Vaccination Update from ABD

[Mathmagicland]

For us, this policy is what makes the trip do-able and drops a substantial amount of worry and concern about traveling with a group. I won't let my family go to school with kids that did not get their diphtheria, pertussis, polio, meningococca, MMR or hep B. I do not want to be a part of a group traveling with someone not vaccinated. I've already lost friends to this disease because they were working around unvaccinated. I had a massive amount of shots in the Army, and frankly we were not "asked" if we wanted them. It was necessary for the good of the group. This past weekend my wife asked me to find a way out of our multiple ABD trips as she just was not going to take the risk of dealing with people unvaccinated. This policy change means we are now good to go on both big trips next year. BTW, I had meningitis and was hospitalized for three months; this was just before the schools here began requiring it.

Totally agree! I am just back from the 14-day DCL Eastbound Panama Canal Cruise, and it was very reassuring to know everyone on board, both cast and guests, were fully vaccinated and had passed negative Covid tests at the terminal prior to boarding. I figured it was probably one of the safer places on the planet because of that, and was a big reason why we decided to join the cruise.

 

[susans]

I think that Disney also needs to refund insurance on trips where the countries do not require vaccinations and were booked before Disney required covid shots in the terms of agreement. In fact, I’m wondering if it’s even legal to apply shots as a requirement retroactively

 

[sayhello]

I think that Disney also needs to refund insurance on trips where the countries do not require vaccinations and were booked before Disney required covid shots in the terms of agreement. In fact, I’m wondering if it’s even legal to apply shots as a requirement retroactively

How would it be illegal? They don't have to allow anyone on their ships they don't want to. They are a private company, and if you read the contract you sign when you book, they can basically make any changes to a cruise that they feel necessary for safety, comfort or other reasons. Yes, I believe a full refund would be required, as they are no longer offering the cruise booked by someone who is unvaccinated, but how would it be illegal?

Sayhello

 

[susans]

How would it be illegal? They don't have to allow anyone on their ships they don't want to. They are a private company, and if you read the contract you sign when you book, they can basically make any changes to a cruise that they feel like for safety, comfort or other reasons. Yes, I believe a full refund would be required, as they are no longer offering the cruise booked by someone who is unvaccinated, but how would it be illegal?

Sayhello

Actually I was talking about ABD. Generally, you are not allowed to unilaterally change a contact after the fact without the other parties consent. The change in contract would cause the loss of the cost of insurance which would be damages. In the case of countries, that don’t require vaccinations, this was Disney’s choice but not necessarily the other party to the contract. I did not say it was illegal but I wondered if it was.

 

[sayhello]

Actually I was talking about ABD. Generally, you are not allowed to unilaterally change a contact after the fact without the other parties consent. The change in contract would cause the loss of the cost of insurance which would be damages. In the case of countries, that don’t require vaccinations, this was Disney’s choice but not necessarily the other party to the contract. I did not say it was illegal but I wondered if it was.

The same thing is true for ABD. You signed a contract that said they could, and you were good with it. This is from the Adventure Travel Agreement I signed in June of 2021 for my 2022 ABD (bolding mine):

I acknowledge that I have separately received and reviewed the Guest Health and Safety Protocols and am responsible for abiding by the policies set forth therein. I acknowledge that you are not liable in any way for the failure of other participants to abide by the Guest Health and Safety Protocols and the Guest Health and Safety Protocols are subject to change at any time at your sole discretion. It is my sole responsibility to confirm any changes to the Guest Health and Safety Protocols before departure and I will be responsible for abiding by any updated Guest Health and Safety Protocols in effect at the time of my Adventure.

I acknowledge and agree that if, at any point prior to the Adventure or during the Adventure, I am deemed not fit to travel, whether according to the CDC, a medical provider, you, or a third party engaged by you to determine a participant’s fitness to travel, I will not be able to start or continue, as applicable, on the Adventure.

