Dis Unplugged 6/9/20 - A question about the black experience at Walt Disney World

[JacknSally]

Wow was this on point. I can't do the Splash Mountain/Princess and the Frog thread anymore. There's a lot of ugly, passive aggressive things coming out of there. I believe one term was "fringe lunatics" - alluding to those who wanted to see a change of the theme.

Thanks for the head's up. I wanted to read about the reaction but I don't have the energy nor the temperament at the moment to tackle that.

Yeah it wasn't even up 24 hrs before I couldn't stomach it anymore and haven't been back. Let them groan at one another. Most of them don't get it because they don't want to get it. Just resort to same tired phrases over & over.

It did eventually get locked, thank goodness, but it was pretty bad. @rteetz cleaned up the worst posts along the way, but it was really just a never-ending circle of willful ignorance, no matter how many well-meaning people tried to jump in to educate or to redirect the conversation.

 

[Queen2PrincessG]

Hello everyone,
I have submitted a request for the creation of a dedicated Official Forum D.O.C.'s ( Dis'ers Of Color & Allies)
I also created a Poll question there, hopefully if we get enough votes, Dis Board Admins will approve our request, please be sure to visit and cast your vote.

https://www.disboards.com/threads/petition-request-for-new-dedicated-forum-d-o-c-s.3806412/

THANK YOU! I've been begging for this.

 

[AKL Ranger]

There’s a lot of noise on social media about pulling down certain statues, burning certain flags, changing behaviours etc etc. I don’t wish to be controversial and certainly don’t wish to offend anyone. If I am ignorant please just tell me.

But in my humble opinion you can’t wipe out history. What you can do is learn from it and attempt to avoid mistakes made. It’s surely a case of education. However when I hear people want to desrecate statues of Cristopher Columbus, Sir Francis Drake, even Churchill I think come on, have perspective, this is counterproductive. With C19 we are entering a ‘new normal’. That does not include eradicating what has gone before. However we do have an opportunity to go forward in a better way.

So I hear calls for Splash Mountain to be renamed. Films like Gone With The Wind have been pulled. This is not the new Anno Domini. We do however have an opportunity to reflect and move forward. We need to learn from what was to strive and achieve what can be.

Hello all,
Time to put things in context, so I will share a bit of history and try to open some hearts and minds. The Disney film "Song of the South" was released in 1946, premiering in Atlanta, GA, the heart of the Dixie south. The racial stereotypes depicted n the film emboldened many White supremacists during the height of the Jim Crow Law era. The Jim Crow laws were enforced until 1965. In practice, Jim Crow laws mandated racial segregation in all public facilities in the states of the former Confederate States of America and in some others, beginning in the 1870s.
The song "Zippedy Doo Dah" sung by the character "Uncle Remus" is featured prominently in the Disney theme park attraction "Splash Mountain." Along with the slang jive speech patterns that mock slave and "post-emancipation 'Negroes'"
In the movie "Song of the South", the character "Uncle Remus" sings the fun, joyful tune "Zippedy Doo Dah", portraying a "Happy 'Plantation worker'. Call it what it is a Plantation slave/ emancipated slave who was unaware he was truly freed. The character Uncle Remus singing that song, maintaining that the black vernacular and other qualities are stereotypes. In addition, the plantation setting in the movie is portrayed as idyllic and glorified.

who say "modern-day African Americans should get over slavery, it ended with the Emancipation proclamation." (issued by United States President Abraham Lincoln on September 22, 1862)
No, slavery, in fact, did not end for many African and American slaves who did not receive the new until June 19, 1865.
Put this in context, imagine working at your place of employment, and not receiving a paycheck from Sept 22, 1862 - June 19, 1865.

Although Juneteenth generally celebrates the end of slavery in the United States, it was still legal and practiced in two Union border states (Delaware and Kentucky) until later that year when ratification of the Thirteenth Amendment to the Constitution abolished non-penal slavery nationwide in December 6, 1865.
The Thirteenth Amendment (Amendment XIII) to the United States Constitution abolished slavery and involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for a crime. In Congress, it was passed by the Senate on April 8, 1864, and by the House on January 31, 1865. The amendment was ratified by the required number of states on December 6, 1865.

