Here now, and here is the problem

[lugnut33]

I am not stupid about crowds as we almost always have to travel during holidays and summers. We have done trips during Christmas week. You just can't shrug this off as it being busy, but there is a change coming and it will effect you. Also busy times are busy because that's when most people go.

Here's what is most concerning, once the old system goes away you will get 3 choices (even if it's 4 choices in the end), rest of the time it's standby. I see where we used FP-all the time for the lesser attractions and even rode some of the major rides a couple of times in a day. That is going away.

And during busy times you can't just change your times because those times won't be available. You are locked in and honestly that is a PITA. Old system you pulled as you needed. Now you do as Disney wants.

They are taking away tangible benefits from the guests. They are transforming the vacation by lowering what you can expect to get.

I saw long lines to get into the FP line, and yes showing tickets us way faster than scanning the band. Those FP lines will only get worse. I observed a lot of CM just finally letting people through when the Mickey wouldn't turn green. You can literally feel the frustration in the air and it's effecting the CMs.

We are DVC owners and we will need to think long and hard about keeping our shares because this is a huge cut in what we had come to expect at WDW.

 

[Shaden]

I am not stupid about crowds as we almost always have to travel during holidays and summers. We have done trips during Christmas week. You just can't shrug this off as it being busy, but there is a change coming and it will effect you. Also busy times are busy because that's when most people go.

Here's what is most concerning, once the old system goes away you will get 3 choices (even if it's 4 choices in the end), rest of the time it's standby. I see where we used FP-all the time for the lesser attractions and even rode some of the major rides a couple of times in a day. That is going away.

And during busy times you can't just change your times because those times won't be available. You are locked in and honestly that is a PITA. Old system you pulled as you needed. Now you do as Disney wants.

They are taking away tangible benefits from the guests. They are transforming the vacation by lowering what you can expect to get.

I saw long lines to get into the FP line, and yes showing tickets us way faster than scanning the band. Those FP lines will only get worse. I observed a lot of CM just finally letting people through when the Mickey wouldn't turn green. You can literally feel the frustration in the air and it's effecting the CMs.

We are DVC owners and we will need to think long and hard about keeping our shares because this is a huge cut in what we had come to expect at WDW.

And to think I was SO close to buying DVC this spring/summer, and instead, just at my initial reaction to FP+ and some worries it was giving me, decided instead to rent DVC this year and see how this all pans out....

 

[jdonat]

We're off for the parks in 13 days -we'll be there startng the 12th. We tested FP+ very very early (Oct 2012) so, we'll see what FP+ does to our days. We're NOT linking our AP's to FP+. We'll probably get Magic Bands, but will more than likely use our KTTW's for purchasing and such -my DW really doesn't like stuff on her wrist at WDW (gives her a tan line) . We're DVC members, and AP holders and are very familiar with the ebb and flow of the parks, even during this time period. We're not likely to get rid of our DVC points -there are many other places that we can use them, both within Disney and without. Keeping our AP's, well that may be up for grabs. We'll probably renew, as we have a very important planned trip in early Feb.. youngest DD wants to spend her 21st at the Resort!

We'll see how this trip goes. I posted a letter written a few weeks ago regarding my concerns about FP+ and DMX. I'm going to send a followup letter, good or bad to Disney about how our trip was. I'll post that too, and whatever answers I get from Disney.

 

[Silock]

Looks like everyone who predicted this happening was right.

 

[ArwenMarie]

There was very limited same-day availability to change times last week, which was a low-crowd week. I do think it's going to turn into a system where you plan ahead, and that's pretty much it, you stick with it. Wait until they bring everyone else on the system.

 

[scrappinannie]

We noticed this when we were there last week in October. Granted, not a huge crowed level time, but still we noticed standby lines were much longer than we had experienced the last time we went in October. We were not a part of the FP+/MB testing, so we had KTTW cards that we could still scan at the turnstiles but we stood and waited almost an hour for Winnie the Pooh! My DH took DD on Space Mountain with a paper fast pass and I bet they waited in the fast pass return line for half an hour. It was just crazy. I'm hoping they adjust things a b it as full roll out continues to include all park guests but I'm worried that waiting in long lines is the way of the future.

 

[Eosphotog]

Ride capacity does not change. The average number of rides/attractions per guest (assuming attendance is flat) will not change and may actually will go up as empty seats in less popular attractions fill up.

