Is it okay to put family first? (Response to royal family stuff)

[Skippyboo]

The thing is, as I mentioned before, that not a lot has changed with these two, it’s just intensified. I was firmly in their corner, too, and very happy to see Harry finally settling down with someone special. Until news started trickling out about their “separating” from Wills and Kate in their living arrangements at Kensington Palace, their shared office at Buckingham Palace, and the foundation they started together, etc. Hmm. That took me by surprise because Wills, Kate and Harry had always seemed so happy and close together as a “threesome” for so long. Then there were the wedding stories - tiaras, “What Meghan wants, Meghan gets”, family issues, the $3million Frogmore Cottage renovation fiasco, the “don’t want to be working royals anymore but want to keep the security and titles”, and on and on. Now it’s past the point of ridiculousness, but at least people can see the type of people they are, all by their own doing.

A picture is worth a thousand words

View attachment 565119

View attachment 565123

View attachment 565122

View attachment 565120

View attachment 565121


View attachment 565126

View attachment 565128

That 4th picture isn’t real. Harry is wearing a Tropical uniform which would not be worn in UK and William would not be in a suit with Harry wearing a uniform. William would be in a uniform too.

 

[TLSnell1981]

That's the one! And I hadn't gotten as far as the quoted part ^^

I got a little past "Put it this way: has Michelle Obama ever sat on a TV sofa *****ing about her sister-in-law?" Another thing that article didn't quite say, but really did say...the serious people are not name-droppers. They wouldn't go out of their way to make it known that they were a "friend" of a tennis player. I'm sure they're very careful about who they share their personal details with.

Sean Penn was able to get out of the tabloids and do some serious charity work, most recently during covid. I saw him do an interview about a testing site he set up, and he didn't talk about himself at all -- it was all about the people who were able to make it happen, and how important the first responders were for the community. From the article below: "I do get that people are struggling in ways that I can't even imagine," he said. "And I think we need a really accurate picture of how much testing is happening nationally."

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-testing-sean-penn-nonprofit-california/

It only took him like 30 years to completely change his image so there is still hope for H and M.

Loved this comment. It seems she was right all along.
Meghan Markle's half-sister Samantha claims Harry is in 'no position' to 'fight misinformation' at Aspen Institute until he 'gets a grip on what truth is'.

 

[redrosesix]

More and more information being made public makes me think more and more that Harry is far more responsible for the situation than Meghan. Her main "sin" just might be that she indulges Harry's worst impulses, a good deal of which may even come from good intentions on her part to support her husband and accepting his perspective as factual. I don't think many would flourish suddenly being the fish completely out of water in that pond, particularly if you have no reason to suspect your partner might have a skewed perspective he's sharing with you.

Seems entirely possible Harry has been a bit adrift since his active military career was blocked. He's made no bones about the fact that he loved his time in active duty, was happiest at that time and he also admits schooling was a no go for him. I think he was headed in a good direction in channeling those energies towards efforts to support veterans' issues, but I don't doubt that he was feeling the desire to have a mate and start a family of his own also. Problem being he began on that path and might have found it didn't fulfill everything, not in the sense the relationship wasn't enough, but in the sense that possibly he was looking for the relationship to solve his overall life dissatisfactions.

At the same time he was making changes, things were changing with his brother as well, with William being distinctly brought forward as future king, and eventually even William's son starting to be given some official prominence to publicly demonstrate the future plans. Apparently one of Diana's absolute musts was the boys must be treated the same. That makes absolute sense while raising them and within the family relationships. The problem comes about once William begins turning on the path of accepting more of the "professional" role as a future king. Is this part of the "completely separate paths" Harry has mentioned more than once in regards to the space between he and his brother? He's also made damaging comments about his father and brother being trapped, stated nobody wants the job of monarch, said his father cut them off financially and if he didn't have his mother's money they wouldn't have been able to manage, and very deliberately left his father and William under the cloud of racism. Sure sounds like he loves his brother "to bits" and he I'm sure would gladly and proudly tell everyone what an amazing job his brother will do as king someday.

