An Armed Guard Escort? Really?

[WaltD4Me]

Wow. I was amazed listening to the information about the ABD Egypt trip. I can't imagine feeling comfortable going on a trip that requires an armed guard escort. I realize Egypt is an amazing place, but I just wouldn't find that enjoyable. Especially as a woman. I'm a little surprised Disney is even doing this trip after listening to the show. I wonder how well it will sell.

 

[Gigi22]

I can believe it. Our high school trip was a Mediterranean cruise that included a stop at Alexandria, Egypt and a lengthy side trip to visit the pyramids and Cairo. As an adult who now has a much wider travel experience, I consider Alexandria in particular to be the single most dangerous place I have ever been. To give you an idea, when our driver had to make a stop, he locked us into the bus with our chaperones. Our chaperones essentially herded us around.

 

[paulasillars]

This was my post on another thread about Egypt

It was probably me that NikkiBell mentioned in an earlier post. Let me just say that I'm well traveled, I've been to many countries including developing nations but Disney going to Egypt...? read on...

I travelled to Egypt about 10 years ago and I doubt its changed much at all.

Fabulous place with amazing history. Would I go again... I'd have to consider it very hard but possibly not. Looking back on the photos, I'm stunned by what we saw but it was the most difficult holiday I've ever had and I can't say I enjoyed it much at the time.

I travelled with my Mum and we did a small group tour (12 travelers plus guide) with a well known UK based tour group. It was a 15 night trip from Alexandria (El Alamein down to Luxor). Knowing its a muslim country we dressed modestly - long pants and long sleeve shirt with collar and did not intend on attracting attention.

I was groped, kissed and generally sleezed over by any man over the age of about 14. Its not the first muslim country I've travelled to but its the only one where I have felt extremely uncomfortable and felt physically (and sexually) threatened. We got to the point where we wouldn't leave our hotel without the rest of the group. One of the men in the group was approached as someone wanted to "buy" me - I don't even want to know what that meant.

Admittedly we weren't traveling in the same "style" or "class" as Disney but we did have a proper boat to cruise the nile where many tour company use more "raft" style boats. Our hotels were basic but in tourist areas so it wasn't like we were well off the beaten path.

Another consideration is the amount of vaccinations you need and anti-malarial medications - I believe its fairly high risk and you need some fairly good travel health advise before you go. Anyone considering it should be looking into vaccinations at least 6 months before going. Some of these have considerable costs associated also.

We had armed guards that were supposed to escort us, well they did, until you left the city limits and then it was not longer their problem if you got shot or blown up - it happens.

Also beware that hygiene is limited - at Abu Simbel there were literally hundreds of tour buses in the car park - there were 4 toilets - 1 was broken and they hand you a square of toilet paper. We found this wasn't for using, it was for covering your nose while you were queuing due to the stench of the facilities.

Also many tourists were suffering with very bad stomach upsets - they didn't make it to the toilet...

Beggars and hawkers are everywhere and they are incredibly persistent - I've been to many asian countries and no where has been as bad as Egypt. People are actively trying to scam, rob and rip you off everywhere you look.
I had people demanding I give them my belongings - I didn't need them as I was obviously filthy rich in their view.

If you have any liking for animals, be very prepared to see some very poorly treated animals. You may well see donkey's being whipped and beaten, having saddle sores and similar. Other animals are no better treated.

There also seemed to be little respect for the amazing history and architecture. I was told, and I don't know if its true that they don't consider it "their" history as the Arabic culture came later.

I think Disney are going to regret this unless they can severely limit what their guests see and experience.

Happy to answer any questions.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

An armed guard makes me feel MORE comfortable about going on the trip, actually.

 

[WaltD4Me]

An armed guard makes me feel MORE comfortable about going on the trip, actually.

Well, after reading Paula's post about her trip to Egypt, I would feel more comfortable with a guard too, but after reading it, I also know I won't be going to to Egypt. I guess what I meant was, I just don't think I would want to travel somewhere that the armed guard is necessary/required.

