DVC Technology and The Dining Plan

[TammyAlphabet]

I may be skeptical by nature, but, I am not sure that I believe the official line that MS is giving on the Dining plan. They claim that their "system" will not allow them to configure the dining plan and they are working to fix it. Sounds plausible yet fishy. The dining plan is profitable to disney because the participants pay rack rates for their rooms. Does anyone else think there is more to the problem than "technical difficulties"?

 

[rchristiansen]

Oh Completely! If they were able to link up an UPH in the past to our room resservation, then how come a dining plan with a MYW package can not be linked up?

 

[DebbieB]

I am suspicious too. They used to be able to do the "food and fun" plan, what's the difference system wise? "Food and Fun" was a limited value, you paid something like $50 and got $55 in food credits plus some recreation. With the dining plan, you could get far more than $35 per day worth out of it but there's a rack rate room to make up for it. Without the rack room in the equation, my bet is they would have to charge more than $35 per adult per day to make it profitable and DVC would have a hard time selling that to members, who would be outraged that they are being charged more.

 

[Anewman]

... Without the rack room in the equation, my bet is they would have to charge more than $35 per adult per day to make it profitable...

Rack rate is only a requirement with the "FREE" dining offer that is going on now. But some of us Paid those $35 per person/day and did get a room discount.

 

[Chuck S]

Rack rate is only a requirement with the "FREE" dining offer that is going on now. But some of us Paid those $35 per person/day and did get a room discount.

Yes, but not with a "ROOM ONLY" reservation. DVC, AP and FL Resident rates are considered "ROOM ONLY" and can not be applied to packages. The OP is correct, basically all that wpuld need to be done is to encode the dining plan onto our room keys. The computer systems are already capable of this at the resorts. It should be a simple fix to make a manual over-ride option to add that encoding to DVC keys. The price could be paid directly to WDW Travel or whatever division handles the dining plan. My guess is that the cost of the plan would be prohibitive unless it is offset by the cost of the room.

 

[bicker]

I wouldn't be skeptical about something, without being in a position to know otherwise. Just because DVC was able to sell a different program a few years ago doesn't mean that they can flip a switch and suddenly be able to sell a new program now. I would sure love for them to offer us a meal plan, but I respect the folks at DVC enough not to distrust them without good cause. Also, keep in mind that not all "technical difficulties" have to do with software and networking. There may be significant technical hurdles involved in offering a meal program to DVC members so that such offering adequately satisifies the requirements of all three parties (remember DVC is NOT Disney, so there are three parties involved: Disney, DVC and us). In essence, and because of this three-party arrangement, I would become skeptical once Disney starts offering meal plans to off-site guests and won't offer them to us.

 

[DebbieB]

Rack rate is only a requirement with the "FREE" dining offer that is going on now. But some of us Paid those $35 per person/day and did get a room discount.

How much of a discount did you get?

 

[rchristiansen]

I wouldn't be skeptical about something, without being in a position to know otherwise. Just because DVC was able to sell a different program a few years ago doesn't mean that they can flip a switch and suddenly be able to sell a new program now. I would sure love for them to offer us a meal plan, but I respect the folks at DVC enough not to distrust them without good cause. Also, keep in mind that not all "technical difficulties" have to do with software and networking. There may be significant technical hurdles involved in offering a meal program to DVC members so that such offering adequately satisifies the requirements of all three parties (remember DVC is NOT Disney, so there are three parties involved: Disney, DVC and us). In essence, and because of this three-party arrangement, I would become skeptical once Disney starts offering meal plans to off-site guests and won't offer them to us.

I know enough about computers and databases to know that it's not THAT big of a hurdle to over come. It's not THAT hard to do.

 

[Horace Horsecollar]

There may be significant technical hurdles involved in offering a meal program to DVC members so that such offering adequately satisifies the requirements of all three parties (remember DVC is NOT Disney, so there are three parties involved: Disney, DVC and us).

From an accounting ledger perspective, that's true.

The below-cost meal plans (whether free, $35, or something else) are subsidized by the resort lodging operations. Presumably, such dining plans generate higher occupancy and higher average rooms rates, which provide funding for the subsidy. Ideally, for Disney's stockholders, the meal plans even provide additional profits, not only through the higher yield on the rooms, but also through greater guest counts at WDW restaurants.

