Another Sad Thread

[Mskanga]

If people walked a mile in other people's shoes, they would be more compassionate.

That is exactly how I feel , I would not normally wish anything bad on anyone but if they want to compare themselves to my daughter in this case they need to go through nine months of chemotherapy to battle bone cancer , have a knee replacement at the same time and not be able to walk for a year because she is too weak and sick to do the grueling physical therapy.
We are going to DLR in August and I plan on taking advantage of anything we can to make the trip easier for my daughter and I don't care what anyone else thinks.

 

[SereneOne]

That is exactly how I feel , I would not normally wish anything bad on anyone but if they want to compare themselves to my daughter in this case they need to go through nine months of chemotherapy to battle bone cancer , have a knee replacement at the same time and not be able to walk for a year because she is too weak and sick to do the grueling physical therapy.
We are going to DLR in August and I plan on taking advantage of anything we can to make the trip easier for my daughter and I don't care what anyone else thinks.

 

[KPeveler]

That is exactly how I feel , I would not normally wish anything bad on anyone but if they want to compare themselves to my daughter in this case they need to go through nine months of chemotherapy to battle bone cancer , have a knee replacement at the same time and not be able to walk for a year because she is too weak and sick to do the grueling physical therapy.
We are going to DLR in August and I plan on taking advantage of anything we can to make the trip easier for my daughter and I don't care what anyone else thinks.

good for you.

I do not wish ill on anyone, but i wonder what would happen to some of the "haters" out there (meaning people who are belligerent) if they broke their toe before going to disney, and all of a sudden things were not easy anymore... ah well... karma will get them in the end

 

[Mskanga]

You know before that when I encountered people that would complain I always told them , be happy it's not you in their position , now I am going to emphasize that even more.

 

[LilyWDW]

I just want to say...

Personally I am not disabled, thank the gods. However, I have had to study ADA and work on plans that must meet ADA. It is amazing how far the world has come in making sure that those with disabilities have equal and fair access. It is also amazing how far we still have to go...

What you all have to do to live a "normal" life is more then I could ever handle I think. Longer waits for everything from theme park rides to restrooms, getting from place to place, communicating with others... the daily roadblocks are just insane and usually things those of us without disabilities take for granted.

Add to that, people with the same disability (vision issues, autism, mobility issues) may need totally different accommodation's. It is impossible to really say THIS is the rule that will be used for all those who need assistance. It may not be the assistance that YOU (generic you) may need. (One reason my code book is larger then my family bible heh).

EVERYONE has basic rights. EVERYONE should be allowed fair and equal access. During the time I was going through my ADA training, I went into a store (which shall remain nameless). I noticed that many of the aisles were not wide enough to meet requirements. I also noticed that the handicapped stall's grab bars as well as the turning radius in front of the sinks didn't meet requirements. This was a brand new building too! I was astonished and honestly a little ashamed that someone either from my field or one close to what I do would not have realized their errors.

It's just sad that some people seem to think that what helps one person is what will help another...

So, while I don't UNDERSTAND what those with disabilities are going though, I am trying to understand.

 

[SueM in MN]

Just wanted to say thanks for the helpful answers.

A theme park near here just changed their rules to those like Knott's too. It has been in the paper and news quite a bit. So far they claim that no one has complained to them but I really wonder.

Sue, I don't know where in MN you are but I am sure you have heard of the whole Valleyfair issue.

Oh, yes I have heard of it. We're in the North Metro area.

The last time we were at Valley Fair was a long time ago. After stopping at Guest Services and listing DD's limitations for them (can she sit with good balance, can she walk a few steps, can she stand, etc), they marked off which attractions she could go on, let us know those were the only attractions she would be allowed on and handed us her little card (and I do mean little, because there were very few things she could go on).
Armed with our little card, we got into line for the first attraction (an attendant was standing right there, motioning people into the line), got a certain distance into the line and noticed it was getting narrower.
Went a little further and found
a turnstile
and had to back out
past all the people in line behind us
because there was no room to turn around.
The attendants looked at us like we were totally inconveniencing them.

We went on a few things, but haven't been back since we didn't really feel like they wanted us.

I expect there might be some lawsuits out of this. Especially since the articles I read said that they reversed their new rules for people with autism. What about people with similar needs who don't have autism?
Will they get any accommodation, probably not?
What about people who have mobility needs, visual impairment,
etc. and other needs in addition?
In our experience, many places look only at the wheelchair or one need and say the needs are met.
It is against the ADA to look at diagnosis and not needs.

 

[goofieslonglostsis]

What you all have to do to live a "normal" life is more then I could ever handle I think.