 

[TyRy]

Egypt is a place I've wanted to visit since I was in grade school. Even with it being a Disney trip, I'm still not comfortable enough to jump in. Too many uncertainties (in my mind) and I'd hate to be looking over my shoulder constantly...something I know I would do.

Hopefully someday Egypt will be a "safer" place to visit and then we'll get to go...although I know that would be many years in the future.

 

[Joshua_me]

Also beware that hygiene is limited - at Abu Simbel there were literally hundreds of tour buses in the car park - there were 4 toilets - 1 was broken and they hand you a square of toilet paper. We found this wasn't for using, it was for covering your nose while you were queuing due to the stench of the facilities.

Also many tourists were suffering with very bad stomach upsets - they didn't make it to the toilet...

^ Talk about a magical adventure !

Tell you what, guys... Y'all go, have fun, I'll be poolside at the hotel when you get back...

 

[LoodlesNoodles]

I think I'd have feel safer with an armed guard present!

I've only ever been to Egypt once for a cheap sunshine holiday but the men are so..urgh. In your face? I guess. They didn't leave me alone. I even ended up with one of them calling me everyday for about 4 weeks after I got back home (he stole my number from the check in sheet at the hotel) until I complained to the hotel (they didn't care) and called my phone network and got them to block the number.
It put me off going back, but those pyramids and tombs call to me and I feel I must see them at some point in my life. Just next time, I go with men not other girls. Especially not girls who thrive on such male attention.

Anyways, that's my take on Egypt.

 

[challer]

^ Talk about a magical adventure !

Tell you what, guys... Y'all go, have fun, I'll be poolside at the hotel when you get back...

I'm going to the poolside bar to get a beer. Need anything from there?

 

[gkrykewy]

Well, that was that well publicized incident about 15 years ago where an entire tour group was massacred by gunmen.....so...... In that context it seems the very least they can do. I think that was at abu simbal.

Edit: no, it was deir el-bahri (luxor), 1997:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luxor_massacre

In the mid-morning attack, terrorists from the Islamic Group and Jihad Talaat al-Fath ("Holy War of the Vanguard of the Conquest") massacred 62 people at the attraction. The six assailants were armed with automatic firearms and knives, and disguised as members of the security forces. They descended on the Temple of Hatshepsut at around 08:45. With the tourists trapped inside the temple, the killing went on systematically for 45 minutes. The dead included a five-year-old British child and four Japanese couples on their honeymoons.[4][5]
The attackers then hijacked a bus, but ran into a checkpoint of armed Egyptian tourist police and military forces. One of the terrorists was wounded in the shootout and the rest fled into the hills where their bodies were found in a cave, apparently having committed suicide together.[6]

 

[pjacobi]

Armed guards are common in Egypt. I think it is a way to guarantee full employement.

Sometimes the guard will demand that you take their picture. Other times they will try to stop you from taking a photo in a museum by yelling "No flash!" Then, wink and say "One flash, OK!" If you take the picture, you are obligated to pay "Baksheeh" which is Arabic for tip/bribe.

You can read more in my trip report from 2001:

http://home.comcast.net/~p.jacobi/

One of the reason to go to Egypt is to learn how the "other half" lives. It makes you appreciate your own country much more.


-Paul

 

[Joshua_me]

I'm going to the poolside bar to get a beer. Need anything from there?

^ A cold beer would be delightful, thanks !

(Love your blog, BTW...)

 

[jeanigor]

One of the reason to go to Egypt is to learn how the "other half" lives. It makes you appreciate your own country much more.


-Paul

I think we often think that the majority of the developed world lives with the same basic tranquility and peace as we do. You tend to appreciate things more once you don't have them any longer.

 

[mommyceratops]

I think we often think that the majority of the developed world lives with the same basic tranquility and peace as we do. You tend to appreciate things more once you don't have them any longer.

Just reading the post makes me appreciate and feel how lucky we do have it here.

