The Running Thread - 2021

[Tall Todd]

ATTQOTD: The cold never bothered me anyway...

 

[MissLiss279]

ATTQOTD: Is there wind with the -10? Around here, we usually end up with 10-20 mph wind even when it’s going to be that cold this weekend! With wind I would probably choose the 110, even though I don’t do great in heat - I may end up walking, but I could get it done. With no wind and -10, I might choose that.

I remember running about 7 miles (supposed to be 20, but I finished indoors) with a windchill around -10/-15 a few years ago. Even with all my layers and wind breakers, it was pretty miserable and it sucked away a lot of my energy. Those remaining miles indoors were hard. I don’t enjoy being cold.

 

[TheHamm]

QOTD: It's likely very cold where you are, leaving some of us dreaming of warmer temps! Would you rather run in 110F or -10F conditions?

(inspired by the recent discussion on temp ranges of course!)

If I had to pick, -10 °F. But if we are inducing anguish, can we skip the wind? My racoon eyes have not healed from last week's stupidity. I would probably choose to not go outside in 110 °F conditions, running or otherwise.

I think the coldest I have gone for was 9 °F and wind making the 'real feel' 2 °F. The soul crushing lack of sunlight, endless howling wind, patches of not so neighborly ice, and general malaise caused by 334 days of work and school from home make it difficult to do much of anything to add to misery so there is no way I would attempt to do it this year.

 

[PrincessV]

ATTQOTD: 110. No question. I'm literally allergic to the cold and am miserable in anything under 50. I don't love being overheated, but I can always slow down to deal with it.

 

[Jules76126]

ATTQOTD: Definitely the cold.

 

[Amanda&Mike]

ATTQOTD: The cold. Its definitely a lot harder to get myself going when its freezing cold but then after the first 5 minutes or so I am adjusted and more comfortable than when its hot and humid. Either temperature , after all these years of running I (Amanda) am still terrible at dressing for my runs.

 

[DopeyBadger]

ATTQOTD: Give me the cold! This was from a 90 min run at -16F several years ago. I'd say it's fairly representative of what I look like coming home most cold running nights. For me, I'm still in shorts down to as low as 20F. But I don't think I've come across a day where I said it was either too hot or too cold to get out there. Actually, sometimes I specifically aim for it in order to set new coldest/hottest PRs.

 

[Kerry1957]

ATTQOTD: Actually, sometimes I specifically aim for it in order to set new coldest/hottest PRs.

Exactly....that's the only reason I have run in -8F and +115F. The only reason to punish yourself in these conditions is for the "glory" of a new coldest/hottest PR.

 

[Sleepless Knight]

I'll throw one thing out there about the Higdon and Galloway Dopey plans. The long runs based on your fitness starting in Week 1 would be 136 minutes (13 miles) and caps at 3.5 hrs (20 miles). I personally don't like to see long runs beyond 150 minutes unless you're willing to slow down the long run pace even further than the 10:29 min/mile scheduled above. I don't really think they're necessary and may cause more harm than good.

During my first marathon, I followed this idea. My longest run capped at 11 miles, though I had a few of them. Despite coming down with a nasty chest cold literally one week before Dopey, I finished my first marathon just fine. However, I was very sore for 3-4 days after the marathon and believe that if I had done some 20 miles runs in training, those would have negatively impacted my runs because I was still not very capable of even my slowest training pace. I described to a friend as "park hobbling."

Any other suggestions?

Trust your training, listen to the experience of others, and do not be afraid to continue asking questions. I learned so much more once I stopped thinking of myself as "not a real runner" and opened up to this community.

Keep your core strong - situps, planks, etc - this will help your running form and help prevent injury. I also believe strongly in a good diet and maintaining hydration to help prevent injury and aid recovery.

I second this. I did something to my back in college and felt the effects for years. My first half marathon actually fixed that issue and I worked on strength training before my second half and had a much better experience at half number two. A lot more fun and a lot less soreness.

-Train slow to race fast.

I used to believe that I had to train fast to succeed. I have since learned that is not true. Adrenaline will play a huge role on race day and training slow helps keep your body fresher so you can give maximum effort on race day.

-Consistency is king. No one run is any more important than any other. So in my mind the 20 miler and the 4 mile weekday run are equally important. The real meaning is that the training plan should be taken as a whole and a sum of its parts rather than each individual workout at its relative importance. A successful 20 mile training run happens because of the 4 mile weekday run. And without the 4 mile weekday run, you're only hurting your progress towards your final race day goal. So be just as diligent about doing the little things as you are with doing the big things.

It took me a while to understand this, but once I learned it, everything began to change. Ideal training does not exist for most of us. Life interferes. Unexpected illness hits us or a family member. Consistency allows you to absorb missing a few runs. Even if you get sick and have to skip runs. I rarely get chest colds. Well, I got a particularly nasty one 10 days before Dopey started and Dopey was my first marathon. I told myself that if necessary I would skip the 5K and 10K to just get Goofy in. But I got stronger as the races approached. By the end of the 10K, I knew I was feeling better than at the start of the 5K. I finished the half and full with no problems. At mile 22 of the marathon, when I was feeling all 22 miles, I reminded myself that I had already run these last 4 miles every day of training when the plan called for a 4 mile run that I didn't necessarily feel like doing. It works.

-Train where you are and not where you want to be.

I always have to remind myself that I do not have to run the race distance on day one of training, but that as I consistently train, I will be ready for the distance on race day.

From my experience in training others, I feel quite confident that this new age style of thinking where the focus should be on time rather than distance works for most recreational runners.