What truly saddens me, is there are fellow Americans who choose to ignore the pain and spiritual emotional anguish of not only the abomination that was slavery but the years of Jim Crow-era laws. Jim Crow laws mandated racial segregation in all public facilities in the states of the former Confederate States of America and in some others, beginning in the 1870s and were enforced until 1965.

For many visitors to Disney theme parks who enjoy the attraction "Splash Moutain", thinking it is an innocent family-friendly flume ride with happy animal characters.

Want to know how bad this can sting for some African Americans who are descendants of slaves?
Imagine a thrilling flume ride attraction themed with Nazi and concentration camp imagery. Even non-Jewish people would be horrified, now see Splash mountain in a new light.
For the people who ask " Why did people wait so long to complain about Splash Moutain? Like many positive changes, it takes time, and even if we stumble we pick ourselves up and keep climbing.
Greenwood-Tulsa Oklahoma (1921), Selma, Alabama (1965)
March on Washington (1963) 1989 Tiananmen Square protests
(2020) Black Lives Matter Plaza Northwest, DC

 

[xjillianpaige]

I do have a question if anyone would like to answer. I am white and when I first went to WDW as an adult, I was taken aback at the whole bit on Jungle Cruise about the headhunters and the villagers who attack you. All I could think was "what if I was black and had my kids with me and these are the ONLY representations of people who look like us on a ride in all of Magic Kingdom?" It just didn't sit right with me. I was wondering if any of the black members of our DIS community had had a similar reaction, or had other thoughts on Jungle Cruise generally?

Obviously there has been lots of discussion about Song of the South and Splash Mountain which is a whole other thing but I haven't heard all that much about Jungle Cruise. I would appreciate hearing any insight anyone has to offer.

Hi! I'm white and I want to thank you for bringing up Jungle Cruise. This is my absolute favorite ride. I love a good pun. And I think that this ride has significant issues with BIPOC representation. In my opinion as a white person, this ride could use an update.

I would also be curious to hear what BIPOC Disney fans think about the Jungle Cruise since it does so often go unmentioned.

 

[AKL Ranger]

From an earlier comment about "Caucasian allies" remember that allies can be White, Hispanic/Latino, American Indian, Alaska Native, Asian, Native Hawaiian, Pacific Islander, or any other race/ethnicity.

Hi there @RapunzelIsMyHomeGirl ,
All of the Brown people (Hispanic/Latino, American Indian, Alaska Native, Asian, Native Hawaiian & Pacific Islander) have traditionally always considered of Black & Brown people.
Dating back to the time of European slavery and colonization, White Caucasians used the denigrating color labels; Yellow men for Asians, Redmen for Native/ First Nation People to further separate people. Remember, "Race" is a man-made construct.

The link below provides academic insight into this idea we call race.

The following video shows a social experiment to cure racism.

Wishing everyone peace, love & light.

 

[lovethesun12]

Hello all,
Time to put things in context, so I will share a bit of history and try to open some hearts and minds. The Disney film "Song of the South" was released in 1946, premiering in Atlanta, GA, the heart of the Dixie south. The racial stereotypes depicted n the film emboldened many White supremacists during the height of the Jim Crow Law era. The Jim Crow laws were enforced until 1965. In practice, Jim Crow laws mandated racial segregation in all public facilities in the states of the former Confederate States of America and in some others, beginning in the 1870s.
The song "Zippedy Doo Dah" sung by the character "Uncle Remus" is featured prominently in the Disney theme park attraction "Splash Mountain." Along with the slang jive speech patterns that mock slave and "post-emancipation 'Negroes'"
In the movie "Song of the South", the character "Uncle Remus" sings the fun, joyful tune "Zippedy Doo Dah", portraying a "Happy 'Plantation worker'. Call it what it is a Plantation slave/ emancipated slave who was unaware he was truly freed. The character Uncle Remus singing that song, maintaining that the black vernacular and other qualities are stereotypes. In addition, the plantation setting in the movie is portrayed as idyllic and glorified.