I remember going to some poorer countries when I was younger and it stays with you. I always tell my boys they don't know how good they have it.

 

[Launchpad11B]

An armed guard makes me feel MORE comfortable about going on the trip, actually.

That's why they give them to you, But it's a false sense of security. I have a bit of experience in security and in the middle east and my opinion is there is no security over there. Perhaps there is from being harassed by merchants or lecherous men, but if someone wants to make a statement by blowing up a group of tourists, an armed guard isn't going to stop them. A group of Americans on a Disney trip in Egypt is a high value, soft target. Loads of international attention and not difficult at all to attack and destroy. The real world is a rough place. The historic sites are very tempting to visit and I wish I could see them some day. The current political climate is going to have to settle a bit before my family even considers it. To each his own. If folks want to do the Egypt ABD trip then more power to them. You can get halfway decent reports on current events from the state department. I would suggest gathering all the info you can before traveling anywhere in that part of the world. Just my two cents.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

That's why they give them to you, But it's a false sense of security. I have a bit of experience in security and in the middle east and my opinion is there is no security over there. Perhaps there is from being harassed by merchants or lecherous men, but if someone wants to make a statement by blowing up a group of tourists, an armed guard isn't going to stop them. A group of Americans on a Disney trip in Egypt is a high value, soft target. Loads of international attention and not difficult at all to attack and destroy. The real world is a rough place. The historic sites are very tempting to visit and I wish I could see them some day. The current political climate is going to have to settle a bit before my family even considers it. To each his own. If folks want to do the Egypt ABD trip then more power to them. You can get halfway decent reports on current events from the state department. I would suggest gathering all the info you can before traveling anywhere in that part of the world. Just my two cents.

No offense, but I really, very much highly doubt that Disney would send anyone to a country that wasn't safe. There isn't enough insurance int he world that would be able to cover it.

 

[jeanigor]

No offense, but I really, very much highly doubt that Disney would send anyone to a country that wasn't safe. There isn't enough insurance int he world that would be able to cover it.

I respectfully disagree. The political climate in Egypt has been volatile since 1967, if not before. People whom have their heads set on making a statement via an act of terrorism will.
It has happened at Sharm el-Sheikh. Its happened in Paris. In Tokyo. In London.

 

[maroo]

That's why they give them to you, But it's a false sense of security. I have a bit of experience in security and in the middle east and my opinion is there is no security over there. Perhaps there is from being harassed by merchants or lecherous men, but if someone wants to make a statement by blowing up a group of tourists, an armed guard isn't going to stop them. A group of Americans on a Disney trip in Egypt is a high value, soft target. Loads of international attention and not difficult at all to attack and destroy. The real world is a rough place. The historic sites are very tempting to visit and I wish I could see them some day. The current political climate is going to have to settle a bit before my family even considers it. To each his own. If folks want to do the Egypt ABD trip then more power to them. You can get halfway decent reports on current events from the state department. I would suggest gathering all the info you can before traveling anywhere in that part of the world. Just my two cents.

And it is a very experienced 2 cents. I will listen to you and stay home.

 

[Launchpad11B]

No offense, but I really, very much highly doubt that Disney would send anyone to a country that wasn't safe. There isn't enough insurance int he world that would be able to cover it.

No offense taken. Like I said, it's just my opinion formed from having spent quite a bit of time there. That being said, if you think the middle east is safe because Disney says so, I would recommend a bit of research.

 

[wishspirit]

I think Paul has it about on the button, too scary for my blood!

Plus everyone I know who's gone to Egypt (even just to sit on a beach) has ended up getting a stomach bug/ food poisoning. To me, that just doesn't appeal!

The main thing is that we just aren't exposed to the same bacteria here as in a lot of other countries, and it can cause a lot of problems especially for soft stomached western tourists. The main thing is money, as it is where a lot of germs congregate. I've heard it suggested that you should wash you hands thoroughly after every time you touch money, especially in a hot country with different standards of hygiene.