Concerns about cruising at all until COVID19 vaccine exists

I think an antibody test, if it's widely done, will relieve a lot of people's stress. I know it sure would relieve mine. That said, it could backfire and people, feeling immune, will stop self-isolating when it's still unclear how long you are shedding the virus to others.
I think it would help get things moving again if we could get tests to show if we have the antibodies. I'm hoping at that point they would be able to know if you're still shedding the virus as well. I mean, if I actually had this back in December/January, I already spread this virus all over the place back then and I obviously wouldn't be contagious anymore! It would be nice to find out too if its possible to get the virus again if you've already had it or if you're immune.
 
My family has a cruise planned for December and will absolutely go unless it is cancelled. The chance of getting something will never be zero. I am not ready to quit living due to a small chance I might get a virus. If I should get it there is even less of a chance I will die from it. More likely to die in an airline crash. In any case there is a risk in everything you do. You just have to access it on a personal basis. I understand those with compromised health being overly cautious. I am 73 myself and ready to get on with life.

I feel the same as you. Everything in life has risk.
 
Don't see how cruising can return to any semblance of norm this year. The financial impact and havoc that this pandemic has wreaked upon everyone will take time to recover; not all will be able to splurge on flights and hotels to go on a cruise. Unless a vaccine has been developed, tested and has time to inoculate, countries will be leery of opening their ports to cruise ships carrying individuals from all over the globe. Staycations and closer to home vacations will be a choice for many. Whether medical and travel insurance will be available and affordable will be a significant factor for many, particularly if one is in a 'high-risk' group. Tighter restrictions and passenger screenings will likely be implemented … but that itself does not guarantee that everyone will be honest, forthcoming … or even socially responsible as has been seen by those partaking in Spring Break. Will always look forward to our next cruise … but when that will happen we do not know.
 
I feel the same as you. Everything in life has risk.

Agreed. But Im not sure what the people who are currently trapped on cruise ships are going through is worth that risk. We moved our June 2020 trip to April 2021, but we have since cancelled that one as well. Just too much uncertainty on the cruise front for use to enjoy ourselves on a vacation. If things shake out and look better we can always rebook, and at most certainly a lower faire.
 


My family has a cruise planned for December and will absolutely go unless it is cancelled. The chance of getting something will never be zero. I am not ready to quit living due to a small chance I might get a virus. If I should get it there is even less of a chance I will die from it. More likely to die in an airline crash. In any case there is a risk in everything you do. You just have to access it on a personal basis. I understand those with compromised health being overly cautious. I am 73 myself and ready to get on with life.
Just be prepared to be quarantined in your room. Unfortunately, cruise ships and air craft carriers are perfect environments. Until this virus is contained, just know that you may be trapped on board, unable to get off. I would be much more worried about that. As long as you are ok with what is happening on cruise ships now, then yes, enjoy your choice.
 
The blind faith in vaccines shown here is astonishing. Efficacy rates. Side effects. Legitimate problems that anyone who has actually read the info they are supposed to provide you with before getting it knows about.

Then again few read those inserts or research. I mean, if I told you that someone who had had the pertussis vaccine with a successful immune response to it can still get it, it will look like a mild cold, and you will go out and kiss babies and GIVE them pertussis, will you show that you don’t know how it works and say I’m wrong? Or will you agree that that is how it works (all it does is stop your body from making the toxin that causes the whoop) because you have done your research?



They said at the beginning that everyone would end up getting it. I mean, that’s literally impossible, but if you’re believing what they say, then it means you’ll get it. Might have already had it. So go with that.

Natural immunity is far superior to unnatural immunity (if you even have a successful immune response to a shot, and they never do test that, do they?).

It's not blind faith, it's science.

Do you see any children today getting polio? Do you know why? It's because we were immunized when we were children. It's almost completely gone from the planet. My mother told me how when she was a child she would have to stay inside terrified when polio was going through their neighborhood. My next door neighbor, now 85, was not so lucky. He suffered with it as a child and could walk with crutches when we first moved in 24 years ago, not so much now.
I don't know how old you are but perhaps you have a scar on your arm from a small pox vaccine. My siblings do but I don't. Do you know why? It was completed eradicated from the earth due to widespread vaccination. I was born in 1967. Nobody nowadays even needs the vaccine because of widespread vaccination. :cool1:

Look at the decrease in childhood deaths due to vaccination. It used to be typical for families to lose more than one child to illnesses that are completely preventable today because of vaccines. Think about that a minute. Imagine needing to have 4 or 5 children just so that some of them live to adulthood!!
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/whatifstop.htm
Vaccines give your body a protein from a virus so that your immune systems mounts a response, and then makes antibodies, so that it will recognize it in the future. This is why once you get chicken pox, you won't get it again. Even a breastfed newborn starts making thousands of antibodies its first day of life.
Sure, immunity isn't perfect. It may take several doses or booster shots later, such as the tetanus shot, but to me it's far easier than having the illness itself.
The problem with flu vaccines is that when they are being produced, usually the year before it's administered, they are making an educated guess and anticipating which strains are going to be prevalent. No one has a crystal ball. Strains mutate, like the common cold, and that makes it difficult to guess so far in advance what strains to add to a vaccine.