DVC is different. The operations budget is funded directly by annual dues. It's the duty of Disney Vacation Club Management Corp. to keep costs under control. The only ongoing profit for Disney shareholders is a management fee of about 2% of the operating budget (not to be confused with the administration component of the budget, which covers actual administration costs).

Saying "remember DVC is NOT Disney" may send the wrong message. It makes it seem that DVC is not owned by Disney. In reality, Disney Vacation Development, Inc. (the DVC resort development entity), and Disney Vacation Club Management Corp. (the DVC resort management entity) are both subsidiaries of The Walt Disney Company and are both affiliated with Walt Disney World Co. For legal and accounting reasons, some parts of The Walt Disney Company are separately incorporated, but that doesn't mean they are "not Disney."

Yes, any dining plan for DVC members must adequately satisfy the requirements of all the involved entities. Clearly, it's not reasonable to expect Disney Vacation Club Management Corp. to raise annual dues to subsidize those DVC members who want a dining plan. So, what's needed is an unsubsidized dining plan that's still attractive to DVC members -- one in which DVC members "win" by getting a discount (possibly in the form of a flat price per day), and in which WDW restaurants "win" by generating more volume through getting DVC members to eat more meals in full-service WDW restaurants and fewer meals in off-site restaurants or in their DVC resort condos.

 

[TammyAlphabet]

Horace's evaluation was good. I agree with everything that he said. However, if "DVC" offered the dining plan at a premium over what the MYW people were paying, the DVC members, or at least most of them, would be upset. They would be upset that they had to pay more, and, understandably so. So my guess is that these technical difficulties will persist until another plan, such as a "fun and food" plan like was offered in the past is created for DVC members. This plan would most likely be priced so that the subsidy disappears. As a matter of fact, I believe that some mention of such a plan was in the last member clubhouse. I deleted mine by accident so I don't have the wording, but sounded like something is coming.

 

[Anewman]

How much of a discount did you get?

I forgot exactly since we paid it in June, but it was around 200-300 off. Whatever AAA gives on a deluxe, Maybe 15%.

I Paid $980 for the dining plan, Family of 4 considered adults staying 7 nights. We would have saved around $700 if we had been able to go during this free dining period, by giving up room discount but deduct the price we paid for the plan.

 

[bicker]

There may be significant technical hurdles involved in offering a meal program to DVC members so that such offering adequately satisifies the requirements of all three parties.

I know enough about computers and databases to know that it's not THAT big of a hurdle to over come. It's not THAT hard to do.

You misread what I wrote.

 

[bicker]

Presumably, such dining plans generate higher occupancy and higher average rooms rates, which provide funding for the subsidy.

Indeed, so for such dining plans to be offered to DVC members or off-site folks, the condominium would have to provide similar subsidy (which I would heartily object to), or the plans simply wouldn't be attractive enough to warrant customer interest.

 

[tjkraz]

Horace's evaluation was good. I agree with everything that he said. However, if "DVC" offered the dining plan at a premium over what the MYW people were paying, the DVC members, or at least most of them, would be upset. They would be upset that they had to pay more, and, understandably so.

Why would it be so understandable for DVC members to be upset? We already save thousands on our accommodations over the years, have the best AP discount available, have our own discount golf program, get discounts on dining, recreation, tours, spa treatments, etc. Now we are entitled to the best dining plan available at the same price as those paying thousands extra for a room a theme park tickets?

I, too, agree with Horace's comments. The dining plan is a loss leader. It's designed to incentivize guests to buy their tickets from Disney and to stay on-site at room rates that are not as deeply discounted as they may otherwise be. Why should DVC members have any expectation of getting the same opportunity at the same price?

Personally, I suspect it's this (not so) technical hurdle that is truly causing the delay in offering a dining plan to DVC members.

 

[Horace Horsecollar]

Why would it be so understandable for DVC members to be upset?

I'm not sure that anyone is saying that DVC members should be upset -- just that they would be upset. Yes, I think a lot of DVC members would be upset if DVC members were offered a dining plan that similar to, but more expansive than, the paid dining plans that are offered to cash guests at WDW resorts.

