Genealogy Research

[tinkryansmom]

OK weird question:

Has anyone ever researched jail or court records??

There is a story where my moms grandfather "went away" for 7 or 8 years and nobody ever talked about why. They think he went to jail??

Thought I might be able to find out.

So anyone ever looked something like that up?

 

[PrincessNancy96]

Yep, had that happen before...
Actually met the man who was said to be a "fugitive" don't know if that was truely the case or not...but I did some research, I got old newspaper clippings from the incident. I know what county in KY it happened in so I really should go get the court records.

I have also found the court records need to get copies of them of a divorce on my DH side of the family (actually his great-grandmother)..anyway, the paper it is on is the old "onion sheet" kind of paper that we used way back long ago when you used a typewriter.. You should have seen my DD14's face when we were explaining it to her at the Historical Museum! You would have thought the staff person and myself had sprung 2 heads!

 

[Lisa]

My husband's cousin found a relative going way back who played naughty with animals.

 

[hopemax]

I tried looking once. According to my grandma, my Great-Grandmother's brother (her uncle) was in the mob, and went to prison. Her aunt (uncle's wife) changed their last name to disassociate her family with him. But I didn't find anything. Not that I spent too much time looking.

 

[piratesmate]

I don't have any stories like that, but I had a crazy great-great-uncle. His sister was my mother's godmother & was like another grandmother in our house. She was great, but her brother was another story. My aunt regularly had him commited to the state mental hospital. Unfortunately, he could play her like a well-tuned violin. She'd go visit & the next thing we knew, he was out again. According to crazy Uncle Art, he'd buried money all over town (didn't trust banks after the Depression) and people would often come home & find him digging up their yards.

I tried to get records a few years ago from the state mental hospital - not for him, but for a great-great-great-grandmother who was there. According to her father's will, she was admitted there after her husband left her & the children and was living with another woman - pretending she his wife. Sadly, the story was related to me incorrectly by an elderly descendant of hers. He told me that it was the 2xgreat-grandmother who was there, but she'd only commited suicide after the death of her infant son. I'd requested the info before HIPPA took affect, but for the wrong person.

By the time I got it sorted out, HIPPA was in affect and I was told that I'd need to have myself declared her legal guardian or some such nonsense. So I never got the info. All I'd wanted was her date of death really. I think it's ridiculous that they wouldn't give me info for someone who'd been dead over 150 yrs because of the privacy act. That's not at all what the HIPPA act was enacted for!

 

[piratesmate]

I was wondering if I could ask a favor from one of you who has access to the census records at Ancestry?

On Monday DD had to go to Allentown for the writing section of the PSSA tests and DH & I ran over to Easton to the Court House to look at marriage certificates, birth records, etc. We finally found his great grandmother's marriage certificate! I'm so excited!! (She had a different last name than her son & no one knew why...long story.)

Anyway, I no longer have my subscription to Ancestry and can't wait until I have the $$ again to find out a few things. (Our car just died & we had to go buy another on Saturday. )

So if someone is willing to look up a couple names for me, please send me a PM. If possible, I'd like you to save the census page as a JPG or Mr Sid file & email it to me.

TIA!

 

[Faerie]

Pirates, as soon as they work out my subscription (i have to call tonight) I can do it for you.

I have a quandry, I spent last weekend with Papa. He was born in 1928. He had a sister (Aunt Marion) who was older, but I didn't realize she was 12 years older. Apparently his mother was married (I think) prior to his father but Papa refers to Marion has his step sister. I'm thinking he is mistaken and she's actually a half sister. He knows nothing about his mother's first marriage. No idea if it was divorce or if the husband died.

Am I going to be able to find this information? Aunt Marion was born somewhere around 1916, so divorce was quite uncommon at that time

 

[piratesmate]

That would be so awesome Faerie! I really appreciate it!

Do you have someone in MA that could check marriage records for you? I'm not sure how it works in other states, but in PA the counties keep the records...the ones I've checked start around 1885 - with some earlier. Before that you usually need to check church records.

How much info those records contain depends on the county evidently. My home county has always required the names of the applicants' parents regardless of whether or not they were minors at the time. Yesterday, I found out that Northampton County only required the name of a parent when an applicant was a minor.