What FP+ does is level the playing field. It is distribution of wealth on an amusement park level. For everyone who was riding 20 attractions per day through careful management of FP and planning there were people who only got a handful in. The 20's will go down, and the handfuls will go up. From a statistical stand point you can think of it as the standard (or more accurately the mean) remains the same but the standard deviation goes down.

Most people on DIS are probably on the high end of the curve. Their experience will become "less". But it is all for the greater good. At least in Disneys eyes.

 

[mesaboy2]

Ride capacity does not change. The average number of rides/attractions per guest (assuming attendance is flat) will not change and may actually will go up as empty seats in less popular attractions fill up.

What FP+ does is level the playing field. It is distribution of wealth on an amusement park level. For everyone who was riding 20 attractions per day through careful management of FP and planning there were people who only got a handful in. The 20's will go down, and the handfuls will go up. From a statistical stand point you can think of it as the standard (or more accurately the mean) remains the same but the standard deviation goes down.

Most people on DIS are probably on the high end of the curve. Their experience will become "less". But it is all for the greater good. At least in Disneys eyes.

Makes sense to me.

 

[ArwenMarie]

Ride capacity does not change. The average number of rides/attractions per guest (assuming attendance is flat) will not change and may actually will go up as empty seats in less popular attractions fill up.

What FP+ does is level the playing field. It is distribution of wealth on an amusement park level. For everyone who was riding 20 attractions per day through careful management of FP and planning there were people who only got a handful in. The 20's will go down, and the handfuls will go up. From a statistical stand point you can think of it as the standard (or more accurately the mean) remains the same but the standard deviation goes down.

Most people on DIS are probably on the high end of the curve. Their experience will become "less". But it is all for the greater good. At least in Disneys eyes.

I agree with this, that is exactly what they are doing...redistributing. Which is fine, their business, their choice.

I do wonder what they are doing with the tiers though. You would think that just by redistributing the FPs from the people who used more than 3 a day, to those who didn't, they would achieve more people riding more headliners.

The tiers make me think that either the ride capacity is far worse than we think and they are gearing up for when they bring non-resort customers on OR they are gearing up to tier by offsite/onsite/level of resort. Or sell them.

We shall see I guess.

 

[mikehn]

I know where all this is going and Im sure others do too. First, everyone will be limited to 3 FPs. And soon after that, people who want more FPs can do so, for a little extra. It will turn into a fee based system. Disney already knows you will pay to play.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

I know where all this is going and Im sure others do too. First, everyone will be limited to 3 FPs. And soon after that, people who want more FPs can do so, for a little extra. It will turn into a fee based system. Disney already knows you will pay to play.

I wouldn't object to this, but I think that would be a fairer way to do it than to offer extra FP+ reservations to people staying at higher end resorts.

 

[xlunascientia]

From my experience yesterday. Thanksgiving. I had fast pass plus for magic kingdom. My sister had for Epcot including test track. At 1:00 I was able to cancel fast passes and get the same selections for her rides. Just slightly different times. Couldn't copy from person to person exact time wasn't available.

 

[ArwenMarie]

I know where all this is going and Im sure others do too. First, everyone will be limited to 3 FPs. And soon after that, people who want more FPs can do so, for a little extra. It will turn into a fee based system. Disney already knows you will pay to play.

And if they do this, I bet that the price magically equals the incremental price increase that you would pay to stay onsite...Kind of like how people book Universal rooms instead of just buying the Express Pass.

 

[mom2rtk]

I know where all this is going and Im sure others do too. First, everyone will be limited to 3 FPs. And soon after that, people who want more FPs can do so, for a little extra. It will turn into a fee based system. Disney already knows you will pay to play.

But the limit right now is 3. And the slots are mostly full. And the balance of the FP slots available through the legacy fastpass system are disappearing much faster then ever.

Just where are those "extras" for sale going to come from?

 

[wisblue]

I would like to see some of these discussions broken down by park, because I think the dynamics of each park are significantly different.

DHS and Epcot are very similar because they each have two extremely proper attractions which are currently tiered. But, the MK is significantly different because it has many more attractions and the variety of them appeals to different groups of people. Therefore, the demand on one or two attractions isn't the same as at DHS and Epcot.

DAK is also different because the crowds there aren't as large as at Epcot and DHS.