I don't know about anyone else, but if someone in my family made offensive comments about my child's potential looks being concerning due to racist, or any issue, I'd be taking it up with them immediately, face to face, on the spot. Granted, I'm a nobody, but even if I'm a royal, that's still a family matter, not a media matter -- at least not as my starting point to addressing it. Being disingenuous by suggesting my child was being denied the title of prince because of race when in fact the practices that make that decision have been in effect for however many decades or centuries undercuts my willingness to take your claim as credible. No doubt the brotherly jealousy reared up strong in this regard as well because those same practices delaying the bestowing of the title upon Harry's son grant the titles from birth to William's children. I can see how that would sting, but when you don't even acknowledge that the traditions determining this started before your grandmother was even born and you instead tell a story that paints your family that you love so dearly in a bad light to garner public sympathy, I have no tiny violin to play for you.

Someone who's feeling lost, adrift, unfulfilled, restless, constrained, resentful, jealous, suddenly second place who likely has some issues surrounding the brutal loss of his mother sounds like a timebomb ready to go off if you ask me.

I don't give M nearly as much credit as you do, particularly because the most devastating words in the interview came out of her mouth, but all of the lies that were easily fact-checked did too. But I do hear you on the ending of his military career, and even there a lot of the people he was working with would have by then started families. A lot of people thrive in the military because a lot of the thinking is done for you: what to wear, where to live, how to do your job, how to get promoted. The regimen of your day to day life makes it easy even when your job is very hard, and you do have a sense of fulfillment because missions end and tasks get completed, unlike jobs where we do things day after day and nothing really ever gets finished. I'm sure if he has ongoing emotional or mental issues, the military life would take a lot of stress off him.

And then on top of that, all of his royal duties were planned for him, security and details taken care of. All he had to do was show up and smile...and now all of the details have to be taken care of by him or by a team hired by him. This is how the Russian pranksters were able to get him last year. His team was contacted, and he called them thinking he was talking to Greta Thunberg. Incidentally, some of the things he said completely contradicted what they said in the interview or what they have done since. It's like he's a different public persona than he was then (but might have always been just as you described).

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-call-Russians-pretending-Greta-Thunberg.html

 

[Turn the Page]

Prince Charles reportedly wanted to release a point by point reply to all the "issues" raised in the Oprah interview. But thought better of it because he didn't want to give more ammunition.

I firmly belive that Charles made the right call here. Ultimately, nothing good can come of a detailed response and the monarchy has survived for so long in part due to their stoic nature. It's what separates them from the Kardashians. That said, dawned if I don't really want to hear a point by point response.

 

[redrosesix]

I might have missed it but I didn’t see anyone post the news this past week that two current staff have left their employ, at least one of which seemed rather sudden.

there are two? I only heard about the chief of staff for Archewell, Catherine St-Laurent. They are saying she is staying on in an advisory role but she is saying she left.

 

[TLSnell1981]

That's the one! And I hadn't gotten as far as the quoted part ^^

I got a little past "Put it this way: has Michelle Obama ever sat on a TV sofa *****ing about her sister-in-law?" Another thing that article didn't quite say, but really did say...the serious people are not name-droppers. They wouldn't go out of their way to make it known that they were a "friend" of a tennis player. I'm sure they're very careful about who they share their personal details with.

Sean Penn was able to get out of the tabloids and do some serious charity work, most recently during covid. I saw him do an interview about a testing site he set up, and he didn't talk about himself at all -- it was all about the people who were able to make it happen, and how important the first responders were for the community. From the article below: "I do get that people are struggling in ways that I can't even imagine," he said. "And I think we need a really accurate picture of how much testing is happening nationally."

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-testing-sean-penn-nonprofit-california/

It only took him like 30 years to completely change his image so there is still hope for H and M.

I still don't like Sean Penn.

I firmly belive that Charles made the right call here. Ultimately, nothing good can come of a detailed response and the monarchy has survived for so long in part due to their stoic nature. It's what separates them from the Kardashians. That said, dawned if I don't really want to hear a point by point response.

