What is going on with Disney parks?

[we"reofftoneverland]

I don’t think it is the economy. We travel and cruise a lot (not on Disney) and cruises are packed and as expensive as ever and flights are packed and also priced high (I check a lot). I think it is Disney. They have taken their customers for granted and people are voting with their feet. They have cut back in so many ways and have started to become too “politically correct” in a lot of instances which decimates creativity. Case in point: Star Wars. Let’s be honest. No one loves the new Star Wars. It’s garbage. It’s too p.c. and self indulgent. And now they’ve opened an entire boring “world” about pc Star Wars that only has one ride to date which is pretty much the same ride as Star tours and then there is a ridiculously overpriced lightsaber store and nasty overpriced blue and green drinks. My kids couldn’t wait to leave and head back to the resort. What opened before that? Avatar world, as we call it. Not one person I know likes avatar. Not one. Why would Disney build that? Ah... another PC story about how evil corporations are. So remedial. And rich, coming from a corporation. Whatever. Although at least Pandora has one very cool ride and the environment of the area is kind of cool. But let’s face it— that expansion, except for Flight of Passage, was phoned in too. So, people are tired of a lack of creativity coupled with ever increasing prices. I for one really miss the fife and drum guys and gals who used to walk around the American experience at Epcot and liberty square at MK. I also miss maelstrom. I hate the way Disney doesn’t police entrance to resort pools. And I’m still not fond of the “new” fast pass system, although I’ve gotten used to it. I could go on.

 

[Jack_Sparrow_NJ]

The bottom line is that Disney is trying to see how far they can increase prices while cutting back on services. Yes there are people who can or won’t be willing to accept things as they are and they will stop coming. It’s no longer an affordable famijy vacation. But there are others willing to dig deeper into their wallets. They are changing the median income of those attending their parks. Will it have a negative effect and reduce revenues, probably, only time will tell. Will they walk back prices? I don’t see that happening.

 

[YesterDark]

I don’t think it is the economy. We travel and cruise a lot (not on Disney) and cruises are packed and as expensive as ever and flights are packed and also priced high (I check a lot). I think it is Disney. They have taken their customers for granted and people are voting with their feet. They have cut back in so many ways and have started to become too “politically correct” in a lot of instances which decimates creativity. Case in point: Star Wars. Let’s be honest. No one loves the new Star Wars. It’s garbage. It’s too p.c. and self indulgent. And now they’ve opened an entire boring “world” about pc Star Wars that only has one ride to date which is pretty much the same ride as Star tours and then there is a ridiculously overpriced lightsaber store and nasty overpriced blue and green drinks. My kids couldn’t wait to leave and head back to the resort. What opened before that? Avatar world, as we call it. Not one person I know likes avatar. Not one. Why would Disney build that? Ah... another PC story about how evil corporations are. So remedial. And rich, coming from a corporation. Whatever. Although at least Pandora has one very cool ride and the environment of the area is kind of cool. But let’s face it— that expansion, except for Flight of Passage, was phoned in too. So, people are tired of a lack of creativity coupled with ever increasing prices. I for one really miss the fife and drum guys and gals who used to walk around the American experience at Epcot and liberty square at MK. I also miss maelstrom. I hate the way Disney doesn’t police entrance to resort pools. And I’m still not fond of the “new” fast pass system, although I’ve gotten used to it. I could go on.

I love the new star wars movies.

 

[Mattimation]

This is such a fascinating topic, and I’m glad to hear I’m not alone in the Disney burn out. As I’ve read through this thread over the last couple of days, I’ve realized my breaking point came a while ago, and I didn’t even notice it. I used to be a one-trip-a-year person, but that stopped two years ago. In the couple of years since then, we’ve gone on vacation and Disney has always been on the list of possibilities, but we’ve sprung for other things because they’re cheaper and easier to plan, instead choosing to go to San Francisco and Cape Cod.

I think, for us, none of the new stuff has seemed interesting. We didn’t care for Avatar and weren’t interested in Avatar Land. We have gone and were impressed, but mostly wondered what they could eventually turn it into if all of the sequels flop. Toy Story was the first movie I remember hating, so Toy Story land is of no interest to me, and Star Wars has such a toxic fandom that I avoid anything branded with it like the plague. The last additions I remember being excited about was AOA (which was a huge disappointment) and New Fantasyland (which I absolutely love). Of course every Disney fan is different, so I know hundreds of people are excited for these new things, but personally it’s been a string of misses for us and we’re not going to rush to an extra-crowded park for attractions we don’t really need to see.

We’ll check all of the new stuff out at some point, but probably not for a couple of years. I’ve been wanting to plan a big birthday trip for during the 50th Anniversary, so we probably won’t return until sometime in 2021. I have been beginning to wonder if that’s several thousand dollars that would be better used elsewhere though, so depending on the 50th’s details we may even skip that.