It took me a very long time to wrap my head around this idea as @DopeyBadger well knows, having patiently answered all of my questions, even when I found new ways to ask the same question. A lot of runners here were immensely helpful in sharing their experiences with this methodology with me. Eventually, I had to try it for myself, trust others, and hope it worked. Well my first race under this method was Murphy's Law. Everything went wrong from even before the race, but everything that went wrong had nothing to do with my training. I went from hoping to set a PR to just hanging on for dear life because I was stubborn and would just gut it out. Yet as each mile mounted, I realized that somehow that PR was still within reach. Not only did I set a PR, but I knocked 3 minutes off the old one.

ATTQOTD: Maybe I'll regret this later, but having run the 2019 and 2020 WDW Marathons in intense heat and humidity, I would like to know what a marathon when it's not brutally feels like.

 

[run.minnie.miles]

ATTQOTD: Even though this was my own question.... in reality I'd pick neither! But if I had to, I'd pick the cold. I could dress for the cold, but there's no helping the heat.

 

[michigandergirl]

Sorry I missed you there! Great race and certainly the toughest marathon I have ever run! Well by lap 6 it was not so much run as shuffle, crawl and repeatedly ask myself why did I sign up for a marathon I. The snow?Seriously though, absolutely beautiful course and great vibe. I will do it again.

Congrats on your finish in seriously tough conditions!!! I question my sanity on that last loop every year too, but somehow I keep going back. It really is a special race.

 

[avondale]

QOTD: It's likely very cold where you are, leaving some of us dreaming of warmer temps! Would you rather run in 110F or -10F conditions?

(inspired by the recent discussion on temp ranges of course!)

ATTQOTD: No question, -10 F.

 

[Herding_Cats]

Attqotd: neither. Weather extremes = treadmill, end of story.


Cross training/spin bike question! For those of you that do or have used a spin bike for cross training, and is the purpose? Is it strictly for the cardio? You just want to get to it hr into the appropriate zone and sustain it? OR Is it for the cardio AND to challenge your legs? Why?

 

[DopeyBadger]

Cross training/spin bike question! For those of you that do or have used a spin bike for cross training, and is the purpose? Is it strictly for the cardio? You just want to get to it hr into the appropriate zone and sustain it? OR Is it for the cardio AND to challenge your legs? Why?

For me, I use indoor cycling as a replacement for more running. So I follow a systematic workout approach on my bike. Like this example from TrainerRoad:



So like running workouts, my cycling also has workouts centered around different physiologically relevant zones.

If your intent for the cycling is just to add in something else an extra day per week (like Higdon suggests), then you can't go wrong with something easy in the endurance zone. Especially if you're doing this cycling the day after your long run. From my own personal data, that usually ends up around 10 bpm less than my long run HR zone. So my long run HR is usually 140 bpm and my endurance zone cycling is usually around 130 bpm. Watts are the better measure for cycling though. It would require a "functional threshold power" test to determine the correct areas. My FTP is 240ish and the endurance zone is 55-75% FTP. So my goal wattage for endurance rides is 130-180. That's where most of my easy cycling stuff ends up. Does your spin bike output watts? If so, this is a FTP test:

https://www.cyclingweekly.com/fitness/ftp-cycling-363865
https://help.trainingpeaks.com/hc/e...-Calculate-Threshold-Power-Heart-Rate-or-Pace
https://www.myprocoach.net/blog/ftp-test-how-to-measure-your-cycle-performance/

 

[Herding_Cats]

Our bike does NOT have watt output on the display. And yes, I'm looking at something to plug in on the "cross training" days for the higdon plan.....so I was checking to see if I can stick with the intensity level of the rides I've been doing, or if I needed to think about getting more aggressive with the selection.

 

[DopeyBadger]

Our bike does NOT have watt output on the display. And yes, I'm looking at something to plug in on the "cross training" days for the higdon plan.....so I was checking to see if I can stick with the intensity level of the rides I've been doing, or if I needed to think about getting more aggressive with the selection.

Then I’d say as long as it feels relatively easy, then you’re doing alright. The primary purpose coming the day after the long run is just for a different method of recovery. So there isn’t a need to push it. If you have a HR monitor then you could also consider the LR HR - 10 bpm as a different effort check.

 

[dis_or_dat]

ATTQOTD: -10. But what do I know, the coldest temp I've ever run in was probably ... low 40s? Which was setting off my Raynaud's.

Maybe 110, in total shade with a cool ocean breeze. But then again, I try to avoid temps when they get close to 80s and I usually deal with a drier heat.

I don't know how you guys run in the snow - it's so slippery! All this talk reminds me of a video someone sent me recently ("it's the perfect texture for running" clip):

 

[SheHulk]

I don't know how you guys run in the snow - it's so slippery! All this talk reminds me of a video someone sent me recently ("it's the perfect texture for running" clip):

I just yelled out loud! Though I knew what had to be coming...

 

[flav]

ATTQOTD: Now I have a new goal: record temperature PR!
Those photos are around the extremes and I would so love to go back to any of them (New Year with my family at a cottage or finishing a runDisney marathon or running on a beach in Florida in August). I generally find the cold easier to deal with than the heat. Wind not so much.

 

[GreatLakes]

Had a Valentine's Day 15k trail race in the snow. It was pretty much perfect winter trail conditions. In the 20s with very little wind chill, light snow the whole time, heavily used trails so the snow was packed down, and enough fresh snow over that packed snow to give you some grip.

There was even a bonus marriage proposal to go with the Valentine's theme.