Any idea when we can buy WDW annual passes?

[mackmack]

For hotels, club level rooms, entertainment and restaurants re-opening, we usually only hear a few weeks before it actually happens ... So, what we can probably assume is that we're not yet a few weeks away from when APs will return.

It's a valid argument that they are poor at communicating or perhaps even just gun shy due to wanting to remain flexible to the last minute. I get that. But to me this one is different. DVC points, hotels, restaurants don't quite meet the threshold in my opinion when it comes to silence about AP's. Same goes for Fast Pass and Genie. These are seismic changes, once in 50+ years. When Tron will be done or the poly monorail are small potatoes when it comes to dissemination of information. In addition, if they were coming back in their same form(sans price hike), there is no impact to that statement. AP's have been around forever, it would be like turning on a light switch to program that needs and gets no significant changes. Compared to a ride or restaurant which could influence bookings and dining if it doesn't open for example, there is no risk to say "hey, AP's are temporarily paused but coming back".

Lastly to respond to GGJDad's comment regarding the comment on the website. Why would they bury that if it were true? It would be a HUGE announcement yet they do it with a script buried on a dvc points site? That reeks to me of placeholder. And finally, "temporarily paused" is probably valid no matter what. "it" whatever "it" is, is coming back. There will be a "AP/Legacy/Passholder" program of some kind. They simply call it "legacy" now at Disneyland but it's considered their AP now. So not only do I not put stock in something that is probably placeholder text buried on the DVC site, but its meaning could easily be misconstrued into what the new "AP" is.

 

[Liquidice]

It's a valid argument that they are poor at communicating or perhaps even just gun shy due to wanting to remain flexible to the last minute. I get that. But to me this one is different. DVC points, hotels, restaurants don't quite meet the threshold in my opinion when it comes to silence about AP's. Same goes for Fast Pass and Genie. These are seismic changes, once in 50+ years. When Tron will be done or the poly monorail are small potatoes when it comes to dissemination of information. In addition, if they were coming back in their same form(sans price hike), there is no impact to that statement. AP's have been around forever, it would be like turning on a light switch to program that needs and gets no significant changes. Compared to a ride or restaurant which could influence bookings and dining if it doesn't open for example, there is no risk to say "hey, AP's are temporarily paused but coming back".

Lastly to respond to GGJDad's comment regarding the comment on the website. Why would they bury that if it were true? It would be a HUGE announcement yet they do it with a script buried on a dvc points site? That reeks to me of placeholder. And finally, "temporarily paused" is probably valid no matter what. "it" whatever "it" is, is coming back. There will be a "AP/Legacy/Passholder" program of some kind. They simply call it "legacy" now at Disneyland but it's considered their AP now. So not only do I not put stock in something that is probably placeholder text buried on the DVC site, but its meaning could easily be misconstrued into what the new "AP" is.

Its a seismic change if it actually happens ... If there are no AP changes, it could just be down to stinky communication

But I do go back to DCL, they were essentially silent all of 2020 - that is a big major business for them - they could have excited guests with tidbits about the Disney Wish, provided emails on what they were doing to keep passengers safe when they returned to sailing ... But we hardly heard a peep.

Currently, they do say "APs are temporarily paused" though ... it doesn't mean they can't temporarily pause it and never bring back the old AP program, thats certainly possible. But that is some amount of communication - and I'd say to burying it in the wrong place, not really coming out and saying it loudly - it is just Disney's crappy communication.

BTW- This isn't really buried - it is on the page that talks about experience updates at the parks due to the pandemic under Tickets and Passes: https://disneyworld.disney.go.com/experience-updates/parks/

"Purchasing or Renewing Annual Passes
At this time, the sale of new annual passes is temporarily paused. However, current Annual Passholders may still renew their pass."

I'm not saying APs are definitely coming back - I think it is 50/50 in my opinion, I could just as likely see APs coming back as I could see them be replaced with an entirely new program - or a hybrid of this where annual passes come back but modified tiers. For example, an Annual Pass that lets you make 6 Park Pass reservations instead of just 3, and have a certain number days where you can go to the parks unplanned without a reservation - for more money of course.

I think part of it has to do with Disney furloughs. They didn't just furlough "on stage" CMs they furloughed some people in the offices too - I don't know if all of those people have returned yet (or if when recalled they are coming back) - but that may also have something to do with Disney's bad communication, and inability to put things in the right place on their website.