Don't ever underestimate yourself. You know, when you get faced with a downfall you deal with it. It's there, so you deal with it. It might take an hour, it might take a day, it mght take years, but one day you (generic) realise that life is here and now and not going away. You'll have to 'do' life with what your given. You'll be amazed at how much any human being can endure and still find a way to have a life and say; I'm happy.

Seriously; you simply don't know how much you can handle until it's at your doorstep. And maybe not even then. I know I was one that once said 'if life hands me this or that, I just know I couldn't handle it and want to jump of a building'. Well, life has dealt me numerous of those 'this or that's and guess what? I'm still here and seriously can say I'm still enjoying life. Sure, you'll dislike some stuff, but people seriously are stronger than they think.

So, while I don't UNDERSTAND what those with disabilities are going though, I am trying to understand.

That's all you can do. Try. Nobody can truelly understand any other person. I can run into 100 people with eds like me, and none of them I could ever truelly totally understand. Everybody is different and therefor the way they look at their lives, feel things etc. Trying, having an open mind and eye, that is all one can do and if you ask me the recepy (spelling?) towards better.

 

[KPeveler]

That's all you can do. Try. Nobody can truelly understand any other person. I can run into 100 people with eds like me, and none of them I could ever truelly totally understand. Everybody is different and therefor the way they look at their lives, feel things etc. Trying, having an open mind and eye, that is all one can do and if you ask me the recepy (spelling?) towards better.

another person here with EDS, and I bet you and I have completly different needs and experiences... which is why they made it illegal to look at diagnoses rather than needs... just cause we have the same "name" doesnt mean we have the same "need."

for instance, most people with EDS type III (and there are many different types) prefer scooters to wheelchairs, because of wrist problems. I, however, do not have wrist problems (mine arent hypermobile, go figure), but I DO have finger problems and do not have enough control to hold down the "gas pedal" on the tiller... so i use my manual chair. this is why teh ADA does not allow for generalizations based on diagnosis...

 

[OneLittleSpark]

Just a quick note to let everyone know that the thread has been closed.

 

[disneymom3]

Sue that is rotten about Valleyfair. Their customer service has always been pretty crappy IMO. DD loves it but she is not looking for the same experience I am.

I have learned so much on this thread! All the info on the ADA is really new to me. Thanks to all who are so willing to share their knowledge.

 

[alizesmom]

Just a quick note to let everyone know that the thread has been closed.

Not surprised but saddened that it has to be this way. Karen

 

[SueM in MN]

I'm sad to see it ended on such a negative note.
Anyone checking out the last page of the thread will see the last post shows only the most negative aspects of the thread.
Mixed in with some very negative things there were some very good thoughts on that thread - both from people with/knowledgable about disabilities and from from people who didn't know, but were willing to try to understand.
And, there were some people who learned that what they saw was very probably not what they thought they saw.

 

[Ziggy]

And, there were some people who learned that what they saw was very probably not what they thought they saw.

Well this has got to be good that it has opened some people's eyes to disabilities.

 

[Belle1962]

I'm sad to see it ended on such a negative note.
Anyone checking out the last page of the thread will see the last post shows only the most negative aspects of the thread.
Mixed in with some very negative things there were some very good thoughts on that thread - both from people with/knowledgable about disabilities and from from people who didn't know, but were willing to try to understand.
And, there were some people who learned that what they saw was very probably not what they thought they saw.

SueM--perhaps as a mod they would let you post this as the "last post". Perhaps modified a bit but I love the part "Mixed in with some very negative things there were some very good thoughts on that thread - both from people with/knowledgable about disabilities and from from people who didn't know, but were willing to try to understand. And, there were some people who learned that what they saw was very probably not what they thought they saw."

 

[SueM in MN]

SueM--perhaps as a mod they would let you post this as the "last post". Perhaps modified a bit but I love the part "Mixed in with some very negative things there were some very good thoughts on that thread - both from people with/knowledgable about disabilities and from from people who didn't know, but were willing to try to understand. And, there were some people who learned that what they saw was very probably not what they thought they saw."

I thought of asking the Mods of that board if I could post a 'wrap up', but I'm not sure if they will agree. When we close a thread on this board, we usually make a post to kind of sum it up/end it/close it. We can do that because this board is not that busy. I think the Mods on the Community Board don't do that because their board is so much more busy.

 

[Mskanga]

What you all have to do to live a "normal" life is more then I could ever handle I think. .

