How Will Riviera Villas Be Priced?

[DVC92]

I believe the radical point restructuring for 2020 and price increase ( https://www.**********.com/2019-dvc-direct-price-increases/ ) for purchasing points are being done in preparation to more attractively market Riviera, and not because of increased demand for studios and 1BRs. Raising the cost of points at the more expensive resorts, particularly the monorail resorts and the EPCOT resorts, will allow DVC to charge more for Riviera, but less than the new pricing for the monorail resorts, and make buyers feel like they are getting a comparative bargain. Also, the raising of points across all of the resorts will allow them to charge more points for studios and 1BRs exchanges at the Riviera so people have to buy more points to get their desired stay. More $$$ in Disney's pockets. Over the years, the balance between Disney always wanting to be tops in consumer satisfaction and mining for dollars has shifted more and more to grabbing for dollars. This is just another double dip into DVC as their cash cow IMHO.

It will be revealing to watch the sales rollout for Riviera as to whether there is any merit to my conjecture.

 

[gharter]

Listening to the Dis Unplugged today, the cash prices were very high. Not a surprise.

 

[crvetter]

Listening to the Dis Unplugged today, the cash prices were very high. Not a surprise.

About what Bay Lake Tower (somewhat in line with Copper Creek and Boulder Ridge too) costs looking at the rate calendars for both resorts.

 

[Jerry@dvcstore]

Only guessing, but I think Disney will have an additional DVC price increase this year before Riviera opens, putting it's opening Buy-In price around $200 per point or slightly higher.
Should be interesting since they have 5 resorts that are already priced over $200 per point (BLT, BCV, POLY, GFV, GCV).

 

[sleepydog25]

Only guessing, but I think Disney will have an additional DVC price increase this year before Riviera opens, putting it's opening Buy-In price around $200 per point or slightly higher.
Should be interesting since they have 5 resorts that are already priced over $200 per point (BLT, BCV, POLY, GFV, GCV).

I agree. I've long thought the opening cost would hover around $200 pp. Increasing the other resorts would make Riviera seem like a veritable bargain. Of course, there's that pesky reality that should you buy there and unfortunately have to sell down the road, the resale buyer is stuck there. I'm sure there are many who won't care. A bit off topic, but based on the models of the rooms now popping up all over social media, the rooms looking incredibly generic and one note. But, maybe that's just me. Back on topic: $200 a point +/- $5 (not including any incentives to start).

 

[Bing Showei]

Of course, there's that pesky reality that should you buy there and unfortunately have to sell down the road, the resale buyer is stuck there.

I've been giving this concern a lot of thought myself lately, and I wonder if that will actually be an issue for the Riviera resale market.

Had DVD built a more poorly connected WDW resort hotel, say another SSR/OKW (speaking only to geography), then I can imagine how resale on the Riviera would be hammered. If SSR resale had to stay at SSR, for example, I can see those contract prices plummeting.

But if Riviera has the same appeal as VGF, BCV, and other "buy where you want to stay" resorts, and if the Skyliner is a success (a couple of big ifs, I know), would the single-resort restriction impact resale as much as we had all thought it might initially? I don't imagine a lot of people buying VGF to use those points to sleep around. In fact, maybe the future DVC model is built around how a lot members presently use the product. A collection of homes that are bought with the intent of only staying there. Members will own VGF, BWV/BCV, and AKV and alternate stays accordingly. Not a lot of sleeping around. They may have an SSR on their tool belt, for that specific purpose.

I still feel buying direct for someone already in the system as an L14 member would be a hard sell, but most direct sales are to park/cruise buyers so not much loss there. It might be that even a higher priced Riviera resale in the ballpark of BCV may make sense if people really wanted to stay there. I don't know a lot of VGF/BCV resale owners using their points at 7-months elsewhere; not at the premium prices paid for those resorts.

 

[keishashadow]

I've been giving this concern a lot of thought myself lately, and I wonder if that will actually be an issue for the Riviera resale market.

Had DVD built a more poorly connected WDW resort hotel, say another SSR/OKW (speaking only to geography), then I can imagine how resale on the Riviera would be hammered. If SSR resale had to stay at SSR, for example, I can see those contract prices plummeting.

But if Riviera has the same appeal as VGF, BCV, and other "buy where you want to stay" resorts, and if the Skyliner is a success (a couple of big ifs, I know), would the single-resort restriction impact resale as much as we had all thought it might initially? I don't imagine a lot of people buying VGF to use those points to sleep around. In fact, maybe the future DVC model is built around how a lot members presently use the product. A collection of homes that are bought with the intent of only staying there. Members will own VGF, BWV/BCV, and AKV and alternate stays accordingly. Not a lot of sleeping around. They may have an SSR on their tool belt, for that specific purpose.