Personally though I think paid Fastpass is more likely at WDW than a major change to APs right now. I just don't think it is as big of a problem at WDW as it is at Disneyland and I believe they'll keep things the same (and before the end of this year resume new AP purchases) and see how the new Disneyland program holds up before they make changes at WDW. If new AP sales do come back though, I expect that the 3 Park Pass limit for APs will stay though.

Not surprised either way if they do make both of these changes - but that is just my gut feeling

 

[AmishGuy91]

Its a seismic change if it actually happens ... If there are no AP changes, it could just be down to stinky communication

But I do go back to DCL, they were essentially silent all of 2020 - that is a big major business for them - they could have excited guests with tidbits about the Disney Wish, provided emails on what they were doing to keep passengers safe when they returned to sailing ... But we hardly heard a peep.

Currently, they do say "APs are temporarily paused" though ... it doesn't mean they can't temporarily pause it and never bring back the old AP program, thats certainly possible. But that is some amount of communication - and I'd say to burying it in the wrong place, not really coming out and saying it loudly - it is just Disney's crappy communication.

BTW- This isn't really buried - it is on the page that talks about experience updates at the parks due to the pandemic under Tickets and Passes: https://disneyworld.disney.go.com/experience-updates/parks/

"Purchasing or Renewing Annual Passes
At this time, the sale of new annual passes is temporarily paused. However, current Annual Passholders may still renew their pass."

I'm not saying APs are definitely coming back - I think it is 50/50 in my opinion, I could just as likely see APs coming back as I could see them be replaced with an entirely new program - or a hybrid of this where annual passes come back but modified tiers. For example, an Annual Pass that lets you make 6 Park Pass reservations instead of just 3, and have a certain number days where you can go to the parks unplanned without a reservation - for more money of course.

I think part of it has to do with Disney furloughs. They didn't just furlough "on stage" CMs they furloughed some people in the offices too - I don't know if all of those people have returned yet (or if when recalled they are coming back) - but that may also have something to do with Disney's bad communication, and inability to put things in the right place on their website.

Personally though I think paid Fastpass is more likely at WDW than a major change to APs right now. I just don't think it is as big of a problem at WDW as it is at Disneyland and I believe they'll keep things the same (and before the end of this year resume new AP purchases) and see how the new Disneyland program holds up before they make changes at WDW. If new AP sales do come back though, I expect that the 3 Park Pass limit for APs will stay though.

Not surprised either way if they do make both of these changes - but that is just my gut feeling

Nice to see a well-thought-out, reasonable, researched post in this thread

 

[DarthEsquire]

I would like to see an annual pass tied to resort stays. As long as you are in a Disney resort you can make a reservation for whatever day you are there. They could still make the pass cheaper for local people as they would have to spend on the room no matter what. I wouldn't foresee DVC getting a discount (although I would prefer it as a DVC member) since they already definitely have to have a room. That way the average spending would automatically go up some because of the room cost (even if it is a throwaway room). One immediate downside would be if some locals can afford that it will result in all hotels going up in price and some capacity issues.

 

[bookbabe626]

So if someone is there now, while only BB is open, would they be able to upgrade to Platinum Plus if they want to go to BB?

I think you may be out of luck.

We have Platinum Plus APs that expire mid-October, and we were allowed to buy a renewal certificate on Saturday so that we could make park reservations for November and December trips, but we were only allowed to buy Platinum, not Plus. She specifically said it was because only one water park was open right now, but that we could upgrade it later if the second water park opened at some point.

So while normally you can upgrade to Plus at any point, right now that doesn’t seem to be an option.

 

[bookbabe626]

So if someone is there now, while only BB is open, would they be able to upgrade to Platinum Plus if they want to go to BB?

I doubt it. She said no Plus at this time, not until the second water park opened.

 

[sbbobe]

My wife and I tried to upgrade our Gold AP’s last week to Platinum to no avail. I stopped by guest services at all 4 parks and at guest relations in Disney Springs. The CM‘s were very consistent in denying our requests. We had hoped to upgrade so that we could vacation at WDW during Easter week in 2022. Oh Well! It does save us a few dollars.

 

[mackmack]

My wife and I tried to upgrade our Gold AP’s last week to Platinum to no avail. I stopped by guest services at all 4 parks and at guest relations in Disney Springs. The CM‘s were very consistent in denying our requests. We had hoped to upgrade so that we could vacation at WDW during Easter week in 2022. Oh Well! It does save us a few dollars.