Lily , let me tell you that one never knows the amount of strength that one has inside when faced with something like this.
I never in a million years thought I would be able to handle my daughter having cancer and becoming her nurse 24-7 , and I mean literally a nurse!! We had chemo treatments outpatient which means we would go in for the day of infusion and then the rest was done at home , imagine my house with a hospital set up with medicines , pumps , hydration bags and me being the nurse on call round the clock. All this while still doing the daily routine at home with the rest of the family. Months of sheer exhaustion , dispair and frustration but you know who kept me going ? My own child !!!!
If anyone had told me this years before I would have told you I could not do it.
On the good side is this is such a rare type of cancer that I know more than most doctors and nurses in our area , I kid you not when I say that because it is well documented that most doctors never see a case of osteosarcoma in their career lives , our doctors are actually taking this as an opportunity to educate themselves about it .
I do not know what the future holds for us and how many challenges she will have to face , not only emotional but physical as she was left not only with physical limitations from the knee replacement that she had but she also lost 40% of her hearing from one of the chemo drugs that she took and nobody knows what kind of other side effects the chemo left but one thing I am sure of is that no matter what , we will be able to handle it.

 

[adisneymama]

Well this saddens me too. We will be using our stroller as a wheelchair in August for my DD who is 6. I guess because she "looks" like she is fine they will assume she is. Oh well, it won't discourage me from doing what is best for DD.

 

[Sanchez]

While the thread ended on a negative note, I believe the correct message was received and understood by most. However: 1) There are some that will always remain ignorant of the WDW disability rules. Not much you can do but continue education attempts; and 2) There are some on this side that have little intent in fostering an understanding of the rules, but instead seem more interested in making sure that their personal situation, and not the rules in general, is understood by all and given the appropriate amount of sympathy.

I choose to look at the positives of the thread. I thought that SueM's posts were positive and informative. After reading her posts it would be difficult not to understand that those in wheelchairs and ECV's do not get a free pass to the front of the line. In many instances the wait is longer. The point was well made.

In contrast to SueM's educational and informative posts, there were a few that caused the discussion to denigrate into arguments that were beside the point. When I first read the original post I did not get the feeling that it was mean spirited, but only that it was crafted by someone who is uninformed. Instead of offering a reasoned opposing point and a clarification of current WDW policies the attacks began.

Unfortunately, this is the pattern that most threads regading strollers, ECV's wheelchairs follow. A point or observation is made (usually without malicious intent,) and the attacks follow. It seems as if there can be no reasonable discourse. There are far too many who seem to relish the opportunity to be offended. I just do not think there is much value in needing to prove that life with a disability (or life with someone who has a disability) is difficult. There is certainly no value in wishing harm upon someone else (wishing they get hit by a bus so they could understand what it is like to be you.)

In summary, depending on your point of view you can look at the thread as a success or failure. If it is your intent to educate the uneducated as to WDW policies then the thread was a success. If it is your intent to prove to others life with a disability is not easy and sometimes unfair then you might consider the thread a failure. In my opinion, most people understand the difficulties and do not need to walk a mile in your shoes to have sympathy. Further, they do not like having it shoved in their face and that is why these types of arguments can never be won.

Thanks.

 

[SueM in MN]

I think any time there are strong emotions involved, there is good chance to go (on both sides) into 'dangerous territory' in terms of alienating the other side.
I'm not necessarily better at it than others are, but I've had more time dealing with it than many - my DD with disabilities is 22. Some of the people who posted from their hearts have hearts that are more recently 'wounded' than mine and are at a different point in the acceptance cycle of their/their loved one's disability.
I learned a pretty long time ago that it's easier to make a point with logic and facts (along with documentation of the facts) than with feelings.

 

[KPeveler]

I was very sad to find out this weekend that Busch Gardens Williamsburg (i dont know about BG-T) has the same rules as Knotts... that is too bad - now i cant go back there. I dont know about the rule at some parks that there is a limit to the number of times you can ride the "big" rides with their "virtual queue" (meaning you get a time then come back), but for ALL rides but the coasters and Pompeii, I would have to sit at the exit and wait for my family to go through the line. This is illegal and unacceptable from top to bottom. BG-W was one of my favorite parks (right after disney), and now I cant go there anymore. I cant sit by myself at the exit to a ride, I need someone with me. I assume they will let someone sit with me, as I cannot always push myself in my chair, but then my family is split in half all day. that is NO fun at all!

also, they will judge how able to are to ride the rides at the front gate, give you a card, and those are the only rides you are allowed to ride all day, rather than allowing the person to make the decision after seeing the ride. I understand that is partly for safety reasons but I dont like that some 17 yr old is going to be asking whats wrong with me. How do they make those decisions at the gate without invading your privacy, I wonder?

I think i am going to write a letter to BG and explain my concerns. hopefully the system is not as bad as their website makes it sound