No need to give her any acknowledgement whatsoever. It's what she craves.

 

[redrosesix]

The thing is, as I mentioned before, that not a lot has changed with these two, it’s just intensified. I was firmly in their corner, too, and very happy to see Harry finally settling down with someone special. Until news started trickling out about their “separating” from Wills and Kate in their living arrangements at Kensington Palace, their shared office at Buckingham Palace, and the foundation they started together, etc. Hmm. That took me by surprise because Wills, Kate and Harry had always seemed so happy and close together as a “threesome” for so long. Then there were the wedding stories - tiaras, “What Meghan wants, Meghan gets”, family issues, the $3million Frogmore Cottage renovation fiasco, the “don’t want to be working royals anymore but want to keep the security and titles”, and on and on. Now it’s past the point of ridiculousness, but at least people can see the type of people they are, all by their own doing.

A picture is worth a thousand words

View attachment 565119

View attachment 565123

View attachment 565122

View attachment 565120

View attachment 565121


View attachment 565126

View attachment 565128

yes, you're right...that really says it all.

those last pictures are from their very last royal engagement.

 

[redrosesix]

I firmly belive that Charles made the right call here. Ultimately, nothing good can come of a detailed response and the monarchy has survived for so long in part due to their stoic nature. It's what separates them from the Kardashians. That said, dawned if I don't really want to hear a point by point response.

Agreed. Charles really didn't have to do it -- we did it for him. There may be other private details that only he would know, but I think we've got enough to say there was some deception in the Oprah interview.

(and press and youtubers all over the world have also called them out too)

 

[Pea-n-Me]

That 4th picture isn’t real. Harry is wearing a Tropical uniform which would not be worn in UK and William would not be in a suit with Harry wearing a uniform. William would be in a uniform too.

Thank you. Replaced.

 

[VandVsmama]

Here's the latest news:
"Blah blah blah Prince Harry gets a cushy gig so we should all take him seriously now. He and his wife are very oppressed. It's hard being them. Blah blah blah."

Fast forward a few years and it'll be old news. Nobody will give a rip. Meghan "I want to wear the crown jewels" Markle will still be chasing papparazzi, Oprah, and dabbling in other stupid celebrity things.

 

[mom2rtk]

Prince Charles reportedly wanted to release a point by point reply to all the "issues" raised in the Oprah interview. But thought better of it because he didn't want to give more ammunition.

The worst part of all this is that Harry knew the family wouldn't be able to respond when they put all of this out there.

 

[Karin1984]

The worst part of all this is that Harry knew the family wouldn't be able to respond when they put all of this out there.

I think that was one of the reasons why they did it. Because there wouldn't be a response from the family, it would really be their point of view.
For the family not talking back, must have been one of the most appealing aspects of doing the interview.

 

[cabanafrau]

The worst part of all this is that Harry knew the family wouldn't be able to respond when they put all of this out there.

Almost as if what was said and how it was said was deliberately designed that way, no?

I take it there's some sort of rumor that Meghan threw hot tea at a servant in Australia? I would be quite surprised if that's true.

I don't give M nearly as much credit as you do, particularly because the most devastating words in the interview came out of her mouth, but all of the lies that were easily fact-checked did too. But I do hear you on the ending of his military career, and even there a lot of the people he was working with would have by then started families. A lot of people thrive in the military because a lot of the thinking is done for you: what to wear, where to live, how to do your job, how to get promoted. The regimen of your day to day life makes it easy even when your job is very hard, and you do have a sense of fulfillment because missions end and tasks get completed, unlike jobs where we do things day after day and nothing really ever gets finished. I'm sure if he has ongoing emotional or mental issues, the military life would take a lot of stress off him.

And then on top of that, all of his royal duties were planned for him, security and details taken care of. All he had to do was show up and smile...and now all of the details have to be taken care of by him or by a team hired by him. This is how the Russian pranksters were able to get him last year. His team was contacted, and he called them thinking he was talking to Greta Thunberg. Incidentally, some of the things he said completely contradicted what they said in the interview or what they have done since. It's like he's a different public persona than he was then (but might have always been just as you described).