 

[yorkieteacher]

I don't think it is the economy-yet, and hopeful that won't become it for us. We are retired, and have a line for travel in our budget. We can travel when it is "off season" and get some bargains. For us, it is the pricing. I can take a trip to Europe with a tour agency specializing in tours for seniors for not much more, including airfare, than a trip to Disney for the week, and we are close enough to drive. We took one Disney cruise with out grandson in 2015, and I just didn't see the 'magic' being worth the extra cost for the cruise. We have cruised twice since then with other companies. We are doing two WDW trips this year with our children and grands, because we wanted to see it through their eyes, and our kids were planning on going anyway. After our trip in March 2020, unless there is a surprise opportunity, we probably wont go to WDW again until 2022, and again with our grands. We have a trip to the UK planned in June of 2020, a trip out west in the USA for the fall of 2020, and a tour to three Scandinavian countries in 2021, all of which will cost LESS than a week at Disney! I LOVE Disney, but I want to be able to see other places while I am still healthy and active. It's a choice-

 

[tlmadden73]

I dont think it is doom and gloom yet, but it may be the beginning. They are making a lot of decisions that makes it a LOT easier to question going or staying on-site.

I cancelled our mid-October trip. We took a last minute trip in August (SWGE prreviews) that filled the void that October was going to fill. But I cancelled it more for personal reasons (didnt want to pull son out of school AGAIN (after pulling him twice last school year for trips).

Trying to book a last minute Adults only trip for Early November ..and I cant find a single room (besides campsite or EXTREMELY expensive Deluxe rooms). .. so obviously Disney is doing fine in the filling rooms department this fall.

After a year of staying on site (with an AP), they may be driving us off-site next trip. As a driver, if I get charged for parking at a resort anyway, I may as well save money and stay off-site. A lot of places you can stay at nearby are not far at all from the parking lots.

 

[NickC]

For us, it is not about the money. We loved being at WDW because of the feeling of being there. It was something special that you could only get in WDW. It seems to me that their priorities are no longer on maintaning that feeling. And, absent that 'feeling,' it's just another theme park.

 

[Moliphino]

Actually I'm excited! This may be the best time to go to WDW. Crowds levels are insanely low. Hasn't been that way for a few years now.

We were there for the last week and the crowds were the best we've seen in years (aside from weekend nights at F&W). It certainly made the trip more pleasant.

 

[Mollygirl21]

For us, it is not about the money. We loved being at WDW because of the feeling of being there. It was something special that you could only get in WDW. It seems to me that their priorities are no longer on maintaning that feeling. And, absent that 'feeling,' it's just another theme park.

Agree. I find travel in general is just more expensive than ever, not just Disney. But I will continue to choose Disney every 2-3 years if I still get that feeling when I'm there.

FWIW, we were initially booked on a cruise with NCL but changed it to a Disney vacation. We are paying about the same for the week however, to keep the cost of the Disney trip down, we used points for park passes and also for flights. I still think the Disney trip would be about equal to the cruise once we factor in all the extras on either trip even if we had to pay cash for passes.

Edit to add: this cost comparison is for 8 nights at AKL (rented points). If we had chosen a value, the cost of Disney World definitely be less than the cruise

 

[Mikey15]

I love the new star wars movies.

Me too.

The haters sometimes think they're the only ones that get an opinion.

 

[Kaleidodad]

I don’t think it is the economy. We travel and cruise a lot (not on Disney) and cruises are packed and as expensive as ever and flights are packed and also priced high (I check a lot). I think it is Disney. They have taken their customers for granted and people are voting with their feet. They have cut back in so many ways and have started to become too “politically correct” in a lot of instances which decimates creativity. Case in point: Star Wars. Let’s be honest. No one loves the new Star Wars. It’s garbage. It’s too p.c. and self indulgent. And now they’ve opened an entire boring “world” about pc Star Wars that only has one ride to date which is pretty much the same ride as Star tours and then there is a ridiculously overpriced lightsaber store and nasty overpriced blue and green drinks. My kids couldn’t wait to leave and head back to the resort. What opened before that? Avatar world, as we call it. Not one person I know likes avatar. Not one. Why would Disney build that? Ah... another PC story about how evil corporations are. So remedial. And rich, coming from a corporation. Whatever. Although at least Pandora has one very cool ride and the environment of the area is kind of cool. But let’s face it— that expansion, except for Flight of Passage, was phoned in too. So, people are tired of a lack of creativity coupled with ever increasing prices. I for one really miss the fife and drum guys and gals who used to walk around the American experience at Epcot and liberty square at MK. I also miss maelstrom. I hate the way Disney doesn’t police entrance to resort pools. And I’m still not fond of the “new” fast pass system, although I’ve gotten used to it. I could go on.

My kids and I all love Avatar and the new Star Wars. Some of what you say here is valid, but this kind of hyperbole hurts your overall argument.

 

[Mikey15]

My kids and I all love Avatar and the new Star Wars. Some of what you say here is valid, but this kind of hyperbole hurts your overall argument.

Even past the hyperbole, half the "argument" is complaining about "PC" things because representation is bad or something.