who say "modern-day African Americans should get over slavery, it ended with the Emancipation proclamation." (issued by United States President Abraham Lincoln on September 22, 1862)
No, slavery, in fact, did not end for many African and American slaves who did not receive the new until June 19, 1865.
Put this in context, imagine working at your place of employment, and not receiving a paycheck from Sept 22, 1862 - June 19, 1865.

Although Juneteenth generally celebrates the end of slavery in the United States, it was still legal and practiced in two Union border states (Delaware and Kentucky) until later that year when ratification of the Thirteenth Amendment to the Constitution abolished non-penal slavery nationwide in December 6, 1865.
The Thirteenth Amendment (Amendment XIII) to the United States Constitution abolished slavery and involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for a crime. In Congress, it was passed by the Senate on April 8, 1864, and by the House on January 31, 1865. The amendment was ratified by the required number of states on December 6, 1865.

What truly saddens me, is there are fellow Americans who choose to ignore the pain and spiritual emotional anguish of not only the abomination that was slavery but the years of Jim Crow-era laws. Jim Crow laws mandated racial segregation in all public facilities in the states of the former Confederate States of America and in some others, beginning in the 1870s and were enforced until 1965.

For many visitors to Disney theme parks who enjoy the attraction "Splash Moutain", thinking it is an innocent family-friendly flume ride with happy animal characters.

Want to know how bad this can sting for some African Americans who are descendants of slaves?
Imagine a thrilling flume ride attraction themed with Nazi and concentration camp imagery. Even non-Jewish people would be horrified, now see Splash mountain in a new light.
For the people who ask " Why did people wait so long to complain about Splash Moutain? Like many positive changes, it takes time, and even if we stumble we pick ourselves up and keep climbing.
Greenwood-Tulsa Oklahoma (1921), Selma, Alabama (1965)
March on Washington (1963) 1989 Tiananmen Square protests
(2020) Black Lives Matter Plaza Northwest, DC

Thank you for the detailed explanation.

I never really (and still don't) understand the argument "we can learn about history from a ride/syrup bottle/insert object".

History shows us the necessity of listening to (and believing) those oppressed, having empathy and making changes. Remember most changes in history could not be made peacefully because humans just couldn't listen to all sides of an issue. Genetically, we haven't changed much. We still have hormones that make us argue even when it doesn't matter.

If we still can't even listen enough to shrug off simple changes that do not affect daily life without weeks of arguing our own personal position, what did we really learn from history so far?

 

[AKL Ranger]

Thank you for the detailed explanation.

I never really (and still don't) understand the argument "we can learn about history from a ride/syrup bottle/insert object".

History shows us the necessity of listening to (and believing) those oppressed, having empathy and making changes. Remember most changes in history could not be made peacefully because humans just couldn't listen to all sides of an issue. Genetically, we haven't changed much. We still have hormones that make us argue even when it doesn't matter.

If we still can't even listen enough to shrug off simple changes that do not affect daily life without weeks of arguing our own personal position, what did we really learn from history so far?

Hello @lovethesun12 ,
I am glad you enjoyed reading my post. The day someone tells me they learned a history lesson from a talking bottle of pancake syrup it is time to get out of the kitchen, LOL

Please be sure to visit our new thread D.O.C.’s (DIS’ers Of Color and our allies.)
https://www.disboards.com/threads/d-o-c-s-disers-of-color-disney-fans-of-color.3806309/

Be sure to cast your vote for our Poll at the top of thread, if you would like to D.O.C.’s thread converted to a permanent Forum here on the Dis Boards.
I hope you will continue to visit this thread and post and share. The content will not also be so deep or thought provoking.
Sending you and your darling family social distance hugs


Peace, Love & Light.
Gilbert