Fight Florida's anti-LGBTQ+ changes

[Colleen27]

If you read the law, the law says TEACHING...not discussing. And certainly no law is going to stop a 7-8 year old from saying whatever comes to their mind to another kid.

Yeah, but that's another one of those hair-splitting things that becomes a potential quagmire in the application. An example a teacher friend of mine posted today: She had a student (1st grade) who was using "gay" as an insult, so she took a few minutes to talk to the whole class about what that word means and why it is wrong to use it as synonymous with "stupid" or whatever other insipid insults early elementary school kids sling at one another. Now, is that teaching or is it discussing? Obviously it wasn't part of the curriculum, but things do come up in classrooms that aren't "book learning" but still need to be addressed. The law would specifically prevent using moments like that as applied lessons in tolerance/kindness.

 

[brockash]

If you read the law, the law says TEACHING...not discussing. And certainly no law is going to stop a 7-8 year old from saying whatever comes to their mind to another kid.

People on BOTH sides are only making an issue of this non-event in order to further their own political agendas.

Florida's governor, who has been backed into a corner by the legislature on this issue, is rumored to be a potential presidential candidate -- and therefore, FLORIDA BAD! That's really all this is.

Trust me, I've worked in and have first hand experience of what that means for districts, extreme parents and I'm sure many of the politicians behind the bill know as well.

 

[neverlandsky]

We unknowingly went to DL and it was "Gay Days". By far one of the best experiences we had with the kids. So much laughter, love, & kindness in the air. It was awesome. WDW is missing out.

 

[JimMIA]

Yeah, but that's another one of those hair-splitting things that becomes a potential quagmire in the application. An example a teacher friend of mine posted today: She had a student (1st grade) who was using "gay" as an insult, so she took a few minutes to talk to the whole class about what that word means and why it is wrong to use it as synonymous with "stupid" or whatever other insipid insults early elementary school kids sling at one another. Now, is that teaching or is it discussing? Obviously it wasn't part of the curriculum, but things do come up in classrooms that aren't "book learning" but still need to be addressed. The law would specifically prevent using moments like that as applied lessons in tolerance/kindness.

To me, that is a very appropriate teacher response to a 6 year-old wannabe bully. It's no different than if the child had called the other kid "stupid" or worse. The student is misbehaving, and the teacher is responding appropriately. My middle DD is a veteran kindergarten teacher and she intercedes all the time in little dramas like that.

We can all think of "woulda, coulda, shoulda" scenarios and pose them in numerous different ways depending on our own biases. In this particular situation, I do not believe it's a situation where the new law would apply, but others will undoubtedly think it would...or could...or should.

Also, obviously school boards will develop more detailed policies about how this new nothing law will be applied. And those policies will be interpreted by hundreds of principals, often with common sense.

I just don't see this becoming a REAL problem in our schools -- and I mean that both ways. It's not a big existing problem in our schools, and this new nothing law is not going to create any significant problems...IMHO.

We've got a lot worse problems than this.

 

[Sinder]

Yeah, but that's another one of those hair-splitting things that becomes a potential quagmire in the application. An example a teacher friend of mine posted today: She had a student (1st grade) who was using "gay" as an insult, so she took a few minutes to talk to the whole class about what that word means and why it is wrong to use it as synonymous with "stupid" or whatever other insipid insults early elementary school kids sling at one another. Now, is that teaching or is it discussing? Obviously it wasn't part of the curriculum, but things do come up in classrooms that aren't "book learning" but still need to be addressed. The law would specifically prevent using moments like that as applied lessons in tolerance/kindness.

Why does it need to be addressed to the whole class though, why couldn't your friend take the child aside and tell them it is wrong and not to do it again? 5/6 year olds don't always need a lesson, sometimes they just need to be told not to do something. And this goes for any insult a student was throwing around.
Now if kids raised their hands and have questions and asks what it means, a simple 2 second explanation of what it is and then a "OK let's move on to......." is simple enough, which is what it sounds like your friend did. I wouldn't consider that against the law.

 

[JimMIA]

We unknowingly went to DL and it was "Gay Days". By far one of the best experiences we had with the kids. So much laughter, love, & kindness in the air. It was awesome. WDW is missing out.

OMG, what are you talking about? Haven't you ever been to WDW during a Pride Week? WDW has one every year, I believe in June...and have had for many years.

 

[neverlandsky]

OMG, what are you talking about? Haven't you ever been to WDW during a Pride Week? WDW has one every year, I believe in June...and have had for many years.

Ok so WDW does have Pride Week. Didn't know. Only been to WDW once.

 

[JimMIA]

Only been to WDW once.

Well...GET BUSY! Start planning your next trip!

 

[BlueStarryHat]

*Peeks into thread*

Still open? Mm-kay.

*Leaves thread*

 

[Colleen27]

OMG, what are you talking about? Haven't you ever been to WDW during a Pride Week? WDW has one every year, I believe in June...and have had for many years.

Yep, though technically both events are unofficial and not Disney-sponsored or sanctioned.

Now, in Paris they have an official hard ticket Pride event. It only started in 2019 and was canceled because of covid the last two years, but it is back for this year and remains Disney's first and only sanctioned Pride event. Mickey & Minnie even get event-specific outfits.