I still feel buying direct for someone already in the system as an L14 member would be a hard sell, but most direct sales are to park/cruise buyers so not much loss there. It might be that even a higher priced Riviera resale in the ballpark of BCV may make sense if people really wanted to stay there. I don't know a lot of VGF/BCV resale owners using their points at 7-months elsewhere; not at the premium prices paid for those resorts.

Riviera is certainly a buy where you want to stay DVC property, for better or worse.

I could be wrong as to general appeal of the Skyliner. IMO nothing more than a novelty of sorts. We tend to rent a car and drive. Yes, I do expect traffic to be increased once SW opens but will deal with it.

We did buy BWV for F&W stays primarily and ability to walk ‘home’. I’ve never been tempted to walk to MGM but many love that ability. I really don’t equate Riviera’s gondolas in that same mind set.

 

[hakepb]

Riviera is certainly a buy where you want to stay DVC property, for better or worse.

I could be wrong as to general appeal of the Skyliner. IMO nothing more than a novelty of sorts. We tend to rent a car and drive. Yes, I do expect traffic to be increased once SW opens but will deal with it.

We did buy BWV for F&W stays primarily and ability to walk ‘home’. I’ve never been tempted to walk to MGM but many love that ability. I really don’t equate Riviera’s gondolas in that same mind set.

With continuous loading (kinda like Peoplemover instead of waiting 30-60 minutes for a bus or not to show up) a gondola should take less time than walking out to a car, driving, parking and walking or tram into the park.
But we’ll have to see if that is how it works.

 

[chicagodisneyguy]

I could be wrong as to general appeal of the Skyliner. IMO nothing more than a novelty of sorts. We tend to rent a car and drive. Yes, I do expect traffic to be increased once SW opens but will deal with it.

We did buy BWV for F&W stays primarily and ability to walk ‘home’. I’ve never been tempted to walk to MGM but many love that ability. I really don’t equate Riviera’s gondolas in that same mind set.

I think the Gondola's success will be a pretty big factor in the overall success of the resort. We own BWV for exactly the same reason you do...our F&W stays. Being able to be walk to two parks really makes a difference which is a huge factor in the continued success of BWV & BCV. If the gondolas can get people Riviera to/from HS & EC in anywhere near the time it takes to walk or friendship boat to/from the current Epcot resorts I think it will be huge. I'd be a buyer of resale even with the restrictions of only being able to stay there. Maybe not at the current spread between direct and resale. But unless the resort is a resounding dud, I think even with the new restrictions we'd need a 2008 or worse global crash to even think about nearing the $50, $40, or $30 low ball resale predictions I've seen in some threads.

I just think for all the people climbing over each other to pay $130 for BCV or BLT resale there will be people who would pay $75 to stay only at Riviera. Of course, a big part of me hopes I'm wrong. If anyone here buys Riviera direct and decides to sell...I'm a resting $50 bid on 200 points!

 

[keishashadow]

I think the Gondola's success will be a pretty big factor in the overall success of the resort. We own BWV for exactly the same reason you do...our F&W stays. Being able to be walk to two parks really makes a difference which is a huge factor in the continued success of BWV & BCV. If the gondolas can get people Riviera to/from HS & EC in anywhere near the time it takes to walk or friendship boat to/from the current Epcot resorts I think it will be huge. I'd be a buyer of resale even with the restrictions of only being able to stay there. Maybe not at the current spread between direct and resale. But unless the resort is a resounding dud, I think even with the new restrictions we'd need a 2008 or worse global crash to even think about nearing the $50, $40, or $30 low ball resale predictions I've seen in some threads.

I just think for all the people climbing over each other to pay $130 for BCV or BLT resale there will be people who would pay $75 to stay only at Riviera. Of course, a big part of me hopes I'm wrong. If anyone here buys Riviera direct and decides to sell...I'm resting $50 bid on 200 points!

Lol good luck with that bid

The journey isn’t all about the time it takes to get there. Just can’t get excited about stepping into a what I predict will be a glorified, claustrophobic hot box. I hope to be proven dead-wrong.

