Disney Skyliner (Gondola Transportation System) Read Post 1 Now Open!

[umichigan10]

I’m not a gondola technician but I don’t see how this would make any difference. It seems similar to saying the paint job will make them hotter.

Yeah and it’s all solar resistant glass of whatever the technical term is to limit the sunlight that gets in.

 

[umichigan10]

Here’s a hypothetical that I hadn’t even thought of that may have been mentioned before: I wonder if these will need fo shutdown for the new nighttime show at Epcot? Or I’d theyre far enough away to not be an issue. (Speaking of the Epcot line specifically, I’m sure the others will be a nonissue)

 

[DanBoris]

The wrap is cute, but it will make it hotter.

It won't be blocking vents but will also block some of the sun, so it should actually make it cooler. Definitly won't make it hotter.

 

[OSUZorba]

I’m not a gondola technician but I don’t see how this would make any difference. It seems similar to saying the paint job will make them hotter.

Dark paint would make them hotter too. White would've been the best color from a heat perspective.

But the highly reflective film on the windows reflects solar heat away from the car. The dark wrap will instead absorb the heat, making the cabins hotter. You can test this you yourself, go outside in the sun in black clothes, then go outside in white clothes, the black will be hotter.

FYI, I have a master's degree in heat transfer and my thesis was specifically about heat transfer through windows.

 

[hertamaniac]

Yes, someone who has experience with aerial gondolas said it most likely was not an actual "test", but just putting weight on the cable to aid in the cable stringing.

Could be as the video appears to show a worker reaching down from the tower to where the cable would feed.

 

[OSUZorba]

It won't be blocking vents but will also block some of the sun, so it should actually make it cooler. Definitly won't make it hotter.

See above, the unwrapped windows have highly reflective film on them that will be able to reflect the vast majority of the solar heat. While blocking/shading is still more effective than clear glass, it is much less effective than reflecting the heat away.

Makes me wonder if the fancy wrap is just for show and the real ones will be more similar to the concept art.

 

[Sweettears]

Dark paint would make them hotter too. White would've been the best color from a heat perspective.

But the highly reflective film on the windows reflects solar heat away from the car. The dark wrap will instead absorb the heat, making the cabins hotter. You can test this you yourself, go outside in the sun in black clothes, then go outside in white clothes, the black will be hotter.

FYI, I have a master's degree in heat transfer and my thesis was specifically about heat transfer through windows.

Whatever. I don’t think we are discussing windows. It’s like saying a black car is hotter than a white car (excluding any discussion on the interior)

 

[OSUZorba]

Whatever. I don’t think we are discussing windows. It’s like saying a black car is hotter than a white car (excluding any discussion on the interior)

What do you think I was talking about then? I was specifically talking about the solar heat gain through the windows. Having a fully colored wrap on the window as opposed to highly reflective film will increase the solar heat gain through the window and result in a hotter gondola. This is not an opinion or a guess it is a fact.

This image explains it. The more radiation (heat) reflected the less that can enter the interior or be absorbed by the glass. Shading (what these wraps will do) absorbs the heat, that heat is then transferred to the surroundings, both the inside and outside of the cabin. So any solar heat reflected is completely gone, any solar heat absorbed will roughly half be rejected to the inside of the cabin and half to the outside and will make the glass hotter. Any solar heat (infra-red and visible light) allowed all the way through would obviously be completely inside the cabin.

source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_gain

You also have the issue of comfort, the more heat absorbed by the window, the hotter it will be (feel a single pane window in the summer and see how much hotter it is than the air around it). The hotter the window, the hotter everyone in the cabin will feel, even if the ventilation keeps the cabin air temperature the same. This is how heat lamps work, they don't actually increase the air temperature in the area that much, but they radiate heat to whatever is under them (just like the sun to the earth). Sitting next to a hot window vs a cool window can make a massive difference in comfort (or to be more specific the wet bulb globe temperature). Again, this isn't an opinion or a guess, this is a fact.

This is besides the point, but all other things being equal, a black car is hotter than white car.

 

[DanBoris]

See above, the unwrapped windows have highly reflective film on them that will be able to reflect the vast majority of the solar heat. While blocking/shading is still more effective than clear glass, it is much less effective than reflecting the heat away.

Makes me wonder if the fancy wrap is just for show and the real ones will be more similar to the concept art.

The wrapped windows probably have the same reflective coating on them as the unwrapped ones.

 

[OSUZorba]

The wrapped windows probably have the same reflective coating on them as the unwrapped ones.

