College parents...fall semester?

[mom2rtk]

How are online finals a thing that actually works for all classes? Forgive me, I have a degree in Mechanical Engineering and can't fathom how a course with high level math could be accomplished without being able to write out formulas (often of which are very difficult to type on a keyboard due to using non standard symbols or Greek letters). It seems a fairly lousy proposal for students in STEM majors to have to do. Showing your work is often the only way to get partial credit and for a professor to show you where you went wrong in the process. Also, how is cheating prevented? I graduated back in 2006 when online courses were just starting to take off. When I started a master's I had several online courses and to me they seemed like anyone could cheat, or the professors had to make each test "open book".

My daughter's Calc 2 final this spring required her to send a scan or clear high contrast photo of her work. She's a Mechanical Engineering major and we're pretty much holding our breath hoping she really does get to take the next round of classes in person.

Not really possible to fully prevent cheating, but DD felt like the questions were harder than usual, probably to make up for the fact the test was now open book. She had 36 hours from download to deadline. She didn't know anybody else from her class, so she didn't have help from anyone. Brother is about 6 years removed from his own Calc classes so he was worthless.

 

[Mrs. Ciz]

My daughter will be a senior at Virginia Tech this Fall. They've put out the following information:

- 30% of classes will be in person; 70% will be online/hybrid

- Masks required on campus

- Classes will start on time, no Fall Break of Tgiving Break

- After Thanksgiving, classes and exams will pivot to all online

- Dining Halls will be "Grab and Go" only and will only be available to students with meal plans/dining dollars

- Only students living on campus will be allowed to purchase meal plans or dining dollars (so only 9100 out of 36,000 students will be able to buy food on campus. The other 26,900 will have to fend for themselves)

- Due to social distancing, only 9,100 students will be allowed to live on campus vs 10,400 who lived on campus last year. 1300 incoming students (including freshman who have been required to live campus in the past) had their on campus housing contracts revoked and had to go on campus housing wait lists or find alternate housing.

- Fall athletes have returned to campus for voluntary workouts. Rumor has it that football will be played but only season ticket holders will be allowed to attend, and it doesn't sound like student season tickets will be included in this group.

Lots of parents are up in arms about their freshman students losing housing (can't blame them) and about their off campus students being denied access to campus food (this is going to be tough for so many students). Amid the chaos, some students (especially freshman) are deferring a year. DD is a senior, so she's too far in to defer. She's living in a house with 4 other girls and will make the most of her last year of college. She says she's come to terms with the fact that it will not be at all the senior year she imagined., but I know it will really hit her once she's back on campus.

 

[choirfarm]

nm

 

[barkley]

i suspect colleges and universities are going to have to start taking a look at how hard nosed they are going to be on what credits they will/will not accept from sources outside their own walls. college enrollment was already declining for the 9th straight year BEFORE the virus hit, and now with international enrollments being reported at a 22% decrease for next fall (just for the places that the students have notified-not the ones that just won't enroll/no show) schools will need to look for ways to attract students when they feel comfortable returning to their campuses.

 

[mefordis]

 

[3DisneyBuggs]

DD will be a freshman and they will have classes online for most classes- I think under 45 students can meet in person. The semester has no breaks and ends at Thanksgiving. Dorms will be mostly singles and doubles. They did say freshman can opt out of housing but didnt clarify if they can do remote classes from home. Dining will be takeout as well. It’s a whole new world than when we sent DS to college.

 

[NAB]

How are online finals a thing that actually works for all classes? Forgive me, I have a degree in Mechanical Engineering and can't fathom how a course with high level math could be accomplished without being able to write out formulas (often of which are very difficult to type on a keyboard due to using non standard symbols or Greek letters). It seems a fairly lousy proposal for students in STEM majors to have to do. Showing your work is often the only way to get partial credit and for a professor to show you where you went wrong in the process. Also, how is cheating prevented? I graduated back in 2006 when online courses were just starting to take off. When I started a master's I had several online courses and to me they seemed like anyone could cheat, or the professors had to make each test "open book".

My daughter just wrote an exam this spring for her nursing course . It was Stats and had that problem. Said she had to write it out on paper to figure it out than put it on the computer , she ran out of time and didn’t pass .

All her classes this fall are on line and waiting to see how she will do her clinical part in the hospital . She is in third year first and second year are waiting until the next semester to do theirs.

Heard that a lot of students graduating grade 12 this year are taking a gap year because they want the university experience. I think that will make it harder to get in next year having 2 years worth of students trying for spots.