Sayhello

 

[susans]

The same thing is true for ABD. You signed a contract that said they could, and you were good with it. This is from the Adventure Travel Agreement I signed in June of 2021 for my 2022 ABD (bolding mine):




Sayhello

Last time I checked I am not deemed unfit to travel by anyone

 

[susans]

Last time I checked I am not deemed unfit to travel by anyone

 

[Marthasor]

The same thing is true for ABD. You signed a contract that said they could, and you were good with it. This is from the Adventure Travel Agreement I signed in June of 2021 for my 2022 ABD (bolding mine):




Sayhello

I think PP brings up an interesting point. I have three placeholders from trips that were, eventually, canceled in summer 2020. The original trips were booked in 2019 and the ABD contract has changed significantly since we signed off on our summer 2020 trips. We played chicken with ABD, blinked, ended up with placeholders and have been on a total of 3 waitlists for domestic trips that never come through - basically, we've tried to use our credits and have not been able to. We have over $3000 invested with ABD and, if we want to use it, we now have to sign onto terms and conditions we never agreed to, initially, in order to not lose our money. Meanwhile, the trips we booked - D23 Rhine Cruise and SoCal/DL - don't seem to exist in the form of the itinerary we originally booked and we are scrounging for something that interests us and also works for my son's school schedule. Even the trips we were waitlisted for had been adjusted to the point that it didn't seem worth it to us (river rafting and float trips canceled, train rides canceled, etc.) It's been very, very frustrating. To ABD's credit, they extended our placeholder expiration date so we can hopefully find a trip that will work with my son's schedule, will actually deliver on the itinerary published and we won't be waitlisted again. Do I think what ABD is doing is "illegal" - no, of course not. The whole situation has just made me very gun-shy of giving ABD any more of my money. The whole idea that I have to enter into a new contract, that I never agreed to, in order not to lose $3000 that was put down on a completely different contract, leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

 

[susans]

Last time I checked I am not deemed unfit to travel by anyone

Last time I checked I am not deemed unfit to travel by anyone

Last time I checked I am not deemed unfit to travel by anyone

I think PP brings up an interesting point. I have three placeholders from trips that were, eventually, canceled in summer 2020. The original trips were booked in 2019 and the ABD contract has changed significantly since we signed off on our summer 2020 trips. We played chicken with ABD, blinked, ended up with placeholders and have been on a total of 3 waitlists for domestic trips that never come through - basically, we've tried to use our credits and have not been able to. We have over $3000 invested with ABD and, if we want to use it, we now have to sign onto terms and conditions we never agreed to, initially, in order to not lose our money. Meanwhile, the trips we booked - D23 Rhine Cruise and SoCal/DL - don't seem to exist in the form of the itinerary we originally booked and we are scrounging for something that interests us and also works for my son's school schedule. Even the trips we were waitlisted for had been adjusted to the point that it didn't seem worth it to us (river rafting and float trips canceled, train rides canceled, etc.) It's been very, very frustrating. To ABD's credit, they extended our placeholder expiration date so we can hopefully find a trip that will work with my son's schedule, will actually deliver on the itinerary published and we won't be waitlisted again. Do I think what ABD is doing is "illegal" - no, of course not. The whole situation has just made me very gun-shy of giving ABD any more of my money. The whole idea that I have to enter into a new contract, that I never agreed to, in order not to lose $3000 that was put down on a completely different contract, leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

 

[sayhello]

Last time I checked I am not deemed unfit to travel by anyone

Apparently ABD deems you unfit to travel with them if you are not vaccinated. And you agreed to that if your Adventure Travel Agreement has that verbiage in it.

Has anyone told you that your insurance will be forfeited if you cancel due to being unvaccinated?

I think PP brings up an interesting point. I have three placeholders from trips that were, eventually, canceled in summer 2020. The original trips were booked in 2019 and the ABD contract has changed significantly since we signed off on our summer 2020 trips. We played chicken with ABD, blinked, ended up with placeholders and have been on a total of 3 waitlists for domestic trips that never come through - basically, we've tried to use our credits and have not been able to. We have over $3000 invested with ABD and, if we want to use it, we now have to sign onto terms and conditions we never agreed to, initially, in order to not lose our money. Meanwhile, the trips we booked - D23 Rhine Cruise and SoCal/DL - don't seem to exist in the form of the itinerary we originally booked and we are scrounging for something that interests us and also works for my son's school schedule. Even the trips we were waitlisted for had been adjusted to the point that it didn't seem worth it to us (river rafting and float trips canceled, train rides canceled, etc.) It's been very, very frustrating. To ABD's credit, they extended our placeholder expiration date so we can hopefully find a trip that will work with my son's schedule, will actually deliver on the itinerary published and we won't be waitlisted again. Do I think what ABD is doing is "illegal" - no, of course not. The whole situation has just made me very gun-shy of giving ABD any more of my money. The whole idea that I have to enter into a new contract, that I never agreed to, in order not to lose $3000 that was put down on a completely different contract, leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

I agree, that really stinks. I think ABD has definitely not handled a lot of the cancellations in the best way they could have. I luckily was able to take a full refund for my May 2020 trip that got cancelled, and will not sign up for an international trip until after things are way more normalized. Honestly, I'm hoping I don't regret signing up for the New England trip next September (since I did agree to the new contract). We shall see.