And calling Pandora "phoned in"... the land with incredible levels of detail like a very good optical illusion of "floating" mountains, with all kinds of "bioluminescent" lights, pods that trigger sound effects when you stick your hand in them, etc.. It's hard to find the silver lining for that argument. People like me who don't care a lick about Avatar are impressed with what they've done.

 

[TiggerBouncy]

I always find these interesting....

On one side: The Disney parks are empty. No one is going. Disney is priced themselves out of the market.

Then I see posts like these within a few days:

Saw wait times of 110 minutes for Splash and 40 minutes for Small World! Every single ride had huge waits. It didn’t affect us as we know how to tour but it felt like Xmas crowds! It was unbelievable for September.
The 10 pm closing was a disaster. Mobs of people everywhere and they closed down the monorail promptly at 11 leaving thousands of people in line for the ferry. Can’t imagine what would happen if there was an emergency. People were just laying on the ground sleeping. A man in front of us collapsed on the ferry from the heat and crowds. He seemed ok after we helped him up. Got off Space at 10 pm and got to our car at 11:50!

Halloween parties have been getting increasingly more crowded. This new pa$$ they invented for parties are making them even more crowded!

I can post dozens more. I am not down there. Which am I to believe? Are the parks ghost towns or are they sea of humanity crowds? It's so confusing!

 

[rteetz]

I always find these interesting....

On one side: The Disney parks are empty. No one is going. Disney is priced themselves out of the market.

Then I see posts like these within a few days:

I can post dozens more. I am not down there. Which am I to believe? Are the parks ghost towns or are they sea of humanity crowds? It's so confusing!

It seems over the past week crowds have picked up. Halloween parties are also not necessarily indicative of the daily crowds as it’s a special event.

 

[DisneyKoyote]

Was reading some articles and they were saying that the average annual salary of families visiting DW is ~90k (I'm assuming this is before tax), with central Florida residents making even less at ~$40K. They also said the average cost of a disney trip for a week with 2 parents/2 kids is $5-6k. I'm not sure how accurate these numbers are- lemme know if you think it's within the right ballpark. But I was shocked...I don't know why, but I was expecting the average DW family salary to be well into the $100k's considering how pricey Disney is.
FYI the articles I read were mostly published in the last 3 years I believe.

 

[TwoMisfits]

Was reading some articles and they were saying that the average annual salary of families visiting DW is ~90k (I'm assuming this is before tax), with central Florida residents make even less at ~$40K. They also said the average cost of a disney trip for a week with 2 parents/2 kids is $5-6k. I'm not sure how accurate these numbers are- lemme know if you think it's within the right ballpark. But I was shocked...I don't know why, but I was expecting the average DW family salary to be well into the $100k's considering how pricey Disney is.
FYI the articles I read were mostly published in the last 3 years I believe.

The immense numbers of Floridian visitors probably drag down the average...I'm betting the average for "flying" visitors is in the $100Ks...

 

[DisneyKoyote]

The immense numbers of Floridian visitors probably drag down the average...I'm betting the average for "flying" visitors is in the $100Ks...

VERY TRUE, I did not think about that at all! So I guess taking out all the Floridian visitors, most of the families should probably be close to even $200k...

 

[shh]

My kids and I all love Avatar and the new Star Wars. Some of what you say here is valid, but this kind of hyperbole hurts your overall argument.

agreed. I loved Avatar and know several other people who really liked it too. I do think WDW is missing HUGE opportunities to make this land far more impactful by adding characters, maybe even a parade, music and much more to bring the story and culture of the planet to life more vividly, like they do with every other movie and character in their library - so the land can live well beyond the movie itself and won't have to depend upon successful sequels. But WDW hasn't shown any interest in doing that: just the 2 rides, food and merch.

I do think the leadership is very limited in vision - they only know how to invest in 1 headliner ride and costly merch vs immersion from all angles and senses the way Walt used to. That's going to hurt them imo - when you look at how good UO's Harry Potter areas are and what's to come.

(The diff? HP author retained full creative control and didn't allow UO to cheap out or cut corners...WDW had no such gatekeeper.)

 

[Mikey15]

Was reading some articles and they were saying that the average annual salary of families visiting DW is ~

Families "visiting," right? Not all of them "staying at"?

I don't think Disney World could get near the attendance it does without the plentiful supply of affordable accommodations (hotels, timeshares, AirBNB/VRBO) in central Florida. Only so many people are willing to pay the price of the "bubble," even among those that can "afford" it.

 

[DisneyKoyote]

Families "visiting," right? Not all of them "staying at"?

I don't think Disney World could get near the attendance it does without the plentiful supply of affordable accommodations (hotels, timeshares, AirBNB/VRBO) in central Florida. Only so many people are willing to pay the price of the "bubble," even among those that can "afford" it.

Correct, so they might be staying at an offsite hotel but still going to DW. And completely agree...on site hotels are so pricey. Especially the ones at the Polynesian where the villa is above the water...the prices are hitting close to the real ones you can get at Bora Bora that comes w their own butler...