An adult was mean to my child--VENT

[tigercat]

I love Halloween. I used to have great parties for my 3 kids every Halloween. Now saying that I grew up doing "tricks" and when the kids come here they do a trick. Now the trick can be anything. I have had some really creative kids come to the door and they seem to really enjoy it. At least they leave laughing. If a kid doesn't know what to do I have them YELL trick or treat. Don't have a problem with that. I don't get the little one's to do anything but come to the door. It is the older kids that I have do it. I have never had a problem with the kids doing something especially yelling trick or treat. The parents if they are with the kids don't seem to have a problem either. There has to be some fun in the night. I would never not give candy to anyone though.
tigercat

 

[Nik's Mom]

idiot savant: a person affected with a mental disability who exhibits exceptional skill or brilliance in some limited field.

This doesn't sound all that bad to me.

The term "idiot savant" is considered offensive and is not used anymore. I would put it in the same category of a racial slur. It's not the type of word that a person should use. The term was probably acceptable back in the day, just like other racial slurs were acceptable. But now we know better. And if someone doesn't know better, then I'm more than happy to explain it to them.

 

[luvsJack]

The OP said that her daughter's disability was "mild." I wouldn't assume the child was severely handicapped as you ascribed her to be.

If your daughter is disabled that way, she needs someone to be her buddy, to provide a buffer/spokesperson in this type of situation. Not everyone knows that disabilities don't always show on the outside.

While I don't see a need to advertise a disability constantly and to everyone, you need to provide support to help the child at times, not write them off with "some kids cannot learn to 'roll with the punches'" unless the disability is truly severe. Let them be more independent, paying for their lunch at the restaurant or checking out a book at the library on their own. Sooner or later, everyone would hope that their child would be able to handle their basic needs and make decisions, even if the library throws a curveball like new self-checkout machines. In that situation, going to a librarian and asking for help is much better than getting overwhelmed.



I've heard it both ways. I guess it depends on how interactive the candygiver wants to be, *shrugs*



I disagree - it's an opportunity for the shy ones to come out of their shell. No different than being rewarded with a sticker for an achievement at school. (Well, without the tooth decay, lol.) Just because it's different from your experience doesn't make it "beyond ridiculous." It's a fun way to interact on Halloween and as evidenced by the responses to this thread, it's not a unique idea.

FWIW, many places have "Trunk or Treat" in parking lots or cul-de-sacs to replace the house visits entirely. It's very popular in some places, unheard of in others. Different is just different, not wrong.

A little open-mindedness goes a long way. Doing a trick to get a treat is certainly much better than throwing eggs and toilet paper. The Tricks for Treats is far more positive in the long run and fosters communication as well as cooperation.

A very shy child is NOT going to come out of their shell to perform in front of other kids and a strange, witchy lady. Its just not going to happen.

The lady was mean. Every child should have gotten a piece of candy, period regardless of their ability or want to do some stupid trick.

DH's granny was just like this. She had many grandkids and more great-grands. Some she loved, some she liked, some she didn't. For whatever reason she loved my boys (her step great-grands) but disliked dh's brother's boys (same age). She would do this exact same kind of thing, only it was usually gum she was offering up. There was not one thing wrong with her mind, she was just a mean old lady and this lady sounds just like her.

 

[Nik's Mom]

It's been a while since the word police showed up, I was wondering where they went.

Use any word you would like. Words are just that, words. They only have the power you give them so if you choose not to give them any power they will have none.

FWIW Idiot: "a person of subnormal intelligence". If the definition fits...

Didn't we disagree on something last week? Anyway, many autistic children do not have subnormal intelligence. My son is not an idiot. Is that what you are trying to say, because that crosses the line here. Is that what your "if the definition fits..." is supposed to mean?!

 

[hereyago]

OP sorry that happened to your DD.

I don't recall having to do Tricks for a treat. It is supposed to be you don't give me a treat you will get a trick.

One of my DD's first years of TOT. We came across a house with new neighbor's the man was a cop. His wife was drunk as a skunk and wanted the kids' to do just really dumb stuff as if they were a dog. DD was very shy and the woman got mad. See, that was just stupid, because cop or not, I told her to check herself. her husband came out and i told him my kid isn't Lassie and he needs to put his wife in check. He apologized and gave the kids candy and told his wife to get back in the house.


A note about the old woman, as someone posted not every old person is suffering from dementia. and even when they are: wait for it: it is truly how that person is, they no longer have that "filter" that would hold them back. See, dementia and Alzheimers's, has the plaque that covers what would be a person's "filter". When that filter is covered there is nothing to hold them back.

My DM has beginning dementia: BUT, she has always had certain behavoirs that people ALLOWED and enabled. i will tell you it isn't fun being the person who won't give in to her whims. I also can't blame dementia on it, because she has always been like that. So i will get the Oh, your DM is older, blah blah, great, but she has always been a nasty person now it's just amped up.