Another problem I've run into is that I was spoiled by my home county's archives. Marriage applications are indexed by both the groom's & bride's surnames with the copies in a different set of books. All recorded applications are indexed in the same set of books...it's very easy to find all the WERKHEISER grooms (for example) from 1885 to the present. Northampton County is a whole other situation. Each book is indexed, but may only contain 6 months worth of applications...so I had to go through zillions of books when all I had to go on was census records.

One thing that remained constant between counties was whether or not someone had been previously married. I'm not sure how Northampton recorded it (the ones I was looking at were all 1st marriages), but my home county actually listed things like "previous marriage dissolved by death 2 Nov 1918".

Again, it's different county to county here, but some archive repositories are willing to look up a marriage for you & send you a copy for a small fee...or even tell you the info over the phone depending on who you speak to. Others won't do it at all - either like Philadelphia because it's too large or like Northampton because there's no real index.

 

[Faerie]

I'll be up there again in May for 4 days so I can go and try to do some digging then. It was amazing how Papa knew nothing. Then again, his mother and father never lived together, even though they were married. Apparently it wasn't a pleasent marriage

 

[tinkryansmom]

Pirates, I too am willing to help if Faerie cannot get her subscription issues solved. Feel free to PM me if I can be of any assistance.

Have any of you joined the Geneaological Society of the locations you are searching?? If so, do they tend to be any more helpful than the clerks you get to talk to when you call??

 

[tinkryansmom]

Another quick question: Anyone found an easy way to search for and/or obtain old newspaper stories?? There is a website that charges but don't really want to go that route.

Is searching microfiche at my local library the only way!? I don't plan on going to Ohio anytime soon so using the library close to the area I am searching is kinda out of the question.

Thanks.

 

[piratesmate]

You ladies are the best! I actually have quite a few things I'd like to ook up, so another offer is great. There's no way I'd ask anyone to look up all the things I want! LOL I'll send you a PM tinkryansmom and thanks again!

As to your questions...

I've joined several different historical societies over the years that I've been searching. In most cases the people at the society were either helpful to all or not helpful to anyone...regardless of their membership status. There is a Mennonite center less than 2 miles from my house. They have collected church records from all over the county - regardless of denomination. The staff there is helpful to everyone. For a while I was there every week and once they got to know my face, they'd often stop by to chat about how the search was going and save a nwe article that they'd noticed that reference my line.

But the most helpful person I've ever encountered was at the county archives - no membership involved! The one woman actually had a subscription to Ancestry & would look things up for people while you were there...no request was made, she just would look up the person referenced in the documents you'd just requested copies of.

The least helpful person I've ever encountered was at the county historical society for my home county. They don't allow anyone to access their records without a year's membership and all she ever did was growl when anyone asked for records...but she kept them loced away so that the only way to access them was to ask. I hate going over there & will try every other avenue before caving & going there.

One of the things I desperately wanted from Ancestry was newspapers. They never seem to get the ones I need though. The last I looked there was nothing for Philadelphia. For those I have to go to the public library in the city, which is no easy task. I wanted some for Lawton, Oklahoma as well, but they never added those either.

Just tonight, though, I found out that the library in Northampton county has an index on the Internet for every obit from 1915 to 2007! To get the actual obit, they charge $5 for each obit you request. I'm not sure if it would be cheaper if I actually go to the library, or if the only way to obtain them is via mail. I want too many to pay that much. I'd be happy just reading them & transcribing them myself. That family has been a brick wall for me!

Have you tried Googling for county websites? Some have extensive records available!

I'll send a PM with the info I'd like you to look up as soon as I ahve a chance.

 

[tinkryansmom]

Arg - I don't enjoy dealing with people who just don't want to be helpful for any specific reason.

I have googled the county websites. Thanks for the tip. I actually did pay for a copy of a death certificate from Ohio and already received that. My dads grandmother apparently died in some sort of accident involving a freight train so I figure there has to be an article or obit or something. He was always told his grandfather died also but looks to me like he might have remarried! So that is interesting.

No luck finding a county with newspapers online that are helpful but I will keep looking. I have really just started so I am sure I will make headway eventually.

I know my grandmother was a member of the New England society because I have some of her newsletters. It seems you get lending library rights so I guess if internet ends up being a deadend I will try that route.??

