Jon and Kate Plus 8, Official Thread-Part 3

[Mermaid02]

And if he was abusive to her would that be her fault too? She is aggressive and he is passive aggressive.... believe me, he gives as good as he gets- he's just sneakier about it.

 

[3prettyprincesses]

After reading the comments it seems like I am watching a totally different show than some of you.

First off, Jon looked very sad and disconnected in the interview chair. It is very obvious that he gained a significant amount of weight. His eyes looked puffy and swollen and he just sounded sad. I really felt bad for him. He quit his job so that Kate could go on speaking engagements and book signings. As a SAHM I know where he is coming from when he said "the grass is always greener I guess." It was a very hard adjustment for me when I started staying at home with my DD, but at least I had my husband to lean on, he had no one as Kate was on the road for an average of 20+ days a month.

Kate IMHO seemed arrogant in the chair at the beginning. Her comments about Jon did not need to be said, yet she just can't help herself. She also brings fear to her kids by telling them that the paparazzi are chasing them and then when they got in Party City "okay, we're safe now". Way to give them anxiety. And I agree with the poster that said Joel said "What are paparazzi?" I'm sure they now know that what they are since their Mom brings it up to them.

If they have been having problems for 6 months and about 6 months ago Kate started traveling the country, then stop traveling and see if things change. IMHO she is done and he is done. She may want to work it out for the cameras, but I believe that Jon is being honest about the situation.

What amazes me is that everyone always says "don't believe the magazines, only believe them" so when Jon says he didn't cheat, shouldn't you believe him? Those same magazines say that Kate cheated as well, so which is it? Believe them or not?

To say that the kids are sheltered and have no idea is living in a fairy tale world. They may not know the words for it, but they can feel the anxiety of the situation, know that when Mommy is around Daddy isn't and vice versa.

As for Jon not being around during the party, well maybe he already had a party for them on their real birthday while Kate was tanning and running errands? Maybe he didn't want to have a big elaborate party to begin with since they were having personal issues? It also amazes me that people say "She needs a break, she has 8 kids, EIGHT!" but now that Jon is the primary child care person, he doesn't deserve a break? This was the first time she was home in several days (weeks) and he doesn't deserve a break or alone time? Double standard much?

And you can't tell me that when Kate gets home she dismisses the help. Who fixed the children's hair for the party? We know Kate can't do those styles (she has said so herself in the past). But yet she was doing it ALL ALONE. Baloney.

I'm putting on my flame retardent suit now.

Welcome back!

Yup, we are on the same page. What I think is very interesting too is that Kevin & Jodi said that Jon came to them 6 months ago and said Kate told him it's over, she's done. This fits the timeline Kate referred to last night when she said she's been dealing with this for 6 months. If we believe Kevin & Jodi, then Kate played the victim really well last night. That's probably why Jon looked like he had checked out of the relationship because Kate had told him months ago she was done.

It was disturbing to watch last night though, wasn't it? Did you see the part where Alexis hugs him at the party and says she loves him? He looked about ready to cry when he hugged her back and asked if she missed him. She then said, Daddy I don't want you to leave again. How awful for those little ones. It's a royal mess.

 

[OhMari]

I was watching E last nite and they are doing a time-line show on Friday evening, about Jon and Kate.
Right away I thought of Madge-you could have done one of these 2 weeks ago, and had the timeline correct.

http://www.eonline.com/uberblog/b125357_celebrity_addictionary_there_oughta_be.html


When Kate was putting the Gift boxes together and saying she was exhausted and tired?
Remember many, many pages back, I commented, and said, I wonder how she deals with jet lag?
She was on the Today show, Thursday, did something Friday and flew to Arkansa to talk to the Walmart big wigs.
She probably got about 3 hours of sleep and woke up and took the kids to the store-this was Saturday and Sunday was their birthday.


One more thing,
Didn't Jon and Kate limit the amount of television the kids could watch?
When Kate was ready to leave to the store, she had Collin go get the girls,
and they were ready, but they were all watching tv.

 

[sandramaac]

I'm new to this thread - hi everyone! Here's my take on last night's episode.