 

[Luv Bunnies]

We live in Texas. My daughter is going to Anderson University in Indiana to major in musical theater. No word yet, other than she did get her dorm number and roommate's name. They sound like they will get along really well. She is so excited. I have no clue how they are going to do choir or musical theater classes by social distancing. I wonder if they are going to create a bubble or something? If it all goes online, I'm not sure how that would work or what she would do. She has already done all of her regular basics dual credit at our local junior college. The only classes she has left are dance, theater, music, private lessons, choir, etc.

DS is going into his senior year as a musical theater major. On his schedule, they listed how each class would be held. His two remaining gen ed classes will be hybrid (part online and part in person). All of the MT classes will be in person, except for private voice lessons. The voice studios are pretty small and there's no way to keep the student and teacher far enough apart, not to mention the student belting loudly and potentially spreading germs. I'm assuming acting will have to be modified some. They usually act with scene partners and, depending upon the scene, can be right up in each other's faces. It would also be difficult for a professor to evaluate their acting choices if half their faces are covered by masks! We'll have to see how they handle that. They haven't yet announced if they will be doing a full schedule of shows. I really hope DS gets his performance opportunities in his senior year. I'm sure the professors will do their best under the circumstances.

 

[tcufrog]

The thing students (and counselors) have to be really careful about is whether the courses transfer to the University level 100%.

Not whether the credits transfer, but do the courses transfer to fulfill mandatory requirements?

In other words, if you take English 101 at the community college level, does that apply directly to the English 101 requirement at the university?

Or is the 3 hour credit counted as an elective, and you still have to take the required course at the university level?

In Florida, we have 4-5 different sets of requirements for graduation. Some courses count for 3 different requirements; some don't count at all. Very important to know all of the minute details.

This is very important. My daughter is taking a calculus course this summer, it took her a while to find one that would meet the matrix of her university, at a CC, not in our county. Her advisor had to sign off on it. Her OOS college then decided to offer in state tuition for online courses this summer, so she’s taking it there, higher cost, but she will get a letter grade instead of pass/fail, and it will count towards graduate school.

I agree with this absolutely. All because you earned your associates degree or spent a year or a semester in Community college does not mean those credits will transfer for anything more than electives. In NY my daughter's friend spent a semester at a community college and is transferring to a state school and only 2 of the classes are transferring as course credits. The others are electives so even though she should be a sophomore did fall semester in another state she will need to stay an extra year at the school for her major. So be careful and check with the college you want to attend to see what is transferable and what is not.

This. I was a community college librarian at a few different large community colleges. They were popular with students who wanted to save money by taking intro classes at the community college and then transferring to a four-year university. The problem is, the advisors at the community colleges often wouldn't tell the students that their CC classes may not all transfer and the students didn't know to ask. I usually recommended to students that they attempt to get in contact with the advisors at the universities they wish to attend who are in the major(s) they wish to pursue. Sometimes the general advisors don't know the specifics for all of the majors. These are some of the things I recommended that they ask:

1. Is there a cap on the number of transfer credits for the university/college within the university/major?

2. Does the major have limitations on which/how many credits can be transfer credits?

3. Does the university have any other special requirements such as requiring that the last x number of credits be taken at the university or that only certain course levels such freshman or sophomore classes can be taken elsewhere?

4. Does the department officially allow the transfer of certain classes but unofficially recommend that those classes be taken at the university? For example, one student I kept in touch with was pre-med. To save money, he took organic chemistry at the CC because it transferred. When he got to the 4 year university though, he found that doing so put him at a real disadvantage for many reasons including: he missed out on the best chance to join a good pre-med study group, he was unprepared for the rigor of the class after organic chemistry, and it turns out that at his university organic chemistry was taught differently than at the CC and he missed out on some important information.

Community college can be a great option for those who wish to save money, those who lack direction, and those students out of college who aren't mature enough for 4 year university yet. You need to do your homework though and not rely on the CC advisors to help you figure out which classes you should take at the CC and which need to wait until university. If you are unsuccessful at obtaining that information, then I would recommend taking electives or core classes that have nothing to do with your major. For example, a fashion and design major might choose to take a lab science class at the CC.

 

[AustinTink]

I'll be surprised if my son's school has in-person classes this fall. Covid cases are through the roof in Texas right now and only getting worse. The school's current model for fall is a hybrid of in-person and online with the largest classes given online.