If your child hasn't been vaccinated and isn't getting these diseases, it's not just because he eats his veggies (though that helps) it's because of herd immunity, in the same way that it works for those who are immunocompromised or have an allergy to some vaccines, and cannot receive the vaccine. If enough of the "herd" (your peers, neighbors, other kids at school, etc.) refuses immunization, there is no long herd immunity. This is why you see these measles outbreaks out west.

Please educate yourself with real science with real research using clinical trials, with reproducible results. (Not the quack research Wakefield fraudulently proposed.)


And yes, I am given a pamphlet listing possible side effects and contact numbers every time get one. Most are very mild, such as a sore arm and redness at injection site.

What I find most ironic, is that people refuse their pediatrician's advice to vaccinate, but then when their baby is so sick, can't breathe, etc. they run to their pediatrician saying please help my baby!! :rolleyes:

No, I wouldn't kiss babies if I had a cold.
 
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That’s exactly my thoughts and why I can’t be sure if that’s what I had - if it was here already then, why wouldn’t it have spread as quickly? Or was it being misattributed to the flu? Do they always test people in the hospital for flu? I know I’ve never been tested but I’ve never been hospitalized. The doctors I saw never suggested what I had was the flu, just some unknown virus. But I know if I had that same bug right now I would be told to assume I have Covid-19 (based on my symptoms) and self-quarantine my entire family!

FWIW, my dh has the swab test done 2 yrs ago before being diagnosed with the flu. His lack of handwashing gave it to me 3 days later so our doctor didn't give me a swab. Also, dh delayed going to the dr so it was too late for him to take Tamiflu. I went right away and got on Tamiflu which helps to shorten the illness. We both recovered the same time so it shaved a few days off for me. Ds19, then 17, took it prophylactically and didn't get it.
 


Are you saying that no one tests for immunity? - Titers.

Those tests are done all the time and for many different diseases. Titers simply check that the person has adequate antibodies to a specific disease. So yes, it is checked.

People in heath care, schools and food industries, including culinary schools, have to have titers drawn as part of normal processes. Titers can also be used in healthcare as part of patient assessment. It is important to remember a persons antibodies to a disease can decrease over time so Titers can also change and someone who was once considered immune can be susceptible later. Therefore titers may need to be rechecked.

Exactly. :thumbsup2

I was sick a few years ago with sudden onset of severe fatigue, joint pain to the point I could barely stand, rash all over. Part of the many blood tests they ordered, were to look for Lyme disease or Epstein Barr virus. Based on results, they could see not only if I had past exposure to EB, but whether it was recent vs. long ago as a teenager perhaps.
For the EB test, (sorry I can't recall exact numbers) but something like <18= never exposed, 18-21 inconclusive, >21 =positive for past exposure. My report said "600+" indicating I had a more recent exposure; my numbers were still very high. If my exposure was 30 yrs ago, it would still be in the positive range, but not off the charts like mine was.
 
Our family just got diagnosed. After ALL symptoms clear up we will be ready to cruise fear free. I guess it is nice to just get it over with and not be afraid. Luckily, we all had mild or no symptoms. Stay healthy.

Please remember that there is not clear evidence that once youve recovered from COVID that you are immune. In fact there are a growing number of "re infection" cases. Until there is conclusive evidence one way or the other, please consider acting as if you can be reinfected. I dont want you to be fearful but I do want you to be safe. Take care. :)

My family has a cruise planned for December and will absolutely go unless it is cancelled. The chance of getting something will never be zero. I am not ready to quit living due to a small chance I might get a virus. If I should get it there is even less of a chance I will die from it. More likely to die in an airline crash. In any case there is a risk in everything you do. You just have to access it on a personal basis. I understand those with compromised health being overly cautious. I am 73 myself and ready to get on with life.

I saw an interview with a doctor and she said something along the lines of "people need to stop thinking of COVID as a suicide and start thinking of it as a homicide". Its dramatic but it gets the point across. I cant help but notice your reply only discusses the direct implications for you and not what you may unwittingly do to others.
 
Please remember that there is not clear evidence that once youve recovered from COVID that you are immune. In fact there are a growing number of "re infection" cases. Until there is conclusive evidence one way or the other, please consider acting as if you can be reinfected. I dont want you to be fearful but I do want you to be safe. Take care. :)



I saw an interview with a doctor and she said something along the lines of "people need to stop thinking of COVID as a suicide and start thinking of it as a homicide". Its dramatic but it gets the point across. I cant help but notice your reply only discusses the direct implications for you and not what you may unwittingly do to others.
Thank you for your care and concern. I have been hearing rumors of the same thing. I cannot seem to find corroboration. I think they really do not know yet.
 
