Elephant in the room....

[KAT4DISNEY]

Disney just put a stop to that because they knew it wasn’t right. Or maybe it’s over money but they still put a stop to people circumventing a rule. .

Of course they didn't. They put a stop to it because they were losing money on it.

 

[Bearval]

1) It was DISNEY WORLD RESORTS not DVC that has stated they will cancel FP+ when reservation is cancelled. DVC reservations do happen to also fall under FP+ rules, but there is nothing that says Disney even has to let DVC use FP+...this is negotiated between the two entities.
2) DVC and Disney are two very different entities, legally and also in practical terms.
3) Rules are made to benefit the majority of membership, not the minority of membership...would you be OK if the people with 10000 point or more, a minority of the membership, could book at 12 months out instead of 11...or would you be complaining?
4) The negative impact of walking IS on the minority of members, those trying to book the most popular reservation dates, in the most popular rooms (studios). No matter what, there would never be enough studios for those dates to satisfy everyone that wants them.
5) Walking violates none of the current rules. DVC management has nothing to gain, and Disney has nothing to gain by trying to do anything about the problem...the rooms will be filled with members...it doesn't matter to Disney or DVC which particular member is in the room.
6) And like it or not, purchasing a fixed week IS a solution to the problem. That is likely the Disney/DVC answer to limited availability for none fixed week members...reservations are limited by availability, and is subject to DVC booking rules. Period.
7) Prior to the current check-in day + 7 booking method, it was far more difficult for most members to book high demand periods, most would end up with a hole somewhere in their reservation. Most members prefer knowing at the time of booking if they have the reservation, and whether they will be able to add on to complete the reservation, so they can make flight arrangements, and so forth.

Ok you have now convinced me to start walking my reservations months in advance.

 

[Chuck S]

Ok you have now convinced me to start walking my reservations months in advance.

Go for it, if you feel you need to walk to get your desired reservation. You've always been free to do so. Remember though, by starting "months" in advance it will be quite time consuming, certainly much more time and energy than I'd put into getting a reservation...time is money in my business of purchasing, refurbishing and renting houses and duplexes.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Ok you have now convinced me to start walking my reservations months in advance.

That will be a waste of time - but have fun.

 

[ParkHoppers]

Reread what Marionette wrote. She’s talking about how Disney’s perspective is “there’s nothing gained by pissing off a lot of members.” Disney has no dog in this fight. They just leave it to the peasants to duke it out.

You can stand on the sidelines and bemoan the system, calling people names, deflecting any need to offer a solution, but doing so only minimizes your position to someone who’s just complaining from atop their high horse.

Feel free to complain, but unless you are offering any meaningful ideas on how to address this, your “truth hurts” philosophy is nothing more than a very public venting session.

Oh I apologize to her on that. I thought she said I was pissing people off for speaking my mind on walking. Where did I call people names? I said I thought walking is a form of cheating because it is circumventing the 11 month rule. That’s not name calling. And I appreciate you telling me what I am allowed to talk about in here but the fix is complicated and I honestly don’t know the exact way to fix it. So what. We wouldn’t need a fix if people didn’t feel it was OK to circumvent a major rule and put themselves in front of members who follow the rules. Just because someone gets away with something doesn’t mean nothing wrong was done. First question to if you may have done anything wrong is....was anyone else hurt by your actions? With walking the answer is yes.

 

[disneynutz]

Oh I apologize to her on that. I thought she said I was pissing people off for speaking my mind on walking. Where did I call people names? I said I thought walking is a form of cheating because it is circumventing the 11 month rule. That’s not name calling. And I appreciate you telling me what I am allowed to talk about in here but the fix is complicated and I honestly don’t know the exact way to fix it. So what. We wouldn’t need a fix if people didn’t feel it was OK to circumvent a major rule and put themselves in front of members who follow the rules. Just because someone gets away with something doesn’t mean nothing wrong was done. First question to if you may have done anything wrong is....was anyone else hurt by your actions? With walking the answer is yes.

I don't see it as circumventing the 11 month rule, the reservation is being made at 11 months, just date modified later. The rule says nothing about walking isn't allowed.

Bill

 

[ParkHoppers]

I don't see it as circumventing the 11 month rule, the reservation is being made at 11 months, just date modified later. The rule says nothing about walking isn't allowed.

Bill

In a court of law intent is an important part of the case. People are booking days with no intention of keeping those days. They are using the walking loophole to try to circumvent the 11 month rule.

 

[Pooh12863]

This place is going to be hilarious when DVC implements the 8 month booking window for resale contracts.

 

[Chuck S]

This place is going to be hilarious when DVC implements the 8 month booking window for resale contracts.

 

[DougEMG]

The rule is that you can make a reservation at 11 months, that is what is in the contract, right?

How the booking system implements isn't part of the contract and can be changed and has been changed. Now I didn't own while the previous rule was in place were your last day had to be in the 11 month window and that must of really sucked. Now we have 11 months + 7 days. And more recently we have gotten the ability to modify reservations online. So the way the reservation system is implement allows people to circumvent the 11 month contract rule. One definition of a loophole is "an ambiguity or inadequacy in the law or a set of rules". It seems to me that the ability to walk is a loophole which is allowing members to have a final reservation that was booked earlier than the 11 month contractual booking rule.

High demand for a specific number of rooms, owners with not many points, resorts with point hogs rooms (bungalows and cabins) and the easy of walking all have made the problem more prevalent now.

As a BWV owner that always books standard studios, I have been forced to start looking early to try and secure a room and then walk it or risk not getting the room at the time I want. So if it is a choice of not getting what I want or walking, I will walk. So far I've never had to walk more than a few days, but I do start watching a few weeks before I want to go to see how things are looking. I really hope I never have to start walking weeks or months to get what I want, but I am afraid that could happen. The ease of walking is going to cause a nasty feedback loop, forcing more and more people to walk further and further out.