 

[kristenrice]

What happens if the points chart comes out and the rooms are ridiculously LOW? Like those 2-person closets are only 5-8 points per night? Or the studios are in the 10-12 point range? If they are charging $200/pt to stay there, but the rooms are low points, that would certainly make the points chart look attractive. Then, say that you can only stay here if you buy direct (or are grandfathered), suddenly, the demand to buy there increases. To me, I don't see the big draw to owning at this resort. As a current resale (2008) and direct owner, I can use my points to stay here without issue, but I really have no desire to do so as it really holds no appeal to me...yet. With so many owners who bought small contracts at other resorts, there would definitely be stiff competition for rooms with low points requirements, which would certainly drive up the requirement to own at Riviera to book the low-points rooms.

 

[JETSDAD]

What happens if the points chart comes out and the rooms are ridiculously LOW? Like those 2-person closets are only 5-8 points per night? Or the studios are in the 10-12 point range? If they are charging $200/pt to stay there, but the rooms are low points, that would certainly make the points chart look attractive. Then, say that you can only stay here if you buy direct (or are grandfathered), suddenly, the demand to buy there increases. To me, I don't see the big draw to owning at this resort. As a current resale (2008) and direct owner, I can use my points to stay here without issue, but I really have no desire to do so as it really holds no appeal to me...yet. With so many owners who bought small contracts at other resorts, there would definitely be stiff competition for rooms with low points requirements, which would certainly drive up the requirement to own at Riviera to book the low-points rooms.

While I don't see that happening, IF it did, that would be quite interesting to watch what happens. If they make the point chart low and studios are consistently booked before the 7 month mark, then I could see people buying direct even knowing the potential downside on the resale market. I think there would be interest on the resale side even knowing you were locked into that resort if the value was there as well. Again, I doubt that happens though.

 

[jade1]

We did buy BWV for F&W stays primarily and ability to walk ‘home’. I’ve never been tempted to walk to MGM but many love that ability. I really don’t equate Riviera’s gondolas in that same mind set.

Same, but I do think leaving IG we will arrive at Riviera faster by gondola than walking to BWV, depending on time of day/night. It may get a line after the new Illuminations.

However we still will prefer BWV and BCV to Riviera, but a cheap Riviera resale might be worth it for the occasional change of scenery.

 

[DougEMG]

What happens if the points chart comes out and the rooms are ridiculously LOW? Like those 2-person closets are only 5-8 points per night? Or the studios are in the 10-12 point range? If they are charging $200/pt to stay there, but the rooms are low points, that would certainly make the points chart look attractive. Then, say that you can only stay here if you buy direct (or are grandfathered), suddenly, the demand to buy there increases. To me, I don't see the big draw to owning at this resort. As a current resale (2008) and direct owner, I can use my points to stay here without issue, but I really have no desire to do so as it really holds no appeal to me...yet. With so many owners who bought small contracts at other resorts, there would definitely be stiff competition for rooms with low points requirements, which would certainly drive up the requirement to own at Riviera to book the low-points rooms.

And then once the resort sells out they will reallocate the points increasing them for those cheap rooms because the demand was just so high. All nice and legal. So sad, too bad for any owners who now need more points for the vacations.

 

[kristenrice]

And then once the resort sells out they will reallocate the points increasing them for those cheap rooms because the demand was just so high. All nice and legal. So sad, too bad for anyone owners who now need more points for the vacations.

^^^EXACTLY! Now that they have the "unlimited lock-off premium" to work with, they can build a nice little bank of breakage income into their budget down the road. If they are having problems selling, just "reallocate" and magically, they will have some cash flow coming in from their breakage income. Once SWGE opens, they won't have a problem filling rooms so there is sure to be a demand for near-park rooms. They will need cash inventory and raising that lock-off premium is now DVC's "best kept dirty little secret".

 

[Bearval]

I think the Gondola's success will be a pretty big factor in the overall success of the resort. We own BWV for exactly the same reason you do...our F&W stays. Being able to be walk to two parks really makes a difference which is a huge factor in the continued success of BWV & BCV. If the gondolas can get people Riviera to/from HS & EC in anywhere near the time it takes to walk or friendship boat to/from the current Epcot resorts I think it will be huge. I'd be a buyer of resale even with the restrictions of only being able to stay there. Maybe not at the current spread between direct and resale. But unless the resort is a resounding dud, I think even with the new restrictions we'd need a 2008 or worse global crash to even think about nearing the $50, $40, or $30 low ball resale predictions I've seen in some threads.

I just think for all the people climbing over each other to pay $130 for BCV or BLT resale there will be people who would pay $75 to stay only at Riviera. Of course, a big part of me hopes I'm wrong. If anyone here buys Riviera direct and decides to sell...I'm a resting $50 bid on 200 points!

I personally feel DCV will have no problem selling Riviera and that resale’s will be similar to The resort in Hawaii percentage wise with DVC not ROFRing any contracts until it is sold out.