 

[MineMail]

It is not some random stranger's responsibility, or right, to draw a child out of their shell. They don't know that child and they don't know that child's shell, and it's completely inappropriate to take that into your own hands.

It is not "completely inappropriate" to expect a child to pretend to be something or someone different on Halloween. That's the main idea of the holiday! ROFLOL

Wearing a costume/mask and becoming a character is so liberating and normal that it's often used by therapists to draw children out of their shell and help them imagine themselves not being shy and withdrawn. Playing make believe for one day isn't therapy, but it sure can't hurt.

In any case, the OP should have helped her daughter instead of venting her anger at the older woman. Her other children understood what to do and received candy, it couldn't have been that difficult a task. The kid just needed some guidance and reassurance. Opportunity lost - the lesson she learned was to get angry and rude when someone treats her poorly instead of dealing with it properly.

 

[tlbwriter]

It is not "completely inappropriate" to expect a child to pretend to be something or someone different on Halloween. That's the main idea of the holiday! ROFLOL

It IS completely inappropriate for a stranger to DEMAND that the child act like something in particular or perform a trick that they are not comfortable performing.

Wearing a costume/mask and becoming a character is so liberating and normal that it's often used by therapists to draw children out of their shell and help them imagine themselves not being shy and withdrawn. Playing make believe for one day isn't therapy, but it sure can't hurt.

So you're suggesting that this grumpy old stranger who had never met that child before was providing therapy?????

In any case, the OP should have helped her daughter instead of venting her anger at the older woman. Her other children understood what to do and received candy, it couldn't have been that difficult a task. The kid just needed some guidance and reassurance. Opportunity lost - the lesson she learned was to get angry and rude when someone treats her poorly instead of dealing with it properly.

Or maybe she learned that her mom will stand up for her, and that she doesn't have to accept nonsense from nasty old strangers.

 

[Nik's Mom]

It is not "completely inappropriate" to expect a child to pretend to be something or someone different on Halloween. That's the main idea of the holiday! ROFLOL

Wearing a costume/mask and becoming a character is so liberating and normal that it's often used by therapists to draw children out of their shell and help them imagine themselves not being shy and withdrawn. Playing make believe for one day isn't therapy, but it sure can't hurt.

In any case, the OP should have helped her daughter instead of venting her anger at the older woman. Her other children understood what to do and received candy, it couldn't have been that difficult a task. The kid just needed some guidance and reassurance. Opportunity lost - the lesson she learned was to get angry and rude when someone treats her poorly instead of dealing with it properly.

It's a fine line there. While we don't want to be helicopter parents who hover over our kids, someone does need to be close enough to help if needed. Especially in that circumstance. I think this is the lesson for the op to learn from that bad experience. In the future, a sibling could help out in those situations.

 

[Mermaid02]

It is not "completely inappropriate" to expect a child to pretend to be something or someone different on Halloween. That's the main idea of the holiday! ROFLOL

Wearing a costume/mask and becoming a character is so liberating and normal that it's often used by therapists to draw children out of their shell and help them imagine themselves not being shy and withdrawn. Playing make believe for one day isn't therapy, but it sure can't hurt.
In any case, the OP should have helped her daughter instead of venting her anger at the older woman. Her other children understood what to do and received candy, it couldn't have been that difficult a task. The kid just needed some guidance and reassurance. Opportunity lost - the lesson she learned was to get angry and rude when someone treats her poorly instead of dealing with it properly.

I don't think Mrs. Jack Daniels was trying to provide the child with therapy.


When the child did not "perform" to the old witch's satisfaction- she was pushed aside and not given any candy- It's easy to Monday morning quarterback and say what you would have done- but somehow in that moment, I doubt you would have taken your own advice.

 

[padams]

Why didn't the siblings speak up and explain the situation to the lady?

A quick "My sister is handicapped. She doesn't understand." is probably all it would have taken to get the lady to hand out the candy and back off.

 

[luvsJack]

It is not "completely inappropriate" to expect a child to pretend to be something or someone different on Halloween. That's the main idea of the holiday! ROFLOL

Wearing a costume/mask and becoming a character is so liberating and normal that it's often used by therapists to draw children out of their shell and help them imagine themselves not being shy and withdrawn. Playing make believe for one day isn't therapy, but it sure can't hurt.

In any case, the OP should have helped her daughter instead of venting her anger at the older woman. Her other children understood what to do and received candy, it couldn't have been that difficult a task. The kid just needed some guidance and reassurance. Opportunity lost - the lesson she learned was to get angry and rude when someone treats her poorly instead of dealing with it properly.

Wearing a costume and pretending to be someone else is one thing, doing tricks for the neighborhood is totally different. A truly shy child could not do that. And the OP's daughter could not understand what was being asked of her. I would have pulled my child away and said soemthing to the woman too.