I have been watching the wait times and FP return times on MDE the last couple of days, and my 2 biggest observations are:

1. FP- at the Big 4 at DHS and Epcot (which always went very fast) now go faster, and the standby lines seem to build up a little faster before reaching their peak. This is an inevitable result of having some FP capacity allocated to FP+. But, I haven't noticed anything that I would consider unusual for the standby lines for the other attractions.

2. The patterns of wait times and FP- return times seem pretty typical for a holiday time. maybe the FP- for PP and Space go a little faster, but they always went fast.

I'm not sure that anyone who typically arrives at either of these parks at about 11 AM or noon on a really busy day (and we know there are thousands of those) would notice anything different or unusual. Long lines and limited FP availability have always been the case at these times.

I haven't seen anything to change my mind that anyone eligible for FP+ who can be satisfied riding each headliner once a day will still be able to do that by arriving at the park early. People who want to ride any of the Big 4 multiple times a day are going to have a harder time doing that without some longer waits on very busy days. To me, that is the biggest point of difference (although not the only one) between proponents and opponents of the FP+ system.

 

[jade1]

But the limit right now is 3. And the slots are mostly full. And the balance of the FP slots available through the legacy fastpass system are disappearing much faster then ever.

Just where are those "extras" for sale going to come from?

Can't argue with that. Maybe they will lift the no expansion ban soon.

Are folks still double dipping? I would assume all of those could be sold eventually.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

But the limit right now is 3. And the slots are mostly full. And the balance of the FP slots available through the legacy fastpass system are disappearing much faster then ever.

Just where are those "extras" for sale going to come from?

There's no reason why there can't be more FP+ slots when they get rid of legacy completely.

 

[clsteve]

Can't argue with that. Maybe they will lift the no expansion ban soon.

Are folks still double dipping? I would assume all of those could be sold eventually.

Those will be taken by off-site when they're brought on the system

 

[tim123]

I know where all this is going and Im sure others do too. First, everyone will be limited to 3 FPs. And soon after that, people who want more FPs can do so, for a little extra. It will turn into a fee based system. Disney already knows you will pay to play.

I tend to agree with the above posts. When we were there in October after nearly 7 years (average time between visits)…I absolutely LOVED the new system. Yes I was familiar with WDW so I was able to plan which parks on which days. Still I got Park Hoper to enjoy EMH in MK til 1am. I booked our WDW vacation just two weeks out! I booked FP+ one week out (before tiers) and got EVERYTHING I wanted. AND, was able to change a bit on day of, no prob. PLUS I was able to get dining reservations a day or two before for everything including Le Cellar, Hoop De Doo and Cal Grill, Ohana etc., perfect main eating times i.e. 7pm dinner, 1pm lunch, 9am breakfast. I have never never been able to get those times or ressys before. Never.
There were many many glitches with the blue lights, "no you don't have park passes, no you don't have FP, no your room key doesn't open sorry,etc." The cast members were absolutely accommodating, polite and understanding. iPhone proof was and absolute MUST. Then they just pulled us aside clicked an iPad, apologized and said "come on in!"
During our time there (October 27-30).. we NEVER ever waited in a line. Never!
Standby lines were nearly non existent. Maybe 15 minutes tops. Anywhere.
We had a freekin BLAST and had a relaxing, non rushed, world class experience! Plenty of down time to swim and nap.
I guess what I'm saying is this 2013 trip was by far and wide the BEST because of the new system! Glitches and all.
Bottom line for me is off season, off season, off season.
I understand that this is not possible for a majority of travelers…sorry for them.
I do believe as I've said before WDW is a capitalist organization. Meaning they will do what they must to maximize profit. It is their prime motivation and corporate chatter obligation to shareholders. Its the system we live under.
I can promise you that when all the complaints are in they will make you pay EXTRA to ride without lines till your hearts are content. Thats how EMH came about to get you in the resorts. Thats how PH happened to get more $$ outa you and thats why Tom Cruise can stay in the castle and the average Joe can't.
All in all people a vacation is what you make out of it and I think MyMagic rocks and there ain't no going back. The 33,000 acres is what it is and we all love it for 1000 reasons. Thats my 2 cents.

 

[clsteve]

There's no reason why there can't be more FP+ slots when they get rid of legacy completely.

Umm, capacity?

Only if you want to take from standby.