Did they provide a reason or comment?

 

[afan]

The food & wine merch pages talks about a passholder figment line. I can't imagine they'd do a specific line for an event that is july through nov and then get rid of them.

 

[mackmack]

The food & wine merch pages talks about a passholder figment line. I can't imagine they'd do a specific line for an event that is july through nov and then get rid of them.

But exactly what will a "passholder" be is the question. I think there is 100% certainty amongst the community that a pass of some kind (annual/legacy) is coming. Will it be spend $900 and go to the parks every day you want for an entire year? My opinion is no. I believe it will look pretty much exactly like Land.

I think this is where all the confusion is coming in. People are seeing things pop up about AP's, that's never been the contention that AP's were going away.

 

[afan]

But exactly what will a "passholder" be is the question. I think there is 100% certainty amongst the community that a pass of some kind (annual/legacy) is coming. Will it be spend $900 and go to the parks every day you want for an entire year? My opinion is no. I believe it will look pretty much exactly like Land.

I think this is where all the confusion is coming in. People are seeing things pop up about AP's, that's never been the contention that AP's were going away.

And there's no reason for them to do the same thing as DLR, but I'm tired of the horse being beaten regarding the differences between the two parks.

If they were really going to get rid of them or drastically change them at WDW, we'd have seen it by now. There's got to be thousands of AP certs hanging out in people's accounts waiting until they go to be activated since they have such a long expiration date. Disney's aware of the number of them, and how many they currently have that are renewing/being able to purchase again. They would have done what they did at DLR, cancelled them, shut off sales etc.

I don't doubt there will be a significant price increase, but the two programs won't be identical. I also don't see it as confusion, they put them on pause for new people. The confusion is from them still letting a specific group purchase new and others renew without telling anyone when it'll open for all.

But everyone will just keep going around and around in circles and continue bring DLR up. Who will probably start selling whatever the new version is before WDW starts selling APs again because once they can go to a higher capacity and the novelty of being able to visit the parks again, locals are going to stop buying the regular tickets. And they need those locals.

 

[sbbobe]

Did they provide a reason or comment?

In each situation we were informed that AP upgrades were not allowed at this time. I have spoken to several people that have also tried to upgrade and to date only one person was allowed to upgrade. My unfounded theory is that at the present time Disney only wants to sell individual daily tickets for their blackout dates.

 

[mackmack]

If they were really going to get rid of them or drastically change them at WDW, we'd have seen it by now.

Why would this moment in time have anything at all to do with the changes that are coming? They are drastically changing fast pass and adding Genie as well and this moment and time doesn't seem to be hindering anything. When they make the change, they will make the change, I dont think this is a good or bad date or whatever you are suggesting.

Because I do not want to beat a dead horse, the AP's that are out there and being "sold" are for people who overlapped through the pandemic and weren't able to use their tickets. Disney has basically no choice other than to let these people renew(or continue). Those are the ONLY people who have gotten a "free pass" to extend the program for a year because they were paying for AP during a pandemic when in some cases you could not even step on an airplane, before anyone knew a vaccine even existed. They can not use that to their advantage and collect the fees and remove the ability from the customer to renew. Everyone else is out of luck because they are dissolving it and can not sell it because it will not exist going forward.

But I guess everyone will be able to see all that for themselves when the changes take place after the 50th.

 

[AllyElly]

Because I do not want to beat a dead horse, the AP's that are out there and being "sold" are for people who overlapped through the pandemic and weren't able to use their tickets. Disney has basically no choice other than to let these people renew(or continue). Those are the ONLY people who have gotten a "free pass" to extend the program for a year because they were paying for AP during a pandemic when in some cases you could not even step on an airplane, before anyone knew a vaccine even existed. They can not use that to their advantage and collect the fees and remove the ability from the customer to renew.[/QUOTE]

Just an observation - people had the opportunity to cancel and receive a refund for their passes that were active during the shut down. Those people are now allowed to purchase a new AP voucher. If they were not going to have an AP program, whatever it may include, why would they let those individuals purchase a new voucher? Wouldn’t they just refund them their money and call it a day? There is no reason to allow people to purchase new AP vouchers, whether they held one during the pandemic or not, if there was not going to be an AP program in the future.