Her daughter was not in the wrong, the woman was. If any "lesson" is to be taught here it would be don't let mean people ruin your day. And you can bet your bottom dollar I would teach my child to get angry and be rude when someone treats her poorly. She doesn't have to go through life taking that kind of stuff.

 

[Nik's Mom]

Why didn't the siblings speak up and explain the situation to the lady?

A quick "My sister is handicapped. She doesn't understand." is probably all it would have taken to get the lady to hand out the candy and back off.

That's the point that I was trying to make. Yes, that old lady was mean. But the op can't change that. I don't blame her for being angry. But I think it's better to focus on how the situation could have been avoided. If the siblings are old enough, maybe next year they can help their sister. Most kids don't mind helping out. I'm not blaming the op or anything. Just trying to come up with ideas to avoid this situation in the future.

 

[FireDancer]

Didn't we disagree on something last week? Anyway, many autistic children do not have subnormal intelligence. My son is not an idiot. Is that what you are trying to say, because that crosses the line here. Is that what your "if the definition fits..." is supposed to mean?!

I never said idiot should be a substitute for autistic, just that no person should tell another person what words they should find acceptable. If by chance the denotation of a word fits the definition of what you are describing (like idiot would for someone of below average intelligence according to the dictionary) you should be free to use it if you choose regardless of the connotation.

I wouldn't use the word but that isn't the point. It has nothing to do with what words you or I choose to use, it has everything to do with allowing everyone to make that choice for themselves.

That is all I meant. I think you are reading a bit too much into it.

 

[Nik's Mom]

I never said idiot should be a substitute for autistic, just that no person should tell another person what words they should find acceptable. If by chance the denotation of a word fits the definition of what you are describing (like idiot would for someone of below average intelligence according to the dictionary) you should be free to use it if you choose regardless of the connotation.

I wouldn't use the word but that isn't the point. It has nothing to do with what words I or you choose to use, it has everything to do with allowing everyone to make that choice for themselves.

That is all.

Sure, anyone can say what they want, call someone a name, etc. But eventually they are going to get their butt kicked. Ok, we'll agree to disagree this week and carry on peacefully. Till next time, FireDancer.

 

[FireDancer]

Sure, anyone can say what they want, call someone a name, etc. But eventually they are going to get their butt kicked. Ok, we'll agree to disagree this week and carry on peacefully. Till next time, FireDancer.

Agreeing to disagree always works for me.

 

[Kat77]

Listen up people! You are all missing the most imporant aspect here.
The saying is Trick OR Treat...
If we can establish the child stated this to Old Lady Daniels, we know she did not give out the goods and can therefore presume she chose trick. We can tell Mrs. Daniels is all about the halloween spirit!

Bust out the trick!

 

[freckles and boo]

I never said idiot should be a substitute for autistic, just that no person should tell another person what words they should find acceptable. If by chance the denotation of a word fits the definition of what you are describing (like idiot would for someone of below average intelligence according to the dictionary) you should be free to use it if you choose regardless of the connotation.

I wouldn't use the word but that isn't the point. It has nothing to do with what words you or I choose to use, it has everything to do with allowing everyone to make that choice for themselves.

That is all I meant. I think you are reading a bit too much into it.

I am going to read this as "Know It All" is a perfectly acceptable substitution for "Universal Expert".

 

[FireDancer]

I am going to read this as "Know It All" is a perfectly acceptable substitution for "Universal Expert".

 

[luvmy3]

Yes, I unfortunately have had family members who have suffered from Alzheimer's. I also worked in nursing homes when I was younger and therefore came into contact with quite of few people who suffered from it.

If this woman was suffering from dementia, Alzheimer's or some other 'illness' that could cause her to be mean to a young child, then she should not have been left alone to had out candy.

That is true however in your previous post you said there is no excuse for her to behave this way, and you are wrong. If, and thats a big if, she does suffer from dementia or alzheimers, she cannot control her behavior. If she is being cared for, then those people can ensure that she doesn't answer the door but they cannot control how she acts if she does. Unfortunatelty I have witnessed such cruelty and I assure you it made no difference that others were there.

**Disclaimer** This doesn't mean I believe that she is suffering from a mentally debilitating disease, I actually think she was just being a crochety old hag

 

[Magpie]

I never said idiot should be a substitute for autistic, just that no person should tell another person what words they should find acceptable. If by chance the denotation of a word fits the definition of what you are describing (like idiot would for someone of below average intelligence according to the dictionary) you should be free to use it if you choose regardless of the connotation.

I wouldn't use the word but that isn't the point. It has nothing to do with what words you or I choose to use, it has everything to do with allowing everyone to make that choice for themselves.

That is all I meant. I think you are reading a bit too much into it.

I don't know... what about the "N" word?