Disneyland ending AP program as we know it

[fla4fun]

Why do WDW and DLR differ so much when it comes to APs? I realize the size of the parks is a major reason, but why do so many less Florida locals get APs? Is it because the entire state of FL gets a discount for tickets? In CA only the people in So Cal get discounts, the rest of us are stuck paying full price or getting an AP and then needing to pay for transportation and lodging.

Well, I can say that in my friends and family circle, there just isn’t a lot of interest in the theme parks. Other than my sister and myself, I don’t personally know anyone with an AP to any of the big three (SW, US, WDW) and they don’t usually take advantage of the resident deals either. Unless you are a super fan of one of the parks, it’s off the radar in day to day life. It’s just a different demographic here. I think WDW would definitely lose out on hotel, food, and miscellaneous income if they got rid of APs where DL wouldn’t for the most part, due to so many APs living outside of Florida. I do think WDW took a look at the AP visitor levels when the parks reopened, as evidenced by their reluctance to sell new passes at the start and the encouragement to cancel and refund passes on a voluntary basis. But ultimately they haven’t found the pass holders as a group to be detrimental to the reopening process since they are starting to process renewals.

Another thing that factors in is the difference in incomes between LA and Orlando. Between all the low wage service jobs and the high unemployment, there aren’t a lot of locals who can afford to go to WDW right now. All the resident discounts in the world won’t help if the locals are struggling to pay the rent.

 

[mom2rtk]

Why do WDW and DLR differ so much when it comes to APs? I realize the size of the parks is a major reason, but why do so many less Florida locals get APs? Is it because the entire state of FL gets a discount for tickets? In CA only the people in So Cal get discounts, the rest of us are stuck paying full price or getting an AP and then needing to pay for transportation and lodging.

It's not the size of the parks. It's the size of the metropolitan areas they are located in. There's no comparison.

 

[fatmanatee]

I know a few people in LA/Anaheim who have had APs, would probably have it too if I lived there.

 

[ford91exploder]

Wrt to value of customers.

We are in the capital equipment business, but the most valuable customers are the ones who spend 10-50,000 per month without consuming a lot of sales time. Yes we get the 2-5 million dollar orders but they require lots of handholding and sales time.

The first class of customer sort of like the AP holder can be counted on in times good and bad But nobody is getting a fat bonus check for those orders but they do keep the doors open and the lights on and the sales quotas filled.

The second class of customers periodically makes a huge order and then disappears for 2-3 years. It's great for a huge bonus check but you can't count on that kind of business to keep the lights on.

Disney now only wants the customers who are good for a fat bonus check.

Rumors have it that for years Disney wants their AP program to vanish and only sell 1 day tickets and packages.

I suspect they will not like the results of their wishes.

 

[NoTime42]

When I went to Disneyland 6 years ago, I had the impression that Disneyland was a bigger part of the entire region’s identity than what I see at WDW.
As an example, saw a lot of guests with a personal style that would suggest they would be too cool for corporate Disney, but they are rocking their Disneyland backpack (as if there was less of the “my teens have outgrown Disney”)

 

[Mit88]

When I went to Disneyland 6 years ago, I had the impression that Disneyland was a bigger part of the entire region’s identity than what I see at WDW.
As an example, saw a lot of guests with a personal style that would suggest they would be too cool for corporate Disney, but they are rocking their Disneyland backpack (as if there was less of the “my teens have outgrown Disney”)

i think that really ended about a decade ago where Disney became cool for all ages again. I don’t think that was just a DL thing. Like comic books and nerd culture. When I was in high school you had to “hide” your love for comics and Disney or you’d be picked on. Now it’s the opposite

 

[ford91exploder]

How are Disney repeat customers not considered a good thing? The only reason the prices for APs doesn’t get discussed often is because they’ve been a steal ever since their existence. Disney has done ALOT to appease APs for many many years and anyone that doesn’t see that is just another “Karen” that expects more than they deserve. $600 a year for a WDW AP. Are you kidding me? People are paying 1/3 of that for Netflix. Just because Disney doesn’t welcome APs and regulars into their parks by bowing down and kissing their shoes doesn’t mean they don’t care

‘WallSt Disney’s most cherished metric is PRGS and AP holders and DVC members dilute that metric because they dont buy the 50 dollar T shirt that WalMart will be selling at 6.99 in two months or the cheap crap that has a 10000% profit margin (plushies im looking at you).