 

[AmishGuy91]

Just an observation - people had the opportunity to cancel and receive a refund for their passes that were active during the shut down. Those people are now allowed to purchase a new AP voucher. If they were not going to have an AP program, whatever it may include, why would they let those individuals purchase a new voucher? Wouldn’t they just refund them their money and call it a day? There is no reason to allow people to purchase new AP vouchers, whether they held one during the pandemic or not, if there was not going to be an AP program in the future.

Yes, but mack just wants to be argumentative against whatever evidence does exist. Or you know, WDW could have just stopped APs all together if that was the long term plan.....because that's exactly what they did at DLR.

 

[ellbell]

Don't forget that kids who turned 3 who never had an AP before are also allowed to purchase brand new APs

 

[mackmack]

Just an observation - people had the opportunity to cancel and receive a refund for their passes that were active during the shut down. Those people are now allowed to purchase a new AP voucher. If they were not going to have an AP program, whatever it may include, why would they let those individuals purchase a new voucher? Wouldn’t they just refund them their money and call it a day? There is no reason to allow people to purchase new AP vouchers, whether they held one during the pandemic or not, if there was not going to be an AP program in the future.

I have answered this before but perhaps it is buried and since you asked. The reason in my opinion is 2 fold. 1, the new AP program is not ready and they cant keep those people in limbo, especially with how quickly the CDC changed guidelines and how quickly capacity is coming back. They did offer all those people a refund, but they felt obligated to give them their money's worth since they were literally paying for a park that could not be visited during their AP period, and these people were loyal to Disney. This is a small window of people and it does nothing to their bottom line. Those people, in my opinion, are now on a clock and they will be in the same boat as everyone else at the end of their year of use. They were grandfathered into an extension due to extraordinary circumstances. You can see by reading this forum how strict Disney is being and denying people, had to be a perfect window and you had to call and complain essentially. This is not even on the radar the amount of people we are talking about in the grand scheme of Disney attendance and relieves them of a lot of PR grief and front like CM damage control.

But please allow me to throw some common sense softballs back at you. If this is no big thing and they are offering these passes to people why handle it like this where a ton of people are being denied and only a few allowed to renew? Why not just let everyone renew? makes zero sense unless what I said above is true. Second, why not simply come out and say "they are coming back, we will let you know when"(in actual human being PR announcement, not some outdated text link buried on their website, literally it is a CEO worthy announcement that CNBC would pick up)?? the blanket response I have gotten on this board is "disney is just poor communicators" I am going to take the other side of the argument when just months ago the CEO said AP's are the least desirable guest and big changes were coming with a full rework. (again the dead horse rebuttal is that is Land and not World, guess everyone is entitled to their interpretation but last I looked the CEO had a fiduciary responsibility to increase profits and people are waiting on the phone today over 7+ hours to get into one of the highest priced and sold out after hour events in the history of Disney). Handing out $900 go as many times as you like tickets again seems contrary to his statements and the shareholders he is bound to reward and protect.

But, like I said. We all need to sit back and just watch what will happen. I am feeling pretty good where I sit.

 

[zackiedawg]

I just do not understand how people don't understand this. Does anyone here actually go to the parks on a regular basis or watch vloggers that go? Literally you need to open an app on a phone and within 5 seconds click a button or you are not riding rise of the resistance or web slingers. Tron will be the same. Just stop and think about that, you have 5 seconds on a mobile phone app or you are shut out from those rides. The entire park is becoming overcrowded and the only viable solution is to institute inflationary measures to balance profit/viability/sustainability. You can not have 5,000 people waiting at rope drop on a Tuesday morning. It starts to become a miserable experience if you are waiting in lines that long. Peter Pan was 2 hours last thursday in the blistering sun. They need balance. The only balance tool they have short of a lottery system is raising prices to squeeze out the bloated and unprofitable lower group( AP HOLDERS ). Not only is this a problem now, it is COMPOUNDING year after year. It is literally unsustainable.