As much as so many people can't stand Kate is how much I can't stand Jon. He is the worst kind of man to marry - lazy, un-motivated, passive agressive and immature. What kind of man in his 30s starts leaving his kids at home to hang out with college kids? And he just bought a sports car.

As the wife of a man in his 30s, I know for a fact that my husband would never want to hang out with college kids - he is completely past that phase in his life. What does it say about Jon that he isn't? It's like he just decided one day that he was sick of his life and shut down. If you are unhappy with your life make some positive changes - get marriage counseling or even file for divorce - don't start partying and have an affair with a 23 year old. And I just loved his whining about how he gave up his job last night - give me a break - if he wanted to work he would have a job. They admitted to having nannies last night - he does not "need" to be home with the kids, especially now that they are all school aged. He is definitely not a true SAH-parent - neither of them are. Those kids have been cared for by nannies for a long time.

Kate is a very strong woman and someone like that needs someone equally as strong to keep the relationship balanced with mutual respect. I think Kate just doesn't respect Jon which is why she treats him the way she does.

I really think they just bring out the worst in each other and I'm not sure the relationship can be saved.

I do agree with a good bit of what you have said here too. I am not a fan of Kate at all. She is manipulative, narcissistic and arrogant. However, Jon does seem to be very immature. In one of the promo's he does said he had twins at what 23 and 8 kids total by 28. And he has always said he was fine with
2, but the tups really sent him into shock. If you are not mature enough to handle this, this is the outcome. I do think Kate wanted more kids, badgered until she got what she wanted, without any regard or fore thought that perhaps her husband was not mature enough to handle it.

The bottom line is that these kids are going to be a mess in years to come. This families 15 minutes of fame will be over soon. The family will be broken up, the money and freebies will be gone---and who is going to be there to pick up the pieces. It is one of the saddest media events of have ever seen. Everyone involved, the press, TLC and Jon and Kate should be very proud about the horror they have caused thier kids. It's shameful!!!!

 

[Luv2trav]

I see these two as no different as celebrity actors/actresses etc.. The blame game is too much. Jon needs to seriously grow up. He looks like a man who has been out drinking and partying too much. The sports car is ridiculous. The whoa as me attitude is sickening. "Oh I quit my job" "I stay home while she travels" Sounds to me like a very jealous bitter man. She told him to go back to work or school to make himself happier. He is just not happy in his situation. That is not an excuse to cheat. As for Kate she's let the show go to her head WAY too much. Perhaps she has taken it too far and perhaps she is a little abrasive. However she is the one who is holding that family together. Yes the show is a job but she is sees that she will have to provide for the family alone and I do not fault her for that. A nurse's salary for 8 children alone isn't going to cut it..

 

[DreaGirl]

Welcome back!

Yup, we are on the same page. What I think is very interesting too is that Kevin & Jodi said that Jon came to them 6 months ago and said Kate told him it's over, she's done. This fits the timeline Kate referred to last night when she said she's been dealing with this for 6 months. If we believe Kevin & Jodi, then Kate played the victim really well last night. That's probably why Jon looked like he had checked out of the relationship because Kate had told him months ago she was done.

It was disturbing to watch last night though, wasn't it? Did you see the part where Alexis hugs him at the party and says she loves him? He looked about ready to cry when he hugged her back and asked if she missed him. She then said, Daddy I don't want you to leave again. How awful for those little ones. It's a royal mess.

Thanks! We had a great trip!

I forgot all about Jodi and Kevin saying that it was 6 months ago. Makes a lot more sense to me now. Kate is very good at playing the victim or the editors are very good at it. If I didn't know better I would think this season is either a prep for Kate + Eight or J&K go to Therapy. Let's hope it doesn't come to that. Either way, it was a very sad episode last night.

When the little girl (I thought it was Leah, but could have been Alexis) came over it really broke my heart. It made me wonder what Kate says to the kids when Jon gets his alone time. Does she say "Daddy just needs a break? or does she say something much worse.

The kids really are the ones that are suffering.

 

[MICKEY4EVER!]

Oooh, I so agree with this. I don't understand why women are so mean to each other instead of building them up!

So many people have talked about Kate's tummy tuck but no mention is made of Jon's hair plugs.

And truly as a Mom of two, if someone offered me a free tummy tuck, I would jump on it!