Sayhello

 

[susans]

When I booked my ABD, it was before Covid. I believe that I was not the only person here who did NOT sign the agreement that say hello mentions. I am not an anti vaccination person. I am not trying to stir the pot. I just didn’t agree to this and my money should be refunded.

I still love Disney. I am still booked for two more Disney World trips this year. I am still DCL platinum. And I have been a member of disboards almost since the beginning.

As a US citizen, I am not required to be vaccinated to leave or reenter the US. The country where I was going does not require a vaccination. My doctor is ok with me leaving. This is solely Disney and they are not qualified to make medical decisions
I appreciate what say hello has to say. I have read sayhello’s post through the years and have made some very good Disney decisions based on the posts. This is not personal.

 

[susans]

When I booked my ABD, it was before Covid. I believe that I was not the only person here who did NOT sign the agreement that say hello mentions. I am not an anti vaccination person. I am not trying to stir the pot. I just didn’t agree to this and my money should be refunded.

I still love Disney. I am still booked for two more Disney World trips this year. I am still DCL platinum. And I have been a member of disboards almost since the beginning.

As a US citizen, I am not required to be vaccinated to leave or reenter the US. The country where I was going does not require a vaccination. My doctor is ok with me leaving. This is solely Disney and they are not qualified to make medical decisions
I appreciate what say hello has to say. I have read sayhello’s post through the years and have made some very good Disney decisions based on the posts. This is not personal.

Btw I did not say I was not vaccinated. I said I did not agree to be vaccinated to go on this ABD

 

[sayhello]

When I booked my ABD, it was before Covid. I believe that I was not the only person here who did NOT sign the agreement that say hello mentions. I am not an anti vaccination person. I am not trying to stir the pot. I just didn’t agree to this and my money should be refunded.

I still love Disney. I am still booked for two more Disney World trips this year. I am still DCL platinum. And I have been a member of disboards almost since the beginning.

As a US citizen, I am not required to be vaccinated to leave or reenter the US. The country where I was going does not require a vaccination. My doctor is ok with me leaving. This is solely Disney and they are not qualified to make medical decisions
I appreciate what say hello has to say. I have read sayhello’s post through the years and have made some very good Disney decisions based on the posts. This is not personal.

I totally don't take any of this as personal. I'm just trying to present the facts. I'm sorry if I came off as attacking you or something!

I'm really quite curious, has anyone said you can't get your money back? You mentioned your insurance multiple times, and I'm wondering if you purchased the insurance through ABD or through an outside company? Either way, I would think you should be able to get a refund or a credit for that insurance depending on who you purchased it through and what you do with the ABD.

Btw I did not say I was not vaccinated. I said I did not agree to be vaccinated to go on this ABD

I totally get this now. You booked prior to COVID, so of course you could not have agreed to this. If you are still booked on the same ABD that you booked prior to the pandemic, then the contract that you signed at that time still applies. If you've switched to another trip, than whatever contract you signed when you had to move the trip applies. You'd have to check each of those contracts to see what, if any verbiage there is around changes to the trip.

Sayhello

 

[Rapunzellover]

I totally get this now. You booked prior to COVID, so of course you could not have agreed to this. If you are still booked on the same ABD that you booked prior to the pandemic, then the contract that you signed at that time still applies. If you've switched to another trip, than whatever contract you signed when you had to move the trip applies. You'd have to check each of those contracts to see what, if any verbiage there is around changes to the trip.

Sayhello

I'd even check and see if you still have the same agreement when switching dates for the same trip. There could be language in the agreement that if you switch dates, you are subject to whatever the terms and conditions are for the new date. ABD might also reserve the right to change requirements at any time.

 

[abdgeek]

Just saw this article: https://allears.net/2021/11/18/proo...-required-for-all-adventures-by-disney-trips/ It looks like ABD will require proof of vaccination for all trips beginning Jan. 12, 2022. Proof of a negative Covid test will no longer be an option. I wonder if the change is due to the survey or the fact that most countries are requiring it. I would imagine the recent option OP spoke of to cancel ABD trips may be in preparation for this new requirement.