Austin has been one of the more cautious cities in Texas and the university has been following the city's overall guidelines up to now. So, we'll see what happens. The official word will be announced in late June.

 

[StephMK]

How are online finals a thing that actually works for all classes? Forgive me, I have a degree in Mechanical Engineering and can't fathom how a course with high level math could be accomplished without being able to write out formulas (often of which are very difficult to type on a keyboard due to using non standard symbols or Greek letters). It seems a fairly lousy proposal for students in STEM majors to have to do. Showing your work is often the only way to get partial credit and for a professor to show you where you went wrong in the process. Also, how is cheating prevented? I graduated back in 2006 when online courses were just starting to take off. When I started a master's I had several online courses and to me they seemed like anyone could cheat, or the professors had to make each test "open book".

At my son's school, his Calc 3 exam was at a set time. Within 5 minutes of turning in the test, he had to scan all of his work. There was also a time that the test closed and work had to be scanned, done or not. It was between 4-6 pages each test so even if someone cheated and got the right answer, they had to show the work.

 

[CarolAnn856]

DS is going into his senior year as a musical theater major. On his schedule, they listed how each class would be held. His two remaining gen ed classes will be hybrid (part online and part in person). All of the MT classes will be in person, except for private voice lessons. The voice studios are pretty small and there's no way to keep the student and teacher far enough apart, not to mention the student belting loudly and potentially spreading germs. I'm assuming acting will have to be modified some. They usually act with scene partners and, depending upon the scene, can be right up in each other's faces. It would also be difficult for a professor to evaluate their acting choices if half their faces are covered by masks! We'll have to see how they handle that. They haven't yet announced if they will be doing a full schedule of shows. I really hope DS gets his performance opportunities in his senior year. I'm sure the professors will do their best under the circumstances.

My son is a theatre production / design major and had to take an acting class this past semester. Once all the kids moved home, they did the acting exercises through zoom.

 

[choirfarm]

DS is going into his senior year as a musical theater major. On his schedule, they listed how each class would be held. His two remaining gen ed classes will be hybrid (part online and part in person). All of the MT classes will be in person, except for private voice lessons. The voice studios are pretty small and there's no way to keep the student and teacher far enough apart, not to mention the student belting loudly and potentially spreading germs. I'm assuming acting will have to be modified some. They usually act with scene partners and, depending upon the scene, can be right up in each other's faces. It would also be difficult for a professor to evaluate their acting choices if half their faces are covered by masks! We'll have to see how they handle that. They haven't yet announced if they will be doing a full schedule of shows. I really hope DS gets his performance opportunities in his senior year. I'm sure the professors will do their best under the circumstances.

I hope he gets to do his fall productions.

My son is a theatre production / design major and had to take an acting class this past semester. Once all the kids moved home, they did the acting exercises through zoom.

Gross. Gross. Gross. The local community theater is doing that and we don't really like it. That just isn't the same. I hope they make some kind of bubble.

 

[Darcy03231]

The University where my daughter works has gone to an all on-line model for next year, with a few exceptions for classes that require labs. They had a pretty big on-line program to begin with. Tuition for all classes will be at the on-line price.

 

[JimMIA]

I'll be surprised if my son's school has in-person classes this fall. Covid cases are through the roof in Texas right now and only getting worse. The school's current model for fall is a hybrid of in-person and online with the largest classes given online.

Austin has been one of the more cautious cities in Texas and the university has been following the city's overall guidelines up to now. So, we'll see what happens. The official word will be announced in late June.

The problem for these large universities will be their student body returning to campus from all over the globe. There are sure to be some infected students, so there is going to be substantial risk.

 

[bjscheel]

We will probably hear more after tomorrow, when they have a vote on doing the end-by-Thanksgiving thing with online finals. DD (sophomore) would be okay with that plan. She has an apartment rented already and will be living in it regardless and seeing her small circle of friends. I am definitely glad we have that certainty and she won't be dependent on dorm housing or food.

It's a smaller regional school so draws mostly local, in a low-affected area, so I have hopes it will go okay.

She had acting and set design last semester, those classes were sort of a loss after they went home. At least theatre is only a minor for her.

 

[Southernmiss]

The problem for these large universities will be their student body returning to campus from all over the globe. There are sure to be some infected students, so there is going to be substantial risk.

The permanent residents of my kids' college town are already complaining on the local newspaper site about the college kids who have returned to town and are bringing the virus with them.