 

[BrianL]

Ok so WDW does have Pride Week. Didn't know. Only been to WDW once.

Technically Gay Days is not an official Disney event but a larger organized event, but they are accommodating to those celebrating there. It's not something that they "do" at Disneyland though. The same is true about the goth night, dapper day, etc.

 

[LYSE]

*Peeks into thread*

Still open? Mm-kay.

*Leaves thread*

How I look at the bill as a Floridian.

 

[superme80]

*Peeks into thread*

Still open? Mm-kay.

*Leaves thread*

Same. Came home from dance and was surprised.

 

[neverlandsky]

Why all the hate towards Disney? It's political therefore not their arena. "Disney “unequivocally” stands with its LGBTQ+ employees but wouldn’t be taking any public stances on the matter." This is majority of companies that exist. If you're going to hold Disney accountable then you have to hold every company accountable in FL from Walmart, Target, Publix, Darden Restaurants, Royal Caribbean Cruises, etc.

 

[Cheburashka]

things do come up in classrooms that aren't "book learning" but still need to be addressed.

Sexuality does not have to be discussed with elementary-aged children at school. I'm a very experienced elementary school teacher and can vouch for that. If they directly ask you a question about sex (this almost never happens), you do not engage with it, simply suggest they ask their parents and move the conversation to a school-appropriate subject. Whether their parents discuss it with them or not, it is the parents' right and responsibility to do so, not the teacher's. If they are having a school-inappropriate conversation (happens occasionally), you redirect it to an appropriate topic. If they call someone a name (happens occasionally), you address the practice of name-calling, but don't need to analyze the meaning of any given name that's called. It isn't rocket science, really.

 

[JimMIA]

Same. Came home from dance and was surprised.

LOL, me too!

Another poster said "Please don't bring politics into the DIS," which I "Liked."

I replied something about the way to stop political threads was to "Report" them -- which I'm sure has happened with this thread.

Both the "no politics on the DIS" and my reply were almost immediately deleted.

I thought the thread was obviously political, and in violation of posting guidelines from Post #1, but I guess this discussion is okay as long as we mind our manners.

 

[brockash]

Yeah, but that's another one of those hair-splitting things that becomes a potential quagmire in the application. An example a teacher friend of mine posted today: She had a student (1st grade) who was using "gay" as an insult, so she took a few minutes to talk to the whole class about what that word means and why it is wrong to use it as synonymous with "stupid" or whatever other insipid insults early elementary school kids sling at one another. Now, is that teaching or is it discussing? Obviously it wasn't part of the curriculum, but things do come up in classrooms that aren't "book learning" but still need to be addressed. The law would specifically prevent using moments like that as applied lessons in tolerance/kindness.

Exactly...this kind of stuff happens constantly. I think the real issue is that you have a population of parents who are so insecure, judgemental, or hateful (personally I think it depends and is often a combination) that they don't want their kids to be aware of or even interact with other kids who don't share the same beliefs and are worried the impact that a professional adult who are in a position in which they should and do not offer an opinion on the subject, other than to have human decency towards one another, may somehow convince their child or expose their child to have different beliefs than their parents.

 

[LYSE]

LOL, me too!

Another poster said "Please don't bring politics into the DIS," which I "Liked."

I replied something about the way to stop political threads was to "Report" them -- which I'm sure has happened with this thread.

Both the "no politics on the DIS" and my reply were almost immediately deleted.

I thought the thread was obviously political, and in violation of posting guidelines from Post #1, but I guess this discussion is okay as long as we mind our manners.

I personally like when forums let anything go in the general sections if it's respectful, but in terms of the DIS they seem to selectively apply rules and there are times where extreme bias shines through, to the point of giving false Information even.

 

[superme80]

LOL, me too!

Another poster said "Please don't bring politics into the DIS," which I "Liked."

I replied something about the way to stop political threads was to "Report" them -- which I'm sure has happened with this thread.

Both the "no politics on the DIS" and my reply were almost immediately deleted.

I thought the thread was obviously political, and in violation of posting guidelines from Post #1, but I guess this discussion is okay as long as we mind our manners.

It is super fascinating to me. I haven't looked at the bill as I don't live in Florida, and I homeschool. I love it when we can all be adults and discuss things maturely.

 

[JimMIA]

Exactly...this kind of stuff happens constantly. I think the real issue is that you have a population of parents who are so insecure, judgemental, or hateful (personally I think it depends and is often a combination) that they don't want their kids to be aware of or even interact with other kids who don't share the same beliefs and are worried the impact that a professional adult who are in a position in which they should and do not offer an opinion on the subject, other than to have human decency towards one another, may somehow convince their child or expose their child to have different beliefs than their parents.

I suspect parents probably tend to overreact in both directions depending on our biases.

But honestly, I think we have an inflated idea of how influential teachers are in molding kids opinions about social issues. I think kids -- even cute little K-3 kids -- are much more influenced by their peer group than by teachers. So I don't see the teacher as either a threat or a savior.

And, as I've said before, I don't think any advocate for or against this legislation is motivated by what is good for kids, parents, families, teachers, the general concept of learning, or our school systems.

It's pure politics, and nothing else matters to the OP and the politicians who hype this stuff -- on BOTH sides.

As MJ correctly said: "They don't really care about US!"