A simple solution would be for DVC to keep track of the original check-in date when the reservation was first made, then only allow the final check-in date to be X number of days after that (say 7), otherwise it is a cancel and rebook. This still lets people walk for a week, but also allows people to make changes due to flight changes.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

In a court of law intent is an important part of the case. People are booking days with no intention of keeping those days. They are using the walking loophole to try to circumvent the 11 month rule.

Do you realize the tizzy is mostly about 5 rooms? Out of a possible 4887 DVC rooms at WDW? A tenth of a percent of WDW rooms. 5 of the 10 that DVC was required to take as part of converting Jambo? 5 rooms that per the POS in my hand might be competed over by 27,923 AKV members? 5 rooms that DVC certainly wouldn't have made concierge except they were on the floor with the lounge and really no good way to restrict them? And if a few of the almost 28,000 AKV members can't book one of those 5 rooms there are still other rooms for them to book?

It's a flexible points system with no reservation guaranteed for anytime you want it. IF that causes such an issue for any one owner there are other ways to book Concierge rooms at WDW.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

The rule is that you can make a reservation at 11 months, that is what is in the contract, right?

No - it's actually that owners will have at least a 1 month home priority booking window. Other than that it could be 12 months, 24 months, 2 months etc.



I'll just add a bit as a BWV owner. I booked both BWV standard studio and BLT standard studio for nights around and over NYE this coming year - another couple that supposedly need to be saved from walkers. And I booked right at 8am at 11 months. I needed a second room at both locations and because the standards were gone booked lakeview and boardwalk view. Oh well. I would not have expected under any booking system to get 2 rooms in those categories. I do know a way I could have though.

I think that all the walking talk drives anxiety and more walking when it isn't necessary. I've gotten all my waitlists I've set up at 11 months for these rooms that walkers are apparently "stealing" from all other owners.

 

[ParkHoppers]

Do you realize the tizzy is mostly about 5 rooms? Out of a possible 4887 DVC rooms at WDW? A tenth of a percent of WDW rooms. 5 of the 10 that DVC was required to take as part of converting Jambo? 5 rooms that per the POS in my hand might be competed over by 27,923 AKV members? 5 rooms that DVC certainly wouldn't have made concierge except they were on the floor with the lounge and really no good way to restrict them? And if a few of the almost 28,000 AKV members can't book one of those 5 rooms there are still other rooms for them to book?

It's a flexible points system with no reservation guaranteed for anytime you want it. IF that causes such an issue for any one owner there are other ways to book Concierge rooms at WDW.

BLT std studio early Dec has gone from some to none at 11 months in about the last 3 years. Other std during F&W have also gotten worst. With things like walking the internet will amplify its use. Soon not only will more and more resorts be involved but more times of year. I have seen this happen in other aspects of life. It will get worse and possibly to the point people need to walk months out to get their room. It is not sustainable IMO. Thinking otherwise is just wishful thinking for those who currently benefit. Walking use is on the way up. What is going to make it slow or stop?

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

BLT std studio early Dec has gone from some to none at 11 months in about the last 3 years. Other std during F&W have also gotten worst. With things like walking the internet will amplify its use. Soon not only will more and more resorts be involved but more times of year. I have seen this happen in other aspects of life. It will get worse and possibly to the point people need to walk months out to get their room. It is not sustainable IMO. Thinking otherwise is just wishful thinking for those who currently benefit. Walking use is on the way up. What is going to make it slow or stop?

Except BLT standard rooms have been almost impossible for early December since it opened. I know - I tried for a standard 2BR that first year and was shut out on it but there were other rooms. No complaints even then as I knew what I was buying with no guarantees. We suffered with our Theme park view. Early December has been difficult for a long, long time for many rooms. That is nothing new since "walking". It's a supply and demand thing.

I do agree that as people get shut out of rooms they will start booking earlier whereas they used to wait longer. So rooms will be booked up earlier than they used to be. Again, IMO it's not due to walking.

 

[ParkHoppers]

Except BLT standard rooms have been almost impossible for early December since it opened. I know - I tried for a standard 2BR that first year and was shut out on it but there were other rooms. No complaints even then as I knew what I was buying with no guarantees. We suffered with our Theme park view. Early December has been difficult for a long, long time for many rooms. That is nothing new since "walking". It's a supply and demand thing.

I do agree that as people get shut out of rooms they will start booking earlier whereas they used to wait longer. So rooms will be booked up earlier than they used to be. Again, IMO it's not due to walking.

I own at BLT and was getting std studios 3-5 years ago at 11 month window first two weeks in December. I have bought more points and am now a 1 bedroom person but still look at all availability. There has been a change that I have personally noticed.

 

[Madame]

Maybe the fall point chart should be raised to ease demand

 

[cruisin5]

What's in it for DVC to stop walking? Nothing that I can see, the rooms get booked sooner or later.

 

[cruisin5]

Maybe the fall point chart should be raised to ease demand

Perfect solution. Problem solved.

 

[gillep]

Maybe the fall point chart should be raised to ease demand

Even though it would negatively impact me, I would have no issue with DVC doing this.

 

[ParkHoppers]

Maybe the fall point chart should be raised to ease demand

I would agree with that because the data supports it. Of course then demand just shifts elsewhere and walking begins at those times. School vacation weeks, holidays you name it. Once enough people are walking more and more people will call MS to complain about not getting there room at 11 months. The MS calls saved by being able to change reservations online will be replaced with angry 11 month booking calls. When that amount of calls reach critical mass DVC will probably do something about walking.