They probably will, but it doesn't matter. The wrap is what is visible to the sun. Go outside with a mirror, see it reflecting the light. Now put it under your jacket, does it reflect the sun any more?

 

[joelkfla]

They probably will, but it doesn't matter. The wrap is what is visible to the sun. Go outside with a mirror, see it reflecting the light. Now put it under your jacket, does it reflect the sun any more?

Why can't the wraps be of a reflective material?

 

[DanBoris]

They probably will, but it doesn't matter. The wrap is what is visible to the sun. Go outside with a mirror, see it reflecting the light. Now put it under your jacket, does it reflect the sun any more?

My jacket is opaque, the wraps are not, a lot of light will get through and be reflected by the reflective material on the glass.

 

[KYMickey]

The wrap is cute, but it will make it hotter.

It will actually make them cooler because it will filter the sunshine entering the cabins. I didn't get to see it in person but I'm guessing it's like the wrap they put on buses etc., still see thru it but it filters a good mount of the sunshine.

 

[OSUZorba]

Why can't the wraps be of a reflective material?

You can add chemicals/coatings that can reflect IR light while being invisible to the human eye. This is done a lot with roofing materials and window tint. I assume they can do the same with vinyl wraps. But you can't reflect visible light with a colored wrap. This is because if you see the color green, that means the wrap has absorbed all colors of light, except for green, it has reflected the green wavelengths of light. Since black is no color, that means a true black absorbs all visible light, while white contains all colors, a true white reflects all visible colors. The nice thing about the reflective coatings on the windows, though, is they would reflect all IR, visible, and UV wavelengths.

Solar energy hitting the surface is split about 49% IR, 43% Visible Light, and 8% UV.

So back to my original point, it will cause more heat to be absorbed by the windows rather than reflected, which will affect the temperature of the cabin. I don't feel like doing the analysis on this to determine how much, but it could be done fairly easily.

My jacket is opaque, the wraps are not, a lot of light will get through and be reflected by the reflective material on the glass.

The bus wraps are probably about 60% solid, so only 40% would be reflected by the coating (couldn't quickly find specs, so this is an estimate). It is hard to tell in the pictures, but it looks like a solid wrap in the pictures. If it did have the holes in it, it might look really weird with a reflective coating under it, like it has light shining through it (it might also be fine, IDK, but bus windows aren't reflective). This might be why they went with a full wrap instead of the ones shown in the concept art. The small ones on a highly reflective surface probably would've looked weird in the stations and hard to look at in the sun. If the are using bus window wrap, they may not have the reflective coating under and just a tint, we'll see.

But I'm sorry I brought it up, if anyone cares about discussing heat transfer further feel free to PM me.

 

[Jimmy Mouse]

I know a little about heat and glass. I own an automotive stereo / tint shop and have been applying window film for over 30 years. My best film is a nano-ceramic film. The standard 35% VLT film rejects 99% UV, 63% IR and 51% total energy. If the vehicle is in direct sunlight, the film works as designed. If any vinyl wrap is put over the window (yes I install wraps as well) then the film does not work. The vinyl surface gets hot, the glass gets hot and the heat is radiated to the car interior. So yes, if they completely cover the glass areas with vinyl then the glass will get hot which will heat up the inside of the gondola.

 

[TG_WDW]

As long as the buses, monorails, boats, ferry's are available, my butt is staying the heck off of these horrendous, terrifying, hot boxes of torture.

 

[patticakeNJ]

We’ll be staying at CBR in July. We were thinking of doing the bon voyage breakfast on our resort day. If, while walking or taking the boat from HS to boardwalk, I see the Skyliner running empty, I’ll be giving it very resentful looks.

No fun being in the construction zone when on vacation!

 

[scrappinginontario]

I appreciate that Disney offers such a variety of transportation modes to its guests so that each person can choose what they are most comfortable with!!

While the gondolas will be a mode some will not choose to use, I’m excited for this new transportation option to DHS and Epcot from Pop (our resort of choice) and the whole new perspective it will offer!

 

[Farro]

Well if nothing else came of this thread, I can definitely thank @OSUZorba. I'm going to discuss heat transfer on Thanksgiving and I will finally be the expert on something in my family.

 

[hertamaniac]

I wonder if it's possible that their will be designed airflow over the windows/wraps to mitigate the potential of heat build up? I'm not talking about winglets or spoilers, but from the interior of the cabins to the outside. It makes me think if the glass/plastic is IG and has two panes (with or without low-e coatings), but uses airflow channeled between the panes. Actually, that is probably too costly and wouldn't have a big effect.