 

[sayhello]

Just saw this article: https://allears.net/2021/11/18/proo...-required-for-all-adventures-by-disney-trips/ It looks like ABD will require proof of vaccination for all trips beginning Jan. 12, 2022. Proof of a negative Covid test will no longer be an option. I wonder if the change is due to the survey or the fact that most countries are requiring it. I would imagine the recent option OP spoke of to cancel ABD trips may be in preparation for this new requirement.

Yes, the new vaccination and cancellation policies were announced at the same time in letters to folks who had ABD's scheduled through May 2022, and on the ABD website.

And I imagine the change is because it's easiest to have consistent requirements across all ABDs rather than having to worry about which countries are requiring all guests to be vaccinated at what time and constantly having to monitor all those countries' policies.

Sayhello

 

[abdgeek]

Yes, the new vaccination and cancellation policies were announced at the same time in letters to folks who had ABD's scheduled through May 2022, and on the ABD website.

And I imagine the change is because it's easiest to have consistent requirements across all ABDs rather than having to worry about which countries are requiring all guests to be vaccinated at what time and constantly having to monitor all those countries' policies.

Sayhello

I wonder when they were planning to let those of us with December 2022 ABDs know of the new requirement? I’m fully vaccinated so it‘s not an issue, but if I weren’t I would definitely have some decisions to make. I wonder if they expect the vaccination requirement to stay past the summer.

 

[sayhello]

I wonder when they were planning to let those of us with December 2022 ABDs know of the new requirement? I’m fully vaccinated so it‘s not an issue, but if I weren’t I would definitely have some decisions to make. I wonder if they expect the vaccination requirement to stay past the summer.

I think they are trying to do it in waves. Everyone from January through May, then once that's done, tackle all the summer trips. It has to be a lot for them to deal with folks who feel they have to cancel because they can't or won't vaccinate their kids. Maybe they *hope* it will all be better by then? I wouldn't be holding my breath if I was ABD... but who knows?

Sayhello

 

[thanxfornoticin]

I think they are trying to do it in waves. Everyone from January through May, then once that's done, tackle all the summer trips. It has to be a lot for them to deal with folks who feel they have to cancel because they can't or won't vaccinate their kids. Maybe they *hope* it will all be better by then? I wouldn't be holding my breath if I was ABD... but who knows?

Sayhello

I agree with your theory. If we've learned nothing over the past 2 years, things are moving and changing very quickly, so who knows the status of a pandemic and its impact on world travel by spring? They've put a policy in place that is essentially 6 months out. They'll probably revisit again in 2-3 months to either change or extend the policies.

 

[sayhello]

I just got the following update on the Vaccination policy in an email from ABD:

Note: My email did not have an end date on it as it's specifically for my trip in September, but I saw a TA on fb post that she was informed the policy goes through Dec 31, 2022.

03/15/2022

As we welcome Guests back to exploring the world with us, promoting health and safety is a top priority. With this in mind, we are reaching out with updated information about the COVID-19 vaccination requirements for your trip.

We continue to resume trips with health and safety measures developed in consideration of guidance from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and other health experts.

Vaccination Requirements

All Guests must provide proof of being fully vaccinated before joining any trip.

In consideration of guidance from the CDC and the World Health Organization (WHO), Adventures by Disney accepts the following vaccine types: Pfizer, Moderna, Johnson & Johnson, AstraZeneca, Covishield, Novavax, Sinopharm BBIBP-CorV (VeroCell), Sinovac-CoronaVac, and Covavaxin (Bharat Biotech).

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) defines fully vaccinated as 14 days after receiving:

• A single-dose of an accepted 1-dose vaccine
• The second dose of an accepted 2-dose vaccine
• The full series of an active (not placebo) COVID-19 vaccine in the US-based AstraZeneca or Novavax COVID-19 vaccine trials
• The second dose of any “mix and match” combination of accepted COVID-19 vaccines (administered at least 17 days apart)

Note: Adventures by Disney strongly recommends that Guests who are eligible to receive a COVID-19 booster shot do so in preparation for their travel. Destinations and their local laws may have different requirements and definitions of what constitutes full vaccination. This may include a booster dose, as well as additional wait time after the full series of vaccine doses. Guests who have not received a booster dose may be prevented from traveling to certain destinations. For international trips, local laws will apply, so it is important that you confirm you will be fully vaccinated according to the countries on your trip.

Please note that details about your specific trip will be shared closer to your scheduled departure. Additional information about our health and safety measures can be found in the Health and Safety Protocols section of our website.

We look forward to welcoming you on your trip soon.

Sincerely,

The Cast and Guides
Adventures by Disney

Sayhello