Disgruntled members: What are the DVC-specific issues?

[nlenguyen]

I don't find this to be true. Yes, the older strategy often left resorts with nearly identical numbers of Studio and One Bedroom villas. 34% of the rooms at Saratoga Springs are studios, and it has the same percentage of 1B villas. Bay Lake Tower is 31% Studio and 31% 1B.

However, here are the studio percents at the 4 newest resorts:

Polynesian: 95%, 0% 1B
Copper Creek: 36% Studio, 25% 1B
Riviera: 42% Studio, 36% 1B
Grand Floridian: 71% Studio, 13% 1B

Over the past decade, DVC has added 897 Studios to the program (including the VGF expansion) vs 280 One Bedroom villas.

I do think that moving to more studios is great for some families, but the idea of a "timeshare" is using the room year-after-year. I would think that having a kitchen/washer/dryer is important if staying for about a week each year.

As the price of food is getting higher, I think that my family will want to eat more in room which means we need a kitchen or get microwavable foods. Sure there will be some times that we will eat in the parks, but with a studio that is going to have to be all three meals most days.

Studios are just more appealing because they cost less points per night

 

[DduzDis]

Reallocation of points, now the times we go costs more points.

This and the 50% borrowing rule absolutely affect how we are able to travel. We bought points such that we could use the current and borrow the next year at one resort (BLT) and then swap to the next year to BWV using the same method with those points. We did buy more than needed at the time knowing the points could increase a bit (about 10% more than we needed at the time). Now, we can barely make it when we normally travel in a BLT 1br LV villa at our spring break without the borrowing rule in place. The increase in that room due to the season reallocation + the borrowing restriction has caused us to change our travel. OP -- keep this in mind as you research.

 

[CarolMN]

Unrelated to the current topic, but it'd be interesting to look into the standard for truth in advertising regarding Riviera. The definition of a Vacation Club for the Florida Law is that members have access to reservation component of the club. A standalone resort with an exchange option (RCI, II or other) is not a Vacation Club. But Riviera is just like that: a standalone resort and direct buyers have access to an exchange company. It is not part of a Vacation Club since resale members cannot access the reservation component of the club, hence, advertising it under the "Disney Vacation Club" flag is misleading. They could rename the program "Disney Magical Vacation" or whatever, but they shouldn't use "Vacation Club".

Interesting....it is an aspect of the law I have not really studied....so I can't comment, yet! I have the entire statute document so I am going to have to read up on that!!!

ETA: Is this in the FL statue of 721 for timeshare? Or under one of the other ones that governs condos like 718 or 719?

At a minimum, it makes me wonder how DVC can legally charge Riviera resale members (via annual dues) for access to something to which they do not have access (the BVTC, which allows Members to use points to reserve other resorts).

 

[Sandisw]

At a minimum, it makes me wonder how DVC can legally charge Riviera resale members (via annual dues) for access to something to which they do not have access (the BVTC, which allows Members to use points to reserve other resorts).

Good point. I need to check my annual dues to see if there is a difference.

ETA. No difference..probably something that needs an email.

 

[suebeelin]

I'm looking to purchase DVC after researching for a few years.

Unfortunately, it seems I'm jumping in at a historically low point in terms of member experience. There are daily posts from members selling or cautioning that they wouldn't buy now.

I'm trying to distinguish current DVC-specific issues from more general issues. I'm empathetic to the latter (e.g., prices, Genie+, etc) but am considering them separately.

Here are the pain points I've gathered:

1. 50% borrowing restriction.
2. Low availability
3. Technical issues with the member website

What else am I missing? What would you distinguish as disturbing, long-term trends as opposed to (hopefully) ephemeral COVID aftershock? The items above seem like they could classify as the latter which gives me a little hope in keeping my dream alive.

I’m just annoyed the ticket prices keep going up up up. And no more AP’s…

At least I locked in my hotel prices. I’m being told BWV and BLT studios are going for $650/night now direct from Disney. Ouch.

 

[CaliAdventurer]

We were alllll in on DVC. Purchased 1540 points that we are always borrowed on and rented another 500 or so per year. But this month we bought a vacation home no where near Disney, in large part because Im whopping mad about VGF 2.0 being added into VGF 1.0. Went to book within 11 most for February at VGF and the 2 beds are gone many days. I can easily book VGC (telling) if I wanted but ended up booking Aulani. Having had my membership at VGF for years, this feels due to the new members booking VGF 1.0 and Im sure some Covid points but I did not sign up to wake up at 5am 11mos to the day to book a vacation. Previously, not booking studios, the owners window has been fairly reasonable to book.

I have other issues with Disney rn that aren't DVC coloring my sentiment to be sure (genie plus adding an additional $300 per day when we go to DLR, the price hikes, the reduced offerings, service and portions, the tepid response to dont say gay when they employ 80k in Florida and many LGBTQ+ and allies really gets my goat along with painting over the Mickey rainbow hands mural in DS and on and on). That said, Im going to give FAR less to Disney next year (too late for this year) and only take 2 trips instead of 7+. Once my points have regenerated, I'll reevaluate. I realize that things go in phase as Disney Parks has done before and I hope will do again. I'll either rent the VGF & VGC points or sell them. (watch there be a recession haha) Aulani, is amazing and we will continue to use.

