Here now, and here is the problem

[KapBoy77]

Just did it in September at Universal from the Hard Rock and was told it was not unlimited. Maybe we were told wrong. And yes, apparently the new "value" resort won't have it at all. Just early entry.

You were indeed told the wrong information. Stays at the three Deluxe hotels include Unlimited Ride access.

When the value resort (Cabana Bay) open they will not have this perk. Also they will not have access to the water taxis and priority seating at Restaurants.

 

[NickyKnack]

I wouldn't object to this, but I think that would be a fairer way to do it than to offer extra FP+ reservations to people staying at higher end resorts.

SO long as I have the option of paying up to the Deluxe level from our Value room I have no issues with that. But I would hate to be forced to pay Delxue prices for a room that I'm not going to see even 8 hrs a day. We stay at Value because we're in the room the six hours out of the day we choose to sleep on vacation, then long enough to shower in the mornings. Other then that we never see our resort.

 

[bcrook]

It's pretty much been proven on this board by the math wizards here based on the number of visitors and Disney hotel occupancy averages. Someone will post a link to the math at some point. But, yes....it's pretty close to 50%.

I don't know if this is the definitive math "link" but the Walt Disney Resorts have about 27500 rooms. At 80% occupancy rates the number of people staying on site is probably about 70,000 people.

With daily attendance at the 6 parks during average times checking in at 150,000, the off site guests make up about 1/2 or more. During peak times the percentage of off site guests soars.

 

[mikehn]

In 2012, airlines raked in over $6 billion just in fees alone. Southwest is laughing all the way to the bank with their early bird check in fees. Raising ticket prices is old school. Fee based revenue is the trending business model and FP is prime for it. No need to debate FP capacity.

 

[LuvFFPlus]

I don't know if this is the definitive math "link" but the Walt Disney Resorts have about 27500 rooms. At 80% occupancy rates the number of people staying on site is probably about 70,000 people.

With daily attendance at the 6 parks during average times checking in at 150,000, the off site guests make up about 1/2 or more. During peak times the percentage of off site guests soars.

Count me as one of the off site guests.

 

[LuvFFPlus]

In 2012, airlines raked in over $6 billion just in fees alone. Southwest is laughing all the way to the bank with their early bird check in fees. Raising ticket prices is old school. Fee based revenue is the trending business model and FP is prime for it. No need to debate FP capacity.

I agree.

 

[dburg30]

I think that many folks still didnt know about fastpasses before they went to WDW or didnt take advantage of them unless they knew what it was about. With the magic bands and them advertising it and really trying to make sure you know about reserving rides (if you are staying onsite that is) they are going to make those that didnt know about planning ahead happier because they are being told about the fastpass system now ahead of time, and those of us that know how to do disney will not get quite the extras by knowing the system. I'm sure WDW would rather have people that arent as disney savvy as us happier, and not worry as much about us being not quite as happy. They know we'll go back, they want to go those people that got turned off to come back, and I think this will actually help them.

 

[mesaboy2]

I think that many folks still didnt know about fastpasses before they went to WDW or didnt take advantage of them unless they knew what it was about. With the magic bands and them advertising it and really trying to make sure you know about reserving rides (if you are staying onsite that is) they are going to make those that didnt know about planning ahead happier because they are being told about the fastpass system now ahead of time, and those of us that know how to do disney will not get quite the extras by knowing the system. I'm sure WDW would rather have people that arent as disney savvy as us happier, and not worry as much about us being not quite as happy. They know we'll go back, they want to go those people that got turned off to come back, and I think this will actually help them.

They may make this assumption at their own peril. I sense some reaching their breaking points.

 

[dburg30]

They may make this assumption at their own peril. I sense some reaching their breaking points.

I get that.. I guess it's that "some" word... Many times people threaten to not do something, but how many really follow thru? Like you said, it's a gamble to change the game so much, and a LOT of $$$$$$$$$$$$$ has been kicked in. We shall see.

 

[Minniesgal]

I am not stupid about crowds as we almost always have to travel during holidays and summers. We have done trips during Christmas week. You just can't shrug this off as it being busy, but there is a change coming and it will effect you. Also busy times are busy because that's when most people go. Here's what is most concerning, once the old system goes away you will get 3 choices (even if it's 4 choices in the end), rest of the time it's standby. I see where we used FP-all the time for the lesser attractions and even rode some of the major rides a couple of times in a day. That is going away. And during busy times you can't just change your times because those times won't be available. You are locked in and honestly that is a PITA. Old system you pulled as you needed. Now you do as Disney wants. They are taking away tangible benefits from the guests. They are transforming the vacation by lowering what you can expect to get. I saw long lines to get into the FP line, and yes showing tickets us way faster than scanning the band. Those FP lines will only get worse. I observed a lot of CM just finally letting people through when the Mickey wouldn't turn green. You can literally feel the frustration in the air and it's effecting the CMs. We are DVC owners and we will need to think long and hard about keeping our shares because this is a huge cut in what we had come to expect at WDW.