I've read way too many posts on this board that "Disney should give us this" and "Disney should give us that" because "we're Disney's best customers." Imagine how such DVC member would react is we were offered a dining plan that seemingly penalizes DVC members.

Personally, I suspect it's this (not so) technical hurdle that is truly causing the delay in offering a dining plan to DVC members.

Yes. The OP, TammyAlphabet, pointed out that the official DVC MS line as to why we DVC members don't have access to the dining plan is "that their 'system' will not allow them to configure the dining plan and they are working to fix it." The OP questioned this official explanation.

If "system" refers to the computer system, then I agree that it is not credible to explain the lack of an equal dining plan as some sort of technical issue. (That doesn't mean that there couldn't be a legitimate technical reason for a delay in offering a different dining plan to DVC members.)

If "system" refers to the economic system under which Disney Vacation Club Management Corp. operates the DVC resorts, then there is, in fact, an incompatibility between a cost-based timeshare resort and a subsidized dining plan.

 

[kathleena]

I may be skeptical by nature, but, I am not sure that I believe the official line that MS is giving on the Dining plan. They claim that their "system" will not allow them to configure the dining plan and they are working to fix it. Sounds plausible yet fishy. The dining plan is profitable to disney because the participants pay rack rates for their rooms. Does anyone else think there is more to the problem than "technical difficulties"?

Ya, I have a problem with the line they are throwing around too.

The way I figure it - the meals are tied to your room and the MYW tickets. Well, even in a DVC room, you get room keys and MYW tickets that are tied together. All the MYW tickets and room keys work the same way in the turnstiles no matter what resort you stay at. So they are saying they can't work at the restaurants too? All they are doing is adding meal plan credits to those cards. So you can't add meal plan credits to DVC room cards?

Even if there is a technical issue, it can't possibly be that difficult to get the programming done. And why didn't they just include the DVC members as part of the MYW ticket/meal program anyway. Every project has stakeholders - you would think that DVC was a pretty big one.

And before anyone jumps on me and starts saying technical projects take time - I'm a project manager and I manage technical projects. I've seen far more complex projects implemented in much less time than it's taking them to do this and if they really, really wanted to offer this to us, they would have dropped the tinkering around with VMK or the DVC website and done it by now. (Oh, um, er, ah, maybe I shouldn't have started up on that!)


I think the "WDW and DVC are on different systems" excuse has run it's course and it's time for them to get a different tag line.

JMHO

 

[kathleena]

sorry - double post somehow!

 

[tjkraz]

I'm not sure that anyone is saying that DVC members should be upset -- just that they would be upset.

Sounds like Tammy thinks members should be upset:

"They would be upset that they had to pay more, and, understandably so."

I know, I know Horace. It's just that entitlement thing rearing it's ugly head again. I guess you're just a little bit more analytical about it than I am.

 

[kathleena]

Oh, and I will just say, my opinons have nothing to do with entitlement or being owed something - they are just in response to the OPs question about believing the DVC line about the technical issues.

I would just wish that when an important resort and ticket based program such as the meal plan is developed, that DVC would be more on the ball about how to offer a comparable plan to DVC members. Instead we get the same excuse they have used for years.

 

[bicker]

So they are saying they can't work at the restaurants too?

I think it is best not to put ascribe any meanings to what they've said other than that which they specifically intend. For example, this is a very narrow interpretation of a general statement. The general statement stands on its own, without clarification or specification, if for no other reason than because we really aren't entitled to any more information about internal operations than that which they're willing to provide us.

Every project has stakeholders - you would think that DVC was a pretty big one.

DVC members are a major source of revenue for Disney. That doesn't means that it is critically imperative to expeditiously resolve the technical hurldes to providing incentives for members to use their timeshare points that would be worthless if those members didn't use them.

And before anyone jumps on me and starts saying technical projects take time - I'm a project manager and I manage technical projects.

Me too. I've been involved in technical programs for over 20 years. In many case, technical hurdles take years to work out, especially when they include marketing considerations. However, it's really a red herring. It isn't up to us to decide how much information we're entitled to. We're offered products and services. We have ultimate veto power over each offering. We, as members and customers, already have so much of the control.