, I'm waiting for you to find a time a price increase has made a difference in the crowd levels...... come on I'm waiting.

The only time crowd levels have dropped is when we head into an economic recession, but then Disney comes up with some good special offers and fills the parks back up. During those down times it does seem to force Disney to focus on quality.

The purpose of these changes, in my opinion, is a combination of spreading out the crowds so that the parks are always busy while maximizing per guest profit at the times when the parks are already busy. Disney doesn't want less people in their parks at busy times, they want less locals or gusts who don't spend as much once inside the parks at the historically busy times. I do think the price increase in the AP will mean less locals in the parks during most of the busiest times and that is good. Not only because they make it crowded but because they bring down the average per guest profit.

Variable pricing might not alter the number of people in the parks but it very well may increase the average per person profit. I don't have access to the data but I would guess those people willing to pay more to go are also more willing to spend additionally while in the park instead of skip souvenirs because this is their 4th trip in the last two years.

It is a win-win. You still have crowds at all times of the year but you are shifting the less profitable guests to times when the crowds were historically low. If Disney can even out the crowd curve so that a 2 and 9 on the crowd calendar is very close they can normalize staffing levels and that is good from an operational perspective.

 

[HeatherL1985]

It seems that the majority of factors that bring down guest satisfaction have to do with crowding and the subsequent strain on the parks' infrastructure. Perhaps a raise in prices will push some people out of the park, reduce the strain on infrastructure and also maintain the bottom line necessary to make enhancements? Perhaps this might increase guest satisfaction and bring the value back up for those who can still afford to go? I think it is totally reasonable for a business to employ a model that increases satisfaction, reduces asset wear and provides value to their customer so I cannot hate on Disney for doing it.

If this is what they are doing, though, I feel like it is a shortsighted solution for a company that used to be so imaginative and inclusive. I may be the only one, but I think there is a difference between "magic" and "special effects". To me, magic is something that impacts you mentally or emotionally whereas special effects are something you see but know are fake. I feel the shift of discontent comes from those who prefer to feel the magic than to see special effects and are tired of seeing something so nostalgic and dear be replaced by smoke and mirrors.

 

[Planogirl]

For us it has mostly been about lowering our costs. Universal is a big draw for us but them aside we do a lot more offsite than onsite at WDW. That is a marked change from how it once was for us. At one time is was all Disney all the time.

 

[Gr8t Fan]

You have forgotten a very large group...those that love Disney, who have significant time and money spent, but who are disappointed in the way Disney is making changes. Yes, it's a business. No, not everyone can afford to go. We get that. And yes, we know things change. But.....when Disney increases prices, yet makes it a lesser experience, all while telling us they are making changes to provide their guests with a better experience? Yep. Some of us see through that, and are so disappointed in Disney. Many of us have been through this same type thing with Disney over the years. And most of the time, it has not been 'better'. I could give you many examples. I just don't have the time at the moment.

This!!! Exactly. We've been regular visitors since 1993 and this is the straw that broke the camel's back for our family.

 

[lugnut33]

I think this as well and it makes sense. The cost of


The purpose of these changes, in my opinion, is a combination of spreading out the crowds so that the parks are always busy while maximizing per guest profit at the times when the parks are already busy. Disney doesn't want less people in their parks at busy times, they want less locals or gusts who don't spend as much once inside the parks at the historically busy times. I do think the price increase in the AP will mean less locals in the parks during most of the busiest times and that is good. Not only because they make it crowded but because they bring down the average per guest profit.

Variable pricing might not alter the number of people in the parks but it very well may increase the average per person profit. I don't have access to the data but I would guess those people willing to pay more to go are also more willing to spend additionally while in the park instead of skip souvenirs because this is their 4th trip in the last two years.

It is a win-win. You still have crowds at all times of the year but you are shifting the less profitable guests to times when the crowds were historically low. If Disney can even out the crowd curve so that a 2 and 9 on the crowd calendar is very close they can normalize staffing levels and that is good from an operational perspective.

Maybe Disney should institute a rule that guests are only allowed to visit once every 5 years, and if your family makes less that 75K you can only visit once in a lifetime?

 

[bpadair32]

This!!! Exactly. We've been regular visitors since 1993 and this is the straw that broke the camel's back for our family.

And in my example you would be in group #2. If something is the "straw that broke the camels back" you were already on the fence.

Maybe Disney should institute a rule that guests are only allowed to visit once every 5 years, and if your family makes less that 75K you can only visit once in a lifetime?

And people call me snarky and disingenuous.

 

[GreatLakes]

Maybe Disney should institute a rule that guests are only allowed to visit once every 5 years, and if your family makes less that 75K you can only visit once in a lifetime?

No need for a rule. They spend $2 Billion on a system designed to gather accurate data on the individual guest level. They are using that data to adjust pricing policy. They don't need to ban guests that don't meet a profit threshold, they just need to manipulate pricing to increase that guests profitability either by them paying more to attend at certain times or moving them to different times.

Despite everyone crowing on about Disney "wasting $2 billion of FP+" they actually spent very wisely on a data warehouse and analytics system that will allow them to better monetize every category of guest. It's exactly that kind of project I would love to be a part of.