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-call-Russians-pretending-Greta-Thunberg.html

I don't know that I'm necessarily giving her credit. Count me in the crowd of people who were completely unaware of her existence until she was revealed as his girlfriend/fiance. I've never seen her perform and only am familiar with her as Harry's mate, etc. I don't really have a lot to go on to try and speculate much about what type of person she actually is. One thing I find almost impossible to believe is that she had the capability to marry into that family/business and land on her feet like a cat and be able to manipulate and run rings around everyone the way a lot of the press coverage assumes. I'm sure it was a lot to attempt to learn and navigate, no matter what kind of intentions anyone assumes she must have had. This is particularly where I think she probably was poorly served and wrongly influenced if Harry was in fact in a bad way himself as far as wanting to serve in a way that was fulfilling and finding much of what he was assigned hollow, so much worse if he was already beginning to nurse resentment to William taking on new roles and being promoted more and more as future king. Expenses had to jump significantly when Meghan joined the picture because she had to be kitted out with clothes befitting her new station. Is it possible at some point Charles made even a stupid joke about $$ that landed absolutely flat?

Let's face it, Charles isn't noted for being emotionally adept or in touch with much normality. Could staff even have made some pointed comments to Harry or Meghan about $$$ and ruffled feathers? People in that situation, normal people, famous people, royal people, it doesn't matter, little incidents like that set off hurt feelings in relationships. If they're not recognized or fixed relationships start sliding down a slippery slope all the time. Start piling things like that on the backs of two people, one who is floundering with his place in life and his family, because they're mixed in a very bizarre way; another who's trying to get her footing in what has to be a very discombobulating role that has lots of weird public aspects to it, a press that's quick to be racist or speculate negative things about you, who might not find the climate and associated lifestyle in London to her taste, who doesn't have the most functional family background herself to draw from, and who's getting led down the rabbit hole by her husband's bitter and unhappy explanations -- but who doesn't realize her husband is unhappy overall because he's so happy and relieved he found her, which further distorts how she interprets the information and guidance he gives her. Doesn't matter who she is or what you think of her, there is legitimate reason to suggest that Meghan was not really in a position to have come in there and steered the bus according to her plans and backed it up all over the family. I do however believe she's absolutely lying through her teeth when she claimed not to really know the publicly available information and stories about the family. I do believe the mystique was a big attraction for her and she may have had plans. I definitely think reality forced her to pivot in ways she never expected, not in a million years.

 

[TLSnell1981]

I think that was one of the reasons why they did it. Because there wouldn't be a response from the family, it would really be their point of view.
For the family not talking back, must have been one of the most appealing aspects of doing the interview.

Thought it was unusual that even Prince Albert of Monaco spoke out.

"He slammed their choice to air their issues to tens of millions of people on TV saying such a 'public display of dissatisfaction... wasn't appropriate' and their decision to lay bare painful family rifts 'bothered him'."

May not be much but it speaks volumes. Bad decision for H&M...poor taste.

 

[TLSnell1981]

Almost as if what was said and how it was said was deliberately designed that way, no?

I take it there's some sort of rumor that Meghan threw hot tea at a servant in Australia? I would be quite surprised if that's true.



I don't know that I'm necessarily giving her credit. Count me in the crowd of people who were completely unaware of her existence until she was revealed as his girlfriend/fiance. I've never seen her perform and only am familiar with her as Harry's mate, etc. I don't really have a lot to go on to try and speculate much about what type of person she actually is. One thing I find almost impossible to believe is that she had the capability to marry into that family/business and land on her feet like a cat and be able to manipulate and run rings around everyone the way a lot of the press coverage assumes. I'm sure it was a lot to attempt to learn and navigate, no matter what kind of intentions anyone assumes she must have had. This is particularly where I think she probably was poorly served and wrongly influenced if Harry was in fact in a bad way himself as far as wanting to serve in a way that was fulfilling and finding much of what he was assigned hollow, so much worse if he was already beginning to nurse resentment to William taking on new roles and being promoted more and more as future king. Expenses had to jump significantly when Meghan joined the picture because she had to be kitted out with clothes befitting her new station. Is it possible at some point Charles made even a stupid joke about $$ that landed absolutely flat?