While I agree somewhat with the parks being overly crowded and no longer having an 'off season', one thing often missed by comments about annual-pass locals, and what seems to be missing with Disney's execs counting where the profits are coming from, is that many 'locals' travel to Disney not just to try to get on Rise of the Resistance or hit rope drop to race to various rides...but to enjoy the day spending money. Often lots of money. Often more than some out-of-staters coming for their once a year family trip. It's specifically because of DVC and annual passes that those annual costs get filtered out and averaged out in some of our minds - once paid, they're paid and now the trips to Disney feel like they have 'no' real cost other than the gas to drive to the parks (of course this isn't true at all since we're paying the $600-800 annually for passes, 5-figures for the DVC purchase, plus 4-figure annual dues)...but it can 'feel' like that - so when I go up to Disney, check in to my DVC, and pop into a park with my AP, I have no qualms about spending money on all kinds of highly overpriced Disney things. I never eat outside of the parks...my family, friends, and I usually eat in high end restaurants and will happily pay well over $100 per person per dinner meal - with drinks, coffees, desserts, etc - at Cali Grill, Jiko, etc. As we're all adults, we typically hit the bars and order expensive alcohol drinks throughout the afternoon and evening. We'll buy gifts for family. Hats and shirts that we don't need any more of yet still end up buying. We'll rent golf carts, sprite boats, pontoon boats, and other perks for when we're not in the parks. We collect Trader Sam's glasses, doubling the price of every drink there. Every bit of our spending happens in the parks...and because we're just a few hours' drive away, we'll visit 4-5 times a year, 4-6 days each trip.

It feels like sometimes Disney doesn't understand that crowd - and assume much as some others here might, that AP locals just want the ticket discount so they can spend as little as possible. Yet some of us are often the spendiest group for all the high-end perks and top-tier restaurants, and we're the ones who can enjoy the parks even on the crowded days because we don't have to hit every hot ride each day we're there, spending all of our planning time around how to get on every possible ride from rope-drop. Rather than spend 2 hours on a line, riding a ride, and rushing to the next line, we're willing to skip the line, sit at a bar, have a few frozen cocktails, and enjoy a live band. While parades or fireworks are going on, we are often the ones sitting in the restaurants ordering nice meals with big tabs because we can miss that parade or fireworks show that night - we'll just see it another time, or already saw it a dozen times. There are many times in the parks when most people aren't spending any money, that we are. Without the AP, I may not feel quite so liberated. I'm already thinking in my mind that my July trip is costing me $450 for tickets, then my September trip is costing me $450 in tickets, and so on - I'm less prone to spend on all kinds of big ticket expenses and meals when I am seeing that ticket tab added on to each trip...when I just pay $600+ to an annual pass once, it's not on my mind for the next 4-5 trips...and I will tend to be more liberal about spending on other things. That's why the missing annual pass is painful for me, and why it's costly to Disney for a local who can't get his annual pass.

 

[Grumpy Mouse]

I am feeling pretty good where I sit.

I may agree with your position on this issue, but I'm definitely not feeling 'good where I sit'.

I bought our direct membership in November of 2020 FOR the annual pass. We didn't actually find out they had been suspended until after the deal was done. When I asked our guide about it, she said, 'Not to worry, check back in January of 2021, I'm pretty sure they'll be selling them again by then'. January came and went. When I complained (loudly) to DVC and pointed to the membership extras disclosure as part of our contract, I got a call from someone on the DVC leadership team in early February. He was very nice and said he'd work the issue. I got a call back a few weeks later saying it 'was still a no' - but wasn't going to give up and was hoping to have 'good news' for us in the following weeks. Then complete radio silence - nothing. I texted him a few times (he had given me his cell number) - and got nothing. No reply, nothing. I complained some more (including to the attorney general's office) and got a sharply worded letter from DVC compliance essentially saying Disney/DVC could do whatever they wanted - whenever they wanted.

At this point, I'm just tired of the silence and the rumors. I need to make an informed decision about the future of my two DVC contracts; I can't afford to pay full fare ticket prices every time we go. So if anyone from Disney/DVC management is reading these boards, time to step-up, rip off the band-aid, and tell us (the membership) what the future of DVC looks like. The pandemic in the US is waning, all government restrictions surrounding WDW have been lifted, and future park capacity is fully within Disney's control again. The ball's in your court.

Tell us what you're going to do so each member can make an informed decision about their ownership.

You may not owe us anything other than a room, but you do owe us transparency.

 

[mackmack]

You may not owe us anything other than a room, but you do owe us transparency.

Totally agree with you.

I feel like they can not do that at this time because the entire concept is a mess and has not been given the green light (speaking of the trifecta of Lightning/Genie/AP Rework). Otherwise, if this was a matter of AP's coming back August or September(as has been suggested on these boards), they are just angering loyal customers like yourself and it's a self inflicted wound for no apparent gain whatsoever.