Thank you for your care and concern. I have been hearing rumors of the same thing. I cannot seem to find corroboration. I think they really do not know yet.
That's my main takeaway as well. That and anyone that's been infected/ recovered should act as if they can get it again. If for no other reason than erring on the side of caution for others.

I'm sorry you are going through this and that getting through this doesnt automatically give a get out of jail free card. Hopefully before too long we will start seeing conclusive data about this issue and other surrounding the virus.
 
Quote “”Vaccines give your body a protein from a virus so that your immune systems mounts a response, and then makes antibodies, so that it will recognize it in the future. This is why once you get chicken pox, you won't get it again. Even a breastfed newborn starts making thousands of antibodies its first day of life.
Sure, immunity isn't perfect. It may take several doses or booster shots later, such as the tetanus shot, but to me it's far easier than having the illness itself. “”


I work in healthcare. I had all my childhood vaccinations. But when my MMR titres are drawn, it reads Zero. I am a nonresponder, I believe it’s called. So I’m given booster after booster. So not all vaccines work for everyone.
 
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Quote “”Vaccines give your body a protein from a virus so that your immune systems mounts a response, and then makes antibodies, so that it will recognize it in the future. This is why once you get chicken pox, you won't get it again. Even a breastfed newborn starts making thousands of antibodies its first day of life.
Sure, immunity isn't perfect. It may take several doses or booster shots later, such as the tetanus shot, but to me it's far easier than having the illness itself. “”


I work in healthcare. I had all my childhood vaccinations. But when my MMR titres are drawn, it reads Zero. I am a nonresponder, I believe it’s called. So I’m given booster after booster. So not all vaccines work for everyone.
Same issue here. I never had the measles (even though both sisters had both types when growing up). When I got married they did the titer on me - no immunity. So I got a measles shot. When we had the recent flare up with measles running here in Southern CA recently, got titers drawn again - no immunity - so another shot.

Isn't this fun?
 
Nope, not all vaccines work for everybody.

But most vaccines work for most people. And with enough people having immunity, whether through having had it, or having had the vaccine, herd immunity keeps safe those whose immune systems don't respond to vaccines (or getting the illness! I know somebody who had chicken pox multiple times) as well as those who can't get vaccines for other health reasons.
 
We have a cruise booked for Sept 2021. I hope that the vaccine is available by then. Or the test to prove you are immune - antibodies present.

I trust Disney not to sail before it’s safe.
 
Thank you for your care and concern. I have been hearing rumors of the same thing. I cannot seem to find corroboration. I think they really do not know yet.

I was reading an article on the Time website about this and most scientists really don't think there are cases of reinfection and posit several reasons for these positive tests after individuals have "recovered." I'm using quotes because one of the possibilities is that these individuals aren't completely recovered, even though symptoms are mostly gone. Another interesting possibility from the article states, "A positive test after recovery could also be detecting the residual viral RNA that has remained in the body, but not in high enough amounts to cause disease, says Menachery. “Viral RNA can last a long time even after the actual virus has been stopped.” There's also the possibility of wackiness in the tests. Anyway, here's the article in the event anyone wants to read about this: https://time.com/5810454/coronavirus-immunity-reinfection/

Also, I read that even though the virus is mutating ever so slightly (with high reproductive rates, viruses evolve much more quickly than other species), it's not enough to cause issues with a vaccine, which is great news. I have hopes that they can fast track this vaccine and get it out as quickly as possible. Unlike most illnesses, this one has researchers all over the world working feverishly! (No pun intended!)
 
We were booked on the March 9 Magic. On March 6, we postponed our cruise to December 30. Earlier this week, we called back to cancel entirely for a full refund. When it's safe to travel, we'll likely start with beach or hiking vacations. We'll wait for a vaccine before a cruise, and maybe before DL or WDW, based on concerns regarding both illness and quarantine or need to self-quarantine. Just appreciate that Disney provided the refund and we don't have to worry about it.
 
I was reading an article on the Time website about this and most scientists really don't think there are cases of reinfection and posit several reasons for these positive tests after individuals have "recovered." I'm using quotes because one of the possibilities is that these individuals aren't completely recovered, even though symptoms are mostly gone. Another interesting possibility from the article states, "A positive test after recovery could also be detecting the residual viral RNA that has remained in the body, but not in high enough amounts to cause disease, says Menachery. “Viral RNA can last a long time even after the actual virus has been stopped.” There's also the possibility of wackiness in the tests. Anyway, here's the article in the event anyone wants to read about this: https://time.com/5810454/coronavirus-immunity-reinfection/

I am also a bit skeptical about "reinfection" and agree it is more likely a "not recovered" situation. I'm still not 100% better after 3 weeks. This is not an illness you get over quickly.
 
I am also a bit skeptical about "reinfection" and agree it is more likely a "not recovered" situation. I'm still not 100% better after 3 weeks. This is not an illness you get over quickly.
Do you mind if I ask what symptoms are still hanging on or is it just generally not feeling 100%? This is so new to everyone. Also, I hope things are looking up for you. I know you had a rough time of it for a while, there.
 

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