Let's face it, Charles isn't noted for being emotionally adept or in touch with much normality. Could staff even have made some pointed comments to Harry or Meghan about $$$ and ruffled feathers? People in that situation, normal people, famous people, royal people, it doesn't matter, little incidents like that set off hurt feelings in relationships. If they're not recognized or fixed relationships start sliding down a slippery slope all the time. Start piling things like that on the backs of two people, one who is floundering with his place in life and his family, because they're mixed in a very bizarre way; another who's trying to get her footing in what has to be a very discombobulating role that has lots of weird public aspects to it, a press that's quick to be racist or speculate negative things about you, who might not find the climate and associated lifestyle in London to her taste, who doesn't have the most functional family background herself to draw from, and who's getting led down the rabbit hole by her husband's bitter and unhappy explanations -- but who doesn't realize her husband is unhappy overall because he's so happy and relieved he found her, which further distorts how she interprets the information and guidance he gives her. Doesn't matter who she is or what you think of her, there is legitimate reason to suggest that Meghan was not really in a position to have come in there and steered the bus according to her plans and backed it up all over the family. I do however believe she's absolutely lying through her teeth when she claimed not to really know the publicly available information and stories about the family. I do believe the mystique was a big attraction for her and she may have had plans. I definitely think reality forced her to pivot in ways she never expected, not in a million years.

Allegedly...

"In a new book out by Lady Campbell it is alledged that Markle threw a cup of hot tea at someone - after a payment of £250,000 it was hushed up - apparently - if it is true I for one would want to know who paid the money and why she was not charged for assault - if it is not true then Markle can sue lady Campbell for libel." So far Meghan hasn't sued...at least for this revelation.

 

[Tink-osophy]

I don't think M needed to have entered the marriage and the Royal Family with any kind of scheme. I think it's more likely that she glossed over certain things in her mind and thought things would just work out her way anyway. H could have fed that belief., too.

Plus, IF she does have narcissistic tendencies, it could explain the various statements against her and further explain the direction she (& H) took.

I'm not saying this is all down to M. I can imagine it's an imperfect perfect storm of the two of them and their backgrounds (relating to their families and otherwise).

And I'm not saying I'm right! I doubt we'll ever know the exact truth from any side.

Still, the way they chose to present their complaints - sharing very private, personal business on global, sensationalist TV (despite supposedly despising sensationalist media coverage) along with mixing in some dubious claims ....and then moaning about their hardships (despite a million dollar home and various high flying 'job' offers) when others are genuinely struggling ------ the end result is they've undermined their own position.

People might say forget it and leave them alone, but we should be able to expect greater transparency and clarity from people who seem to want to assume powerful, public positions (not just ceremonial and supportive roles like the Royal Family).

It concerns me that people who make the kinds of choices they have, might be mass influencers.

 

[Karin1984]

It concerns me that people who make the kinds of choices they have, might be mass influencers.

In certain cases, there is not much difference anymore between certain celebrities, influencers and cult leaders. People always say 'oh that wouldn't happen to me', but it happens in every layer of society. Everyone who needs to find a purpose in life, who is searching, is extremely vulnerable to charismatic personalities who promise them a better future. Or make them forget their current humdrum lives.