Thanks for all of your help! I will pull those census records this week.

 

[Faerie]

I'm slightly amazed - my grandmother kept obits from her grandparents and her dad and Papa has a couple too from the newspaper. Heck, he still has the newspaper article from their wedding (they would have celebrated 50 years next week). They're all really yellowed. I need to figure out a good way to preserve them

 

[piratesmate]

Faerie, I've simply scanned the old newspaper records. Yes, it's really cool to have the actual piece of paper, but I'm sure it's only a matter of time before they disintegrate. Hopefully, those digital images I have will last longer. Besides, they're easier to work with, you know?

I have quite a few articles, obits, etc that were saved. It just depends on which family we're talking about. DH's mother has some from her side, but not many. There are none from his father's side. My father's mother kept zillions of the things! But none from her husband's side...he died when I was 5 and evidently there were issues there. My mother & her family was pretty good about keeping things too.

tinkryansmom - My father's great grandfather was a policeman in Philadelphia who was killed by a train on his way home from work in 1877. I thought for sure there would be something about it in the newspaper. Granted, I wasn't the one looking - it was DH who was in the city one day on business - but all he could find was an obit...and he didn't think to get a photocopy or even write/type out the info! He just came home & said, "Yeah, that's the date he died & he was hit by a train." LOL Some day I need to get down there myself.

Gotta run for now...DH is home touching up the new paint job and I have some major cleaning to do & I can't put it off while he's home.

 

[Faerie]

Papa has old (like from Grandma's Grandmother) funeral books. They're really nice and in pretty good condition. Most of the deaths were in the 40's and 50's. They have basic family info so I was able to get some names from there, and they were nice enough to include maiden names too!

 

[piratesmate]

Papa has old (like from Grandma's Grandmother) funeral books. They're really nice and in pretty good condition. Most of the deaths were in the 40's and 50's. They have basic family info so I was able to get some names from there, and they were nice enough to include maiden names too!

LOL That always irks me about old records...when they don't include maiden names! Didn't they know we genealogists were going to need that info?!?!?

What's even worse than no maiden name, though, is a birth record where a child was born to Martin A Werkheiser & Mrs. Werkheiser. It was nice of them to include his middle initial since this name is like "Smith" in that county though.

My grandmother kept letters, birth announcement & funeral notices for people back in the 30s. The problem is that many of them I have no clue if they were really related or not! She was forever calling people "cousin" or "aunt" when they were just family friends - and of course she never explained the relationship. Some of them are marked things like "cousin Bill" but they could just have been friends. His name doesn't match any of the info I've found.

One of my many frustrations with this was my "Aunt" Hannah. As a child I remember asking her how we were related. I already knew that her parents were both deceased (her mother when Gram was only3 & her father in 1939) & her only sister had died in 1921. Once she told me that Aunt Hannah was her step-sister. Another time she told me that she was a foster sister. She'd told my father that Hannah was her half sister.

As near as I can tell, Hannah's mother never married Gram's father. However, Gram's aunt Maria was married to Hannah's uncle John. Maria & John were house parents at a boarding school & Gram spent a lot of time visiting them. It's so confusing!! LOL

 

[Faerie]

I think that for older generations, the whole step/half sibling thing is so foreign, they just don't get it. That's what I ran into with Papa and Aunt Marion. He says step, but I don't see how that's possible, unless his mother was married before his father and that guy had Aunt Marion for a previous marriage. It'll help if I can figure out what Great-Gram Annie had in terms of marriages.

 

[tinkryansmom]

OK Question:

Where is everyone??

Wait that is not my question. I used ancestry to do a quick search on my moms maiden name. Nothing too much has ever come up but this time an entire tree showed up from one tree. It ended with my moms dad and went back to the mid 1700s I think.

I sent a note to the contact person but have not recevied, nor do I really expect, a response.

So - how do you verify research like this that someone else has done but has given no references for?? I don't feel comfortable just adding to my tree without verifying it first.

Piratesmate - did you get the information I sent??

 

[Lisa]

tinkryansmom,

I think that is great info that you found. You know your Dad's info is right, can you verify his parent's? It's a good place to start. Often people who have done a tree have their sources attached, another way to verify what info you have.

I am burnt out myself. Trying to take a break until I attend the Family History New England Conference the end of this month.