As such they are considered ‘bad business’ Of course their money is welcome when they buy that 40,000 DVC contract, Or renew that platinum pass. Just dont use the product that you bought Disney needs the space for the one and dones.

 

[MickeyWaffles]

‘WallSt Disney’s most cherished metric is PRGS and AP holders and DVC members dilute that metric because they dont buy the 50 dollar T shirt that WalMart will be selling at 6.99 in two months or the cheap crap that has a 10000% profit margin (plushies im looking at you).

As such they are considered ‘bad business’ Of course their money is welcome when they buy that 40,000 DVC contract, Or renew that platinum pass. Just dont use the product that you bought Disney needs the space for the one and dones.

Can you elaborate on why you don’t think DVC has a high PRGS? I ask because we are DVC and spend quite a bit on apparel, plushes, souvenirs, artwork, etc. per trip. I don’t think DVC members who travel for a vacation and local APs really have comparable in-park spending habits.

We usually have 10-12 of us in a grand villa so our villa’s guest spend is pretty darned high And I don’t think we are alone in that as DVC members. I think we splurge on things more than we would if we were paying rack rates for deluxe resorts.

 

[ford91exploder]

Can you elaborate on why you don’t think DVC has a high PRGS? I ask because we are DVC and spend quite a bit on apparel, plushes, souvenirs, artwork, etc. per trip. I don’t think DVC members who travel for a vacation and local APs really have comparable in-park spending habits.

We usually have 10-12 of us in a grand villa so our villa’s guest spend is pretty darned high And I don’t think we are alone in that as DVC members. I think we splurge on things more than we would if we were paying rack rates for deluxe resorts.

that was our pattern of staying at WDW when I was DVC as well. But while you are there during marathon weekend paying 4,000-6,000 in points equivalent. The rack rate of that room is 18,000 or so per night. Who do you think Disney wants in the room you or the ‘one and done’ customer with a 6 figure bill at the end of the day.

We dumped our DVC in 2018 after we had done a DVC reservation for a GV on marathon weekend. Arrive go to check in and are told you dont have a reservation you cancelled. Of course i had the printed paperwork oh we can’t accommodate your party ‘have a magical day’. No we did not cancel our reservation.

Fortunately being Marriott Platnum I was were able to score a GV at Marriott Grande Vista for 2,500 bucks and some outrageous number of points and so saved the trip but spent nearly three grand i had not expected to

I’ll never find out the truth but my guess is they had some VIP who waved a huge stack of cash and needed a room, and being nothing and nobody our reservation got zapped because that sale would give a huge boost to PRGS.

Any questions i asked ‘ yup we see your reservation But its cancelled but no one could tell us by who or when or why. At that point when room reservations are no longer reservations but an auction Just decided did not wanna play the game any longer

 

[wdwoutsider]

100% they will end APs in Florida too. It's only a matter of when.

The current board only cares about short term gains and numbers to impress wall street for their stock options. They do not care at all about the long term health of the company or pissing off fans. Very short term thinking, and a total shake down.

 

[skeeter31]

100% they will end APs in Florida too. It's only a matter of when.

The current board only cares about short term gains and numbers to impress wall street for their stock options. They do not care at all about the long term health of the company or pissing off fans. Very short term thinking, and a total shake down.

No, they won’t end APs in WDW, just like they’re not ending APs in DL. They’re re-evaluating the procedure in California due to severe capacity restrictions that will be in place there.

 

[Katiebird]

It's not the size of the parks. It's the size of the metropolitan areas they are located in. There's no comparison.

This, exactly. There are 20-some million people that live within a 1-2 hour drive from DLR. That’s almost the population of all of Florida within day trip distance.

 

[Badlands2020]

Disney is testing the waters with California. Its more important that gets switched first. They will definitely change Florida if this is successful, just not immediately. Watch in 2022 a Florida similar announcement comes thru, they might do it a little different but its coming. Some fans are clearly in denial, we can all see this is coming to Florida also down the road. Gonna be rough on the all of the disney vloggers when they do away with Florida

 

[Jimmy Mouse]

I feel even worse for VGC DVC owners. Not only are they dealing with a significantly worse point backlog than we are, they also bought in expecting to be able to get APs and are now faced with a ticket purchase for every visit.