Characteristics of cult leaders
- Narcissictic: tend to be highly self-absorbed. They may have simply grown up thinking that they're superior, some gain their sense of self-aggrandizement after having what they believe to be an encounter with a god or deity (or a 2nd Princess Di). They demand extreme loyalty. They don't allow criticism and seek to control everything that goes on within their following. Because they're driven by their ego, they believe that they deserve to make these demands.
- Charismatic: there's a magnetism to it that's hard to resist. They have that aura of being special — or people attribute that to them (What can be special to one person might not be all that alluring to someone else). It comes down to the cult leader finding people who respond well to how they present themselves and then bringing that group, no matter how small, under their wing.
- Unpredictable: a cult leader's erratic behavior allows them to maintain that aforementioned power imbalance. The leader will limit how often they actually appear before their following — then, when they do show up, they'll act with total duplicity. You don’t know if he’s going to come in as a raging bull or as a sweet seducer. This is a tactic to surefire to keep followers "on edge" with a desire to please the leader.
- A turn on: Once they've established their movement and gotten a taste of power, most cult leaders develop a clear motivating force behind their actions, be it status, money, sex, or all three, Even if they claim to be working or speaking for a higher power, it's far more likely that they're acting to serve their ego. And the lengths they'll go to satisfy their desires are usually far beyond the average person's limits.

Not saying this is Meghan (or Harry in certain aspects), I am not qualified, but looking at it, I do see certain similar character traits. And I like to entertain myself pretending that I can say something that is either entertaining, interesting or useful in this thread.

 

[snappy]

In certain cases, there is not much difference anymore between certain celebrities, influencers and cult leaders. People always say 'oh that wouldn't happen to me', but it happens in every layer of society. Everyone who needs to find a purpose in life, who is searching, is extremely vulnerable to charismatic personalities who promise them a better future. Or make them forget their current humdrum lives.

Characteristics of cult leaders
- Narcissictic: tend to be highly self-absorbed. They may have simply grown up thinking that they're superior, some gain their sense of self-aggrandizement after having what they believe to be an encounter with a god or deity (or a 2nd Princess Di). They demand extreme loyalty. They don't allow criticism and seek to control everything that goes on within their following. Because they're driven by their ego, they believe that they deserve to make these demands.
- Charismatic: there's a magnetism to it that's hard to resist. They have that aura of being special — or people attribute that to them (What can be special to one person might not be all that alluring to someone else). It comes down to the cult leader finding people who respond well to how they present themselves and then bringing that group, no matter how small, under their wing.
- Unpredictable: a cult leader's erratic behavior allows them to maintain that aforementioned power imbalance. The leader will limit how often they actually appear before their following — then, when they do show up, they'll act with total duplicity. You don’t know if he’s going to come in as a raging bull or as a sweet seducer. This is a tactic to surefire to keep followers "on edge" with a desire to please the leader.
- A turn on: Once they've established their movement and gotten a taste of power, most cult leaders develop a clear motivating force behind their actions, be it status, money, sex, or all three, Even if they claim to be working or speaking for a higher power, it's far more likely that they're acting to serve their ego. And the lengths they'll go to satisfy their desires are usually far beyond the average person's limits.

Not saying this is Meghan (or Harry in certain aspects), I am not qualified, but looking at it, I do see certain similar character traits. And I like to entertain myself pretending that I can say something that is either entertaining, interesting or useful in this thread.

Thanks for both an entertaining and thought provoking post. I too see similar traits in H&M. I guess time will tell. They have only just begun.

 

[tinatark]

I wish Oprah had asked about the wedding tiara incident.. maybe the Queen made Meghan cry?

I also do not think the marriage will last. I think when that happens Harry will be welcomed back to the RF warmly. The community assets should be the netflix deals, whatever is signed in CA, because of the way the RF assets are maintained. So it will not be as big a payday as it could have been.

 

[Karin1984]

I wish Oprah had asked about the wedding tiara incident.. maybe the Queen made Meghan cry?

Part one is that apparently Meghan wanted the tiara with the emeralds. Explanation why she couldn't have it: It was already promised to Eugenie who would marry a few months later.
The queen told Harry that it's up to her to pick the tiara, not Meghan, as it is her collection.

Allegedly, the second part is that Meghan's hairdresser was in London from Paris and she wanted to try on the tiara for her trial hairdo. They wanted to skip protocol, which the Queen's assistant didn't allow. The couple said the assistant dragged her feet on purpose to get them the tiara.

So yes, indirectly, in combination with protocol, very likely the queen made Meghan cry.