All in all, I have LOVED DVC. I was obsessed until this year. Almost added BWV but now I dont even look. Watch out other owners, VGF 2.0 worked for them, they will do it again, consequences be damned.

 

[DonMacGregor]

I didn't realize I would step into some weird long-standing argument on the boards and get blasted when only trying to share my personal experiences and interpretations. I guess I have a new learning.

A lesson well-learned.

 

[john7994]

A lesson well-learned.

View attachment 663662

A lesson re-learned

 

[DonMacGregor]

Went to book within 11 most for February at VGF and the 2 beds are gone many days. I can easily book VGC (telling) if I wanted but ended up booking Aulani. Having had my membership at VGF for years, this feels due to the new members booking VGF 1.0 and Im sure some Covid points but I did not sign up to wake up at 5am 11mos to the day to book a vacation. Previously, not booking studios, the owners window has been fairly reasonable to book.

I had suggested a couple of months back that this might happen and was practically laughed off the boards.

 

[Sandisw]

I had suggested a couple of months back that this might happen and was practically laughed off the boards.

You did and it will be interesting to see how it all pans out!

 

[RoseGold]

2BR VGF is wide open for all of February. So yea, seems like that isn’t an issue.

The lockoffs aren’t, but the only studios bookable online right now are in the lockoffs. So if IT ever adds the resort studios, (I know big assumption), there will be even more available, because some people will book resort studios.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

I have been a member since 2006…. Own at SSR, BLT, RR….
I can honestly say, that every time I go lately, if feel less magical, and more like I drive. There is very little benefit left in being a DVC member beyond the room.

last year I spent 2000 dollars on park passes because i could not buy an annual pass for my son.

i spent 1000 dollars for water parks pass because i could not add one to my annual pass, or my sons….

so disney nickel and dimed me out of almost 1800 dollars…

the dinning plan…. not being able to buy one cost me an extra 40 percent…

I have no opinion on the magical express, because i just got a town car…. But it is gone too now…

yes, all of these are disney issues, but you would hope that Disney would care about the people that own 14 of their resorts.

Im hopeful the upper management will be replace pd soon, and disney will find the magic again.

 

[EM Lawrence]

Has anyone mentioned the toilet paper yet? Its really, really bad.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Not really a complaint but more of i want to understand….
I personally cringe in i get a 2 bedroom lock off. I want a straight two bedroom.

are people upset the lockoffs are not available?….

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Wait what?
the toilet paper….

 

[Breems]

Has anyone mentioned the toilet paper yet? Its really, really bad.

Now I'm reconsidering the whole thing.

I'll wait 8 hours to talk to Member Services on the phone, but I'll be darned if I'm going to be welcomed back from a long day at MK with 2-ply TP.

 

[EM Lawrence]

Now I'm reconsidering the whole thing.

I'll wait 8 hours to talk to Member Services on the phone, but I'll be darned if I'm going to be welcomed back from a long day at MK with 2-ply TP.

Two ply would be an upgrade. The public rest stops in Florida have better quality TP than DVC rooms. It's best to pack your own TP for your "Deluxe" DVC resort stay.

 

[tjkraz]

But this month we bought a vacation home no where near Disney, in large part because Im whopping mad about VGF 2.0 being added into VGF 1.0. Went to book within 11 most for February at VGF and the 2 beds are gone many days.

Every single night of February 2023 is still available in both Standard and Lake View Two Bedroom at VGF.

I had suggested a couple of months back that this might happen and was practically laughed off the boards.

I certainly wouldn't "laugh you off the boards" for suggesting VGF will become more competitive. But personally, I think periods of being completely unable to book 1BR and 2BR at 11 months will be few and far between. Demand for Studios is highest, so the expansion is filling that need. It's probably over-compensating a bit, but (IMO) not to the extent that owners will be forced to "walk" one or two bedroom reservations throughout the year.

The ability to book two connecting Resort Studios--which technically sleep up to 10 people--for less than the cost of a two bedroom is a nice bonus for people who won't use the kitchen.

Deluxe studios will definitely be more difficult to obtain.

 

[redboat45]

Not really a complaint but more of i want to understand….
I personally cringe in i get a 2 bedroom lock off. I want a straight two bedroom.

are people upset the lockoffs are not available?….

I'm with you. I'd much rather have a normal 2 bedroom!

 

[DonMacGregor]

The ability to book two connecting Resort Studios--which technically sleep up to 10 people--for less than the cost of a two bedroom is a nice bonus for people who won't use the kitchen.

There is certainly a huge demand for studios. However, the new Poly building suggests there’s still demand for larger Villas as well (albeit less than studios). It will be interesting to see how many people stay in one of those “resort” studios once, then decide having a 1 or 2bd for the added space is more appealing.

Obviously, your example is an extreme situation, but shoehorning 10 humans into 880 square feet sounds miserable and it’s 30% less space than a 2bd. Even if most of that extra space is kitchen, it’s still space.

I still have a feeling there are a ton of people who weren’t willing to pay $255 per point for a sold out VGF, but will do $200. They will be buying for the lower price and not because of the added studios, and will be using those new points for existing larger Villas. While I have no desire to own at VGF, I would fall squarely into that group of owners who’d likely never stay in a resort studio.

The question is how many existing “VGF1” owners will jump on the added resort studio availability and free up larger rooms for new owners and if it balances out. With the addition of maybe 10,000 new contracts it will be interesting to see.