I'm hearing lots of hesitations about buying into DVC at this point, but imagine how much more stark that decision point is for VGC right now.

I know most abbreviations but not this one. What is VGC? TIA.

 

[skeeter31]

I know most abbreviations but not this one. What is VGC? TIA.

Villas at Grand California

 

[Jimmy Mouse]

Villas at Grand California

 

[TheMaxRebo]

100% they will end APs in Florida too. It's only a matter of when.

The current board only cares about short term gains and numbers to impress wall street for their stock options. They do not care at all about the long term health of the company or pissing off fans. Very short term thinking, and a total shake down.

Disney is testing the waters with California. Its more important that gets switched first. They will definitely change Florida if this is successful, just not immediately. Watch in 2022 a Florida similar announcement comes thru, they might do it a little different but its coming. Some fans are clearly in denial, we can all see this is coming to Florida also down the road. Gonna be rough on the all of the disney vloggers when they do away with Florida

So do you think there will never ever be anything like an annual pass going forward?

I think they will change significantly and get. More expensive but there will still be something like an annual pass/passport/membership/etc

 

[YesterDark]

I'd love for a customizable pass system come to WDW. My family of 5 would be way too expensive to get an annual pass for everyone. However I would love to buy a pass that gets me discounts on food and a limited reservation count per year and have it be somewhat affordable.

It would incentivize me to do a big trip in a year and smaller trips throughout the year. I can see the big trip being onsite and the smaller ones off site to save on cost.

Also packages/discounts allowing me to get into holiday and after hour parties. I'm not buying after hour parties now because I'm not spending $500+ for my family to get in for a day. But I'll pay $500 for my family if I can get in to a few of them throughout the year.

I'm about to make a spreadsheet of my own of what I'd like to see in a WDW pass system for someone who would be willing to spend on something, but not buy an AP.

 

[Eric Smith]

So do you think there will never ever be anything like an annual pass going forward?

I think they will change significantly and get. More expensive but there will still be something like an annual pass/passport/membership/etc

There will be annual passes going forward. I could see them maybe changing to month by month, but I don't think that's likely. It's better for Disney to lock you in to a year than to allow you to start and cancel as you see fit.

Disneyland's situation is very different from WDW's. Disneyland had too many passholders to be able to accommodate them with the reduced capacity whenever the parks reopen. They probably also wanted to change the program for a while where they could both cut down on the number of AP holders in the parks and charge more for APs. Coronavirus gives them an ability to make that change. They'll still want to keep APs or something like APs around since Disneyland is a locals park.

 

[ford91exploder]

Disney is testing the waters with California. Its more important that gets switched first. They will definitely change Florida if this is successful, just not immediately. Watch in 2022 a Florida similar announcement comes thru, they might do it a little different but its coming. Some fans are clearly in denial, we can all see this is coming to Florida also down the road. Gonna be rough on the all of the disney vloggers when they do away with Florida

People think that Disney cares for them as much as we care for Disney, Up to the Eisner days that was true and the companies policies and philosophies reflected that.



Whatever Disney does it will be customer unfriendly, I know a fair number of people in the LA area and nearly ALL of them have AP's to Disney and USH or Knotts. DL is where you go after work to hang out for a couple of hours and have a meal with friends.

I expect something on the order of paying a grand will give you the 'opportunity' to buy a limited number of discounted one day tickets at $49.95+Tax per month.

Whereupon Disney executives will discover that 'Brand Loyalty' is pretty thin as DL people sign up in droves for USH and Knotts AP's mainly out of spite because DL is very much a 'Local' park and the sense of betrayal to the loyal fans who stuck with DL through thick and thin will be EPIC as will the fan blowback.

Disney's current managers think in terms of 'Branding' where in reality Disney parks from opening day have always been about the EXPERIENCE of visiting a Disney park and checking out from reality for a while, and in DL's case reliving favorite childhood and teen years memories from when the kids got their first Disneyland AP.

There was a very good reason Walt wanted his managers wandering the parks it was so they never forgot that Disney was selling an EXPERIENCE not a BRAND. Ironically if Disney had more competent leadership they would understand that Millenials are about EXPERIENCES not things so a golden opportunity to sell top quality experiences is being wasted.. This is why I say Disney is stooping for pennies while dollars fly over their heads.