I've been wanting to comment on Jon's hair plugs. Did they not take? He has a VERY noticeable bald spot when he bends over now. I noticed it in last night's premier. It doesn't matter to me either way, but it was something I noticed.

Oh, that show last night was so sad. Kate crying made me want to cry. It's the first real sign of emotion I've seen from her other than anger or irritation. Neither she nor Jon said they loved each other either, just the kids.

I haven't gotten a chance yet to catch up with all of your comments. (This thread moves at the speed of Lightning!). I look forward to hearing your opinions...

 

[madge]

some blogs/articles related to last night's show ...

Baltimore Sun

New York Times

Orlando Sentinel

People Magazine

 

[MusiqChic99]

After reading the comments it seems like I am watching a totally different show than some of you.

First off, Jon looked very sad and disconnected in the interview chair. It is very obvious that he gained a significant amount of weight. His eyes looked puffy and swollen and he just sounded sad. I really felt bad for him. He quit his job so that Kate could go on speaking engagements and book signings. As a SAHM I know where he is coming from when he said "the grass is always greener I guess." It was a very hard adjustment for me when I started staying at home with my DD, but at least I had my husband to lean on, he had no one as Kate was on the road for an average of 20+ days a month.

Kate IMHO seemed arrogant in the chair at the beginning. Her comments about Jon did not need to be said, yet she just can't help herself. She also brings fear to her kids by telling them that the paparazzi are chasing them and then when they got in Party City "okay, we're safe now". Way to give them anxiety. And I agree with the poster that said Joel said "What are paparazzi?" I'm sure they now know that what they are since their Mom brings it up to them.

If they have been having problems for 6 months and about 6 months ago Kate started traveling the country, then stop traveling and see if things change. IMHO she is done and he is done. She may want to work it out for the cameras, but I believe that Jon is being honest about the situation.

What amazes me is that everyone always says "don't believe the magazines, only believe them" so when Jon says he didn't cheat, shouldn't you believe him? Those same magazines say that Kate cheated as well, so which is it? Believe them or not?

To say that the kids are sheltered and have no idea is living in a fairy tale world. They may not know the words for it, but they can feel the anxiety of the situation, know that when Mommy is around Daddy isn't and vice versa.

As for Jon not being around during the party, well maybe he already had a party for them on their real birthday while Kate was tanning and running errands? Maybe he didn't want to have a big elaborate party to begin with since they were having personal issues? It also amazes me that people say "She needs a break, she has 8 kids, EIGHT!" but now that Jon is the primary child care person, he doesn't deserve a break? This was the first time she was home in several days (weeks) and he doesn't deserve a break or alone time? Double standard much?

And you can't tell me that when Kate gets home she dismisses the help. Who fixed the children's hair for the party? We know Kate can't do those styles (she has said so herself in the past). But yet she was doing it ALL ALONE. Baloney.

I'm putting on my flame retardent suit now.

I watched what you watched. I thought Jon looked "beat up". He definitely looked pretty rough and I think that speaks volumes. If he looked happy then I would have been worried. This at least shows that he is effected by everything ...just like Kate proclaimed she was....I was happy she cried too. It brought her down a few notches.

I bolded the best part of your post. I think people don't give kids credit. They are smarter then that! Like you said, they know that mommy and daddy don't do things together anymore. I hope Kate watches what she says about Jon in front of them. That worries me because I know her mouth can be wild sometimes.

Jon not being there to plan the party....it doesn't look like he's around much right now anyway so why would he be there to plan it. How do we know if Kate didn't want him there to help?? We really don't know. I mean you could see the tension at the party between them. It didn't look like they were too into being anywhere near each other. Even on the couch together...neither seemed like they wanted to be there.

And for the record...I dont think either one of them cheated. I think they both made bad choices ...her with being away too much and him with his party nights on the town.

I can't imagine how this season will play out now after last night. I mean everyone will think any type of family outing will be fake. Everyone will be picking at everything Jon and Kate do on that show. It will become all about their marriage and not about the kids...even if TLC doesnt set it up like that. That's why people will be watching now.