The number of cases of the virus reported since June 1st at the 4 urgicare clinics is over 150 and does seem to be mostly students who returned to work when the businesses opened back up. Masks are required in businesses. But the kids are getting together with friends at apartments, etc.

Until recently, there was barely enough on campus housing to house freshmen. Apartments have been necessary for upperclassmen. Many of the students have permanent off campus apartments that they pay for for an entire year-July to July, with leases signed by March. So they are working and living in their apartments that they had paid for before the pandemic hit.

The residents say that the college kids should not return to town because they will bring/have brought the virus. The town has become what it is today because of the college. The college has been there for over 150 years. The activity related to the college churns much of the economy. Closing it for the year would hurt the local economy.

As of now, our daughter has a freshman dorm move in date and the campus seems to be preparing for in person classes, though no formal plan has been declared.

Our son, starting his 4th year, has an off campus apartment and returned to work after a quick trip home for 2 weeks. His business never fully closed-went to curbside. They now have in person customers again. He assures us that he is wearing his mask at work and socially distancing and wearing his mask when in the community, is mostly fishing, seeing a limited number of friends, and playing with his cat when he's not at work.

It will be really interesting to see what the universities come up with.

 

[Luv Bunnies]

My son is a theatre production / design major and had to take an acting class this past semester. Once all the kids moved home, they did the acting exercises through zoom.

Actually, out of all my son's musical theater classes, acting wasn't the worst to have online. He was bummed not to have in-person classes because he had a guest professor who was only teaching last semester. He was loving the class and was sad not to get the full benefit of in-person classes with him.

The professor spent the first session just talking to the kids and getting feel for what they could work on over the Zoom format. In the next session, he came on and said that looking at all the faces of his students on a screen gave him an idea. He was going to spend the rest of the semester focusing on screen/on-camera acting. Even though these kids were mostly training for the stage, screen acting skills are just as important and can be quite lucrative. If he could only see them on the screen for two months, he might as well work on those skills. They worked on TV/movie monologues as opposed to theater. The professor talked about using the more subtle facial expressions required for the camera and close-ups. They even talked about singing with a camera right in front of your face vs. emoting to reach the back row of a theater. They also focused on the business side of acting including resumes, working with agents, negotiating contracts, etc. They definitely made the best of the situation, although I do hope they can get back to their in-person acting class in the fall.

 

[JimMIA]

A new survey says about HALF of all high school seniors have changed their plans for the coming year due to Covid-19.

The news article is poorly written, so some explanation is in order.

• 49% of ALL students surveyed said their plans had changed
• Of THAT 49%, this is what their revised plans are
  • 36% (of the 49%) say they will now work
  • 32% (of the 49%) say they will delay their college start date
  • 16% (of the 49%) say they are "changing their career path." It's not at all clear what that means.
  • Those three poll responses total 84%. There is no indication of what the other 16% (of the 49%) responded.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/17/49p...grads-have-changed-plans-due-to-covid-19.html

 

[PollyannaMom]

How are online finals a thing that actually works for all classes? Forgive me, I have a degree in Mechanical Engineering and can't fathom how a course with high level math could be accomplished without being able to write out formulas (often of which are very difficult to type on a keyboard due to using non standard symbols or Greek letters). It seems a fairly lousy proposal for students in STEM majors to have to do. Showing your work is often the only way to get partial credit and for a professor to show you where you went wrong in the process. Also, how is cheating prevented? I graduated back in 2006 when online courses were just starting to take off. When I started a master's I had several online courses and to me they seemed like anyone could cheat, or the professors had to make each test "open book".

DS's last semester went online at spring break. Some of his classes did papers or projects for a final exam grade in place of traditional tests. Some just went with open book tests. - Kids today really do live in an "open book" world, after all. They no longer really have to memorize formulas, etc, as they carry the references around in their pockets via smart phones. So the professors that did online exams focused more on "how do you use this information" type of questions, and it worked out OK.

Heard that a lot of students graduating grade 12 this year are taking a gap year because they want the university experience. I think that will make it harder to get in next year having 2 years worth of students trying for spots.

It definitely will. And I'd be willing to bet we're going to see the same thing in the youngest students as well. - Many parents are going to "red-shirt" their kindergarteners, not starting them in school until next year. I don't blame them a bit, but it's going to create the ultimate "bubble class" (a term we already use in local school districts for class years that just happened to have higher than average birth rates.)

They had a pretty big on-line program to begin with. Tuition for all classes will be at the on-line price.

At least they are charging fairly!