I can't help thinking that if there are less fast passes available to all once this fully rolls out then the standby lines will surely be shorter. I'm sure it will all sort itself out in the long run it is just the transition that is a mess.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

Yes, some are reaching their breaking points. WDW may be prepared for a certain amount of frequent guest attrition, based on their decision that first-time guests appear to spend more.

How much frequent guest attrition are they willing to take, is the question. And will it be more than they anticipated. and how much will they lose to Universal and Seaworld and Legoland.

 

[LuvFFPlus]

Yes, some are reaching their breaking points. WDW may be prepared for a certain amount of frequent guest attrition, based on their decision that first-time guests appear to spend more.

How much frequent guest attrition are they willing to take, is the question. And will it be more than they anticipated. and how much will they lose to Universal and Seaworld and Legoland.

attrition will be small. They will all come back eventually.

 

[bcrook]

I think that many folks still didnt know about fastpasses before they went to WDW or didnt take advantage of them unless they knew what it was about. With the magic bands and them advertising it and really trying to make sure you know about reserving rides (if you are staying onsite that is) they are going to make those that didnt know about planning ahead happier because they are being told about the fastpass system now ahead of time, and those of us that know how to do disney will not get quite the extras by knowing the system. I'm sure WDW would rather have people that arent as disney savvy as us happier, and not worry as much about us being not quite as happy. They know we'll go back, they want to go those people that got turned off to come back, and I think this will actually help them.

I know this makes sense to people, but Disney doesn't even pretend to use this a reason for fastpass+. Ride equity is never discussed.

Here is an interesting article that explains how Disney is heading towards an all-inclusive model.

And this is a quote from CFO Rasulo in yahoo finance article:

QUESTION: If you could talk about the timing of the rollout of MyMagic+. Is there any way to give us a sense of the potential impact from that initiative?

RESPONSE: (Rasulo) We have known for a really long time that getting our visitors to Walt Disney World to make decisions about where they spend their time before they leave home is a powerful driver of visits per guest. When they get into the Orlando market and their time isn't yet planned, they can be subject to everything you see down there, which is a lot of in-city marketing for all the many products that people have put there to basically bleed off the feed that we fundamentally motivate.

So if we can get people to plan their vacation before they leave home, we know that we get more time with them. We get a bigger share of their wallet. So that's one thing for you guys to think about. And the second thing is what happens to purchases when they become much more convenient, and you don't spend time queuing up for a transaction, queuing up to get in the park, and you actually have more time to enjoy the entertainment and, subsequently, spend more money doing things — other than standing in line, which, of course, you can't spend any money while you're doing that.

 

[Minniesgal]

Universal doesn't allow its hotel guests multiple rides either. Their Express Pass is good on every ride, but only once per ride. And it's not good at all on their premier attraction, Harry Potter and the Forbidden Journey. They do give resort guests a shot at early entry, which most of them use to take in Harry Potter.

Not true the Universal hotel passes are unlimited you can ride front of line the same ride all day if you wish.

 

[Minniesgal]

This is incorrect for resort guests, unless something has changed in the last year or so. The purchased Express Pass, available to anybody, is once per attraction but hotel guests' EPs are unlimited.

You can also purchase the unlimited at the park gates.

 

[bcrook]

attrition will be small. They will all come back eventually.

Maybe the idea is to limit attendance and charge more per person. Make the same amount of money but not build a lot of new attractions - just enough.

By selling DVC like crazy, they have locked in their customer base.

It's been a trap all along!

 

[LuvFFPlus]

Maybe the idea is to limit attendance and charge more per person. Make the same amount of money but not build a lot of new attractions - just enough.

By selling DVC like crazy, they have locked in their customer base.

It's been a trap all along!

Exactly! Those who bought DVC will have to visit to maximize their investments. If they want to sell DVC then they will lose big time on their purchase. Just like buys a new car, the price drops the minute you left the lot. Those people will be back again I'm sure.

 

[Rosanne]

attrition will be small. They will all come back eventually.

I beg to differ.

Or... they may come back but not nearly as often. Those who go every 6-12 months may start going every 2 years. Those who go 3-4 times a year may go to once a year. I think that is the most likely.

For me, I just went in August. I would have gone in April but am now likely holding off until the following April (2015). We'll see how it all plays out. I think attrition is going to end up being much higher than new business.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

You can stay at DVC without ever once entering a Disney theme park or even purchasing food from Disney. Rent a car, buy your food offsite, do other things offsite, if the parks are unbearable. Of course that would assume DVC members would still want to come to Orlando without Disney parks.

 

[surferdave]

Exactly! Those who bought DVC will have to visit to maximize their investments. If they want to sell DVC then they will lose big time on their purchase. Just like buys a new car, the price drops the minute you left the lot. Those people will be back again I'm sure.

Timeshares aren't that hard to get out of.

Barriers to exit are certainly a deterrent, but if people are not having a good time anymore (relative to what they can have elsewhere) they aren't going to throw good money after bad. Eventually people buy their next car somewhere else, ask General Motors.