 

[ThunderMTexpert]

For 2 people who were firm in the fact that "they weren;t going to bring their personal problems into the show," last night's one-on-one interviews were like a train wreck- i couldn't help but watch! I found myself not too much interested in the show, but to see "up next," with Jon & Kate, when they got interviewed!

It is so sad to see the places they are in now- can't even look at each other, showing up separately to their childrens' birthday party.. Alexis, or was it Leah that said something ahbout Jon being away all the time?

Divorce is divorce. It happens, and by the end of this episode, it seemed like the two of them weren't just considering the idea, but they were fixated on it.

I DO believe, though, that the media attention and photogs-- Jon & Kate may have 40% brought that upon themselves. I would love to say more of a percentage, but I don't want to be blasted! I believe every person deserves their right to privacy; however, if you're on t.v., you're asking for the attention! While I do believe the media obsession might be part of what drove J & K apart, it clearly isn't the only thing that did.

Neither of them HAVE to be SAH- Parents, Jon could easily go get a job. The horrible thought crossed my mind that he might be just saying he is there for his kids, over & over, almost to justify his actions. (i.e. no matter how bad the media portrays me, I will always be there for my kids. Welllll, where were you during set up of the party?? Where were you when Kate was trying to get some things organized? Rounding up kids for shopping, cake cutting, etc?

Kate isn't getting off scott-free-- everyone knows the drama & drill sergant attitude she brings to the table, but hey, think about it: if you had to maintain the responsibilities for 8 children, would you be a little frustrated? & If a camera was constantly in your home all day long, would you be a slight bit tense? & If your partner was being lazy, acting childish, and undermining some of your decisions, wouldn't you tend to snap someone's head off?

Hopefully, for those 8 children, things can be worked out in a semi-friendly manner. I suspect a divorce is forthcoming..

No one blast me, ok?

 

[Luv2trav]

One thing that did amaze me was that the show was editing and completed in less than 2 week for it's premiere. Didn't that birthday party just happen last week? I know because we have the same weather here in Ohio. Are the new shows always within 2 weeks of actual taping?

 

[KristiMc]

Everyone keeps saying that Jon has "checked out". I think Kate has also. She didn't say that she wants to work on the marriage - all she said is that she is here for her kids.

Jon did say in the last season finale that he was done with this and it sounded that he would be happy if the show ended - she said that she loves what she does and it sounded like she had no intentions of ending the show.

I'm not a Jon supporter - I don't support the cheating - if he did. I also don't support Kate either. She really seems like she is in this all for the wrong reasons anymore. At first it was about recording their life for the kids sake so they would have videos. I can't honestly think that what was shown last night was what they would want their kids to see.

 

[DreaGirl]

I see these two as no different as celebrity actors/actresses etc.. The blame game is too much. Jon needs to seriously grow up. He looks like a man who has been out drinking and partying too much. The sports car is ridiculous. The whoa as me attitude is sickening. "Oh I quit my job" "I stay home while she travels" Sounds to me like a very jealous bitter man. She told him to go back to work or school to make himself happier. He is just not happy in his situation. That is not an excuse to cheat. As for Kate she's let the show go to her head WAY too much. Perhaps she has taken it too far and perhaps she is a little abrasive. However she is the one who is holding that family together. Yes the show is a job but she is sees that she will have to provide for the family alone and I do not fault her for that. A nurse's salary for 8 children alone isn't going to cut it..

If Jon is the SAHP, then when would he have time to go back to school? Just wondering, because as a SAHM, I don't see myself having time until the kids are in school full time, 5 days a week.

How can Kate hold the family together when she is gone 5 days a week? By phone calls? Just wondering what you meant by that?

When Jon was explaining his situation, I didn't see it as a whoa is me story. Kate has been all over People magazine telling her side, while Jon has kept quiet. He was getting his side out there. He even said last night "This is something private between me and Kate" while Kate just kept talking about all of their personal problems to the world.

 

[mickey&minnie04]

Funny how she talked about how Jon has help, but mentioned how she had to shop with the kids ALL BY HERSELF. Watching the reruns I noticed how she begged out of a family outing in favor of her own comfort -- she was too sick on the skiing trip to help Jon with the kids, or to go skiing, but she was well enough to go to the spa. She seems to make a habit of out it. Sorry, but if I was Jon I would have cheated on the wench a long time ago. I give him all the props in the world for dealing with her as long as he has. Their marriage obviously doesn't mean anything to her, so why should it matter to him?

