Grade Grubbing Vent

[MM27]

my mother works with a lady that has called the professor for her daughter because she was not happy with the grade her daughter earned. Can't you just hear the helicopter blades turning?

 

[mamacatnv]

Parent of a college Freshman here. I agree with you OP, you should never cave to a student and give an unearned grade. However, being available to discuss the grades IMO is part of the job description. Being able to admit that mistakes do happen and reviewing a grade is different from just giving that extra point. Having a cut off for these discussions is fair and reasonable. After final grades are posted IMO is not a reasonable time to be discussing the grade unless there is some sort of very obvious error, which as a previous poster stated could be fixed in a matter of seconds.

As a paying parent, I have a level of expectation for both my student and the professionals who are being paid to teach my student, not pass him along just because he's charming or a PITA

FWIW my DS signed a document giving his Dad and I full access to his information. I would never ever dream of calling a professor that is DS's problem. DS jumped at the opportunity to allow us to discuss the finances with the accounting dept. However, I think kids these days have seen their parents set the argument example and see nothing wrong with it. Think of all those parents who call, visit and torture high school teachers. They didn't suddenly go away just because their kid went to college.

My sons English professor told his students, "make sure you are in attendance at every class. Attendance and participation is considered when your final grade is on the fence." DS never missed a class

 

[Quiksilvr]

FWIW, not to be rude, but their tuition is paying your salary. So, if they want you to tell them how to figure out their grade, just comply and tell them (which you apparently were already doing). Obviously, don't change the grade. Remember... just smile and nod to their complaining.

In my teaching situations I refuse to consider the students as "customers" to whom I owe anything other than an education and the opportunity to learn the material. If they don't get a good grade because their work was inferior, that's their problem. I'm willing to explain why their work was inferior, but I'm not willing to give them a break because it would make them feel better.

 

[Quiksilvr]

Luckily, I never needed to "grade grub" but I knew it went on. It always seemed so demeaning to everyone, but at the end of the day, the student got the points and got a better grade. Very annoying.

When I first started law school I was skeptical of "blind grading" "enforced curves" and "cumulative exams", but by the end I was wishing every class I took at every level had been that way. No grade grubbing possible. The prof got a stack of exams with randomized identification numbers on them, graded them, turned them in to the administration, and they matched up the scores to the names and then we got the grades. It made things much cleaner and you didn't have to feel like you needed to campaign for your grade.

The enforced standardized curve was also nice. It was usually good for me.

I know this won't endear me to the college kids, but I actually liked the cumulative exams. Since we had the enforced curve to ensure that x% of the class would get As, x% would get A-s, x% would get B+s and so forth, all we had to worry about was our performance relative to the other people in our class. It was nice.

 

[Pooh Girl 71]

I had never even heard of grade grubbing till last year. A friend of mine is an adjunct professor and the stories she tells me about the grad students arguing about grades shocked me to no end! I would never have done that. I didn't even argue with the ethics professor who didn't like my opinion on a subject and gave me a C on a paper because of it.

 

[GRUMPY PIRATE]

I was suprised the first time it happened to me, but I was forwarned by another Adjunct professor to expect it. thats why I structered the system of tests, and to comply with the academic standards.

And to a PP who implied that the tuition pays my salary. Umm, no.

I had one student try and bring that up. My reply is that the college pays my salary, not the student. And my pay is for teaching them, and haveing the personal integrity to ensure that they are given the information they need to complete the course successfully. If they are not able to demonstrte that they gained the knowledge, concepts, and skills that I taught, then they will be graded as to what they EARNED. Not by my whim on if I like or dislike the student.

Also, my salary for one course is about what ONE student pays for in tuition, so I simply tell them that truthfully, they are not that student (HA!)

 

[Val]

After 25 years of teaching freshmen to grad students, I expect the grade grubbing....but don't like it, and don't bend to it. My grades are established on the syllabus. It only took three hours after grades were posted this semester to get my first complaint.....I refuse to respond to questions over the break....Hey, I am supposed to be on break, as well. If they have a specific question, that's fine. I don't respond to "Prof, I got a C instead of a B, can you tell me why?"........if you don't know, maybe that explains WHY you got the lower grade.

It gets easier the longer you teach. I can only imagine how many students have failed to get into med school, engineering school, grad school, the military, their best job, (insert your vocational issues here) because I was mean and didn't "give them" the grade they needed (because, of course, it was ONLY me and my course that were blocking them).....and thank God that means I can drive over a bridge that won't fall down, might have an intelligent and well educated doctor, have knowledgeable administrators, and maybe even knowledgeable military officers BECAUSE I didn't pass along the students who didn't earn the grade.

Also, remember that you don't GIVE grades....the student EARNS them! Maybe if some of the CEO's had learned this lesson, our dear country wouldn't be in such dire straits.

(Stepping off of the soap box now!).

 

[pooh98378]

In my teaching situations I refuse to consider the students as "customers" to whom I owe anything other than an education and the opportunity to learn the material. If they don't get a good grade because their work was inferior, that's their problem. I'm willing to explain why their work was inferior, but I'm not willing to give them a break because it would make them feel better.

FWIW, not to be rude, but their tuition is paying your salary. So, if they want you to tell them how to figure out their grade, just comply and tell them (which you apparently were already doing). Obviously, don't change the grade. Remember... just smile and nod to their complaining.

I didn't say that at all... re-read the quote. I specifically said that she should NOT change the grade. However, when I'm paying $30k a year for a college education, I do expect the professor to sit down with me and answer my questions as to how the final grade was calculated, NOT given -- mistakes happen, even with computers.

In other words, I expect the professor to be available for office hours, and not simply dodge me because I have a *legitimate* (not grade grubbing) question.