I'm sorry but NOTHING makes cheating ok! If you are unhappy then get out!

 

[newtodis]

Ok I think I'm caught up for the moment. I tried to make a brief list as I was going through everything.

*"phases" - Just because your DH or DW or whoever might be past a "phase" in their life doesn't mean everyone will be! Jon was very young when he had a LOT of kids. I was 20 when I got pregnant with our first son and sometimes miss being able to be a "kid" and go out and have a good time spending money on "me" and doing whatever. Would I change it? Not for a second - I love my kids more than anything. I'm just saying that he's got the money to "relive" that "phase" so why not (so long as you're not hurting anyone in the process!)?

*define cheat - I think Jon and Kate need to share their definition of "cheat". That would help clear a lot of things up IMO. If one (or both) are checked out of the marriage, they wouldn't view it as cheating or think it's as "bad" as if they were married and still 100% committed to each other.

*editing - this was already touched on a little bit but things were heavliy edited last night. How do we know Kate didn't run up and give Jon a huge hug when he got there and when we saw her walk past him to get her coat from the van she was just on a mission because she was cold? I'm not saying that happened but it's hard to know what was said before/after and sometimes during the events ("scenes") to get a complete picture.

*GMA - The Gosselins were discussed on GMA again this morning: http://abcnews.go.com/gma It was the 4th link on the right if anyone wanted to check it out.

*yelling - you'd better believe I yell at my DH during a birthday party or any other time - especially if I'm frustrated or already shared my "plan" and he's not doing it "my" way. (go ahead and call me Kate - I'm ok with that!) Do I constantly scream at him? No. Does he yell at me? Yes.

*helping with party stuff - I can't recall the last party DH helped with. He and DS4 share a birthday so it's always extra work for me to do something special with our family, extended family and now, for the past couple of years, a "friends" party for DS4. For DS4's 1st birthday, DH stepped on a level and had to go to the ER (his mom took him - I had a party to get ready for!) and get stiches in his foot because he waited to hang a shelf until that morning. For DS4's second birthday and fell and twisted his ankle or something (noticing a theme???). Yup, every year he's gotten hurt. My DH managed to BREAK HIS FINGER putting on a pair of shoes on his way to my work Christmas party one year....lovely. So, it's far easier for me to just do it and get it done.

*splitting episodes - I was all for that too. Do you think it wasn't done because they now have to find another night to air the CCC (charm City Cakes) one and keep on track with the 100th Emeril one?? Maybe it could have been arranged and edited differently but I'm thinking now they might have had to try and keep it mixed together and one episode.

*party bags - yes I'm not a fan of them either but my DS4 will be handing them out at his party. I try really hard to make sure it's not just junk that's going to get thrown out. We also always invite the siblings of those invited to make sure there are no hurt feelings - I know that's not easy to deal with.

I'm sure there's more but I've forgotten it.....

 

[DMRick]

The only time I've heard Jon like whichever job he was at for the moment, was when he said he would rather go to work, than be home with all the kids (it was veyr noisy in his house that day), in one of the episodes.

When he first left his job, he said he was glad to do it. Now, because it's convenient, wah wah, I didn't want to stay home. They made me.
If he didn't want to, then he should have said so, and kept working. I personally think he wants it both ways. If not, if he was interested in stopping the show, then that was not the time to buy a bigger house (Kate thought it would make him happier) or a sports car.

Didn't I see on one of the interviews that Jon went around Europe backpacking before they were married and didn't work for a bit? I know he has had a few jobs, and although I don't know for sure that his old boss is telling the truth, the old boss did say Jon lied about why he was let go. That it wasn't that Jon quit because they didn't want to insure all the babies, but that he was fired because instead of working, he was always on the computer, trying to find goodies they might be able to get because of the babies. Didn't he also lose the job he had just before he worked with Kate brother? And wasn't it said once, that that wasn't working out?

Surely Jon didn't expect that Kate would have a book, and the publisher wouldn't expect her to go out to book signings, etc. I think he just found that it was harder than he thought, and perhaps he didn't expect he would actually have to work being the sahd when Kate was away. I also think that if this has been going on for months, that that might have played into why Kate was away so much. She did say last night that he wanted her away, and so she was. I don't think that means that she didn't see her children for 20 days in a row. I think it meant that she was off working, selling the book (and making public appearances, when pushing the actual show), and thought her husband, the kids father was, at this time, the person home full time with the kids.

I also think there is plenty of fault to go around, just like in any marriage breakup. I think this breakup was long in the making.

 

[madge]

One thing that did amaze me was that the show was editing and completed in less than 2 week for it's premiere. Didn't that birthday party just happen last week? I know because we have the same weather here in Ohio. Are the new shows always within 2 weeks of actual taping?

no. they were filming episodes for this season back in March.

 

[Mermaid02]

I personally find it revolting that Kevin and Jodi have thrown in their 2 cents.... talk about attention seeking.... sit, back, shut up and be there for your nieces and nephews-throwing Mom or Dad under the bus isn't good for those children.

 

[mickey&minnie04]

Hello, Kate wake up stop paying a babysitter to raise your kids and raise them your self!!!!!!!!!!

I'm sure Kate sees her kids more then you think........at least her kids aren't shipped to a daycare for 8-10 hours a day. Not that there is anything wrong with that, because lets face it sometimes there is no other way and you have to support your family. I just think that Kate is getting bashed for no reason here. Yes, she is controlling and a bit harsh, but it seems that has been their dynamic from the beginning. This show was something that they both started and has been able to give them a life of comfort. Most parents would LOVE to quit their jobs and stay home with the kids and Jon seems to resent it! I'm sure he loves his kids, but he doesn't seem to want to be there 24/7. I went into this episode totally thinking that I would feel sorry for Jon and was surprised that I feel sorry for Kate. I saw a side of her that she never shows, it really is sad.

 

[SharpMomOfTwo]

I haven't been a big watcher of this show, but I did watch some of the marathon this past weekend, and just had to watch the show last night. I also haven't read through all of your posts, so forgive me if I'm just re-saying what everyone else has said.

I thought it was a very sad episode last night - sad but telling, and with all their candid truthfullness, they have acutally gained some respect. As far as Kate - she is still blaming everyone else - nothing is ever her fault, and she always makes sure to point out Jons faults at every opportunity. She says very easily how Jon has made his mistakes, and that they all have to deal with that. But when it comes to her, she doesn't understand why anyone would say anything bad about her, because shes just doing her job, and nothing else. Maybe its true, I don't live with them, but it just seemed to be very telling how she was pointing a finger at Jon, saying that he makes mistakes, and never once put herself at fault. Nothing is ever once sided.
She also brought up the "D" word - divorce - when I don't think Jon said it even once. She even went as far as to say that she thinks that the family picture at the birthday party would probably be their last..... thats sad. And if it was their last family picture ever, why did she have to act that way durring it? Be nice for once - just chill - so what if Jon had his sunglasses on - he treats him like hes one of the kids, but worse!
Lastly, when they were together in the interview chair, and the producer or whoever asked what was next for them, Kate was saying that she can't speak for anyone else (meaning Jon), but that shes still here - and Jon turns around and says that hes just there for the kids..... it seemed as if she was trying to say that she was there for him as well as the kids - and he shot that down pretty quickly - thats just the way I took it.

I don't know if Jon had the affair, but in all truthfullness - can you blame him?? I mean, yes, he knew what he was getting into when he married her, he knew that she was the OCD crazy lady, who never says anything positive without saying something negative, but then having 8 kids, I'm sure that her OCD got even worse than he could even imagin, and I'm sure its very hard for him to deal with. I grew up with parents like this - can't say anything nice, always negative - its very hard and very damaging to someone who has to hear that all the time. And the fact that he needed a weekend alone - so what?? I only have two kids, and I'd take a weekend off if it were offered to me!! Everyone needs a break, every once in a while - maybe he didn't take it at the best time (ie the kids birthday party coming up), but you can't control everything. Well, thats about all I can think of right now - As I said, I've never been a watcher of this show, but I think I may this season.