The Sean incident on the show today.

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A few things:

1) The First Amendment protects people to be able to video and photograph anything from a public location. When on private property, such as Disney, however, the owner or the owner’s agents (CM’s) can ask/demand you not to do so, and if the warning is ignored, the offender can be trespassed from the property forever.

2) I don’t agree with any sentiment that Christmas Eve provides any nuance to this situation. As long as Disney chooses to have the show, the show should be treated like any other show. Many businesses close early on Christmas Eve as a way to give their employees the opportunity to be with their families. Disney does not. So it should live with its policy. You can’t have your cake (the show) and eat it too (rush everybody out the door).

3) I don’t even see the point of all this unrest. What’s the end goal? An apology? I find that, in a lot of these types of cases, the two opposing parties don’t even know what they’re fighting over. It’s just two sides giving each other the middle finger.
The First Amendment to the Constitution prevents the government from making laws restricting the press, free speech, peaceable assembly, religion or the right to petition the government for redress of grievances.

“Congress shall make no law ...”.

First Amendment constraints do not apply to a private entity.
The First Amendment prohibits only governmental not private abridgment of rights. See Denver Area Ed. Telecommunications Consortium, Inc. v. FCC, 518 U.S. 727, 737. Also, see Manhattan Community Access Corp. et al. v. Halleck et al., 587 U.S. 17-1702 (2019).
 
The First Amendment to the Constitution prevents the government from making laws restricting the press, free speech, peaceable assembly, religion or the right to petition the government for redress of grievances.

“Congress shall make no law ...”.

First Amendment constraints do not apply to a private entity.
The First Amendment prohibits only governmental not private abridgment of rights. See Denver Area Ed. Telecommunications Consortium, Inc. v. FCC, 518 U.S. 727, 737. Also, see Manhattan Community Access Corp. et al. v. Halleck et al., 587 U.S. 17-1702 (2019).
That’s exactly what I said.
 
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A few things:

1) The First Amendment protects people to be able to video and photograph anything from a public location. When on private property, such as Disney, however, the owner or the owner’s agents (CM’s) can ask/demand you not to do so, and if the warning is ignored, the offender can be trespassed from the property forever.

2) I don’t agree with any sentiment that Christmas Eve provides any nuance to this situation. As long as Disney chooses to have the show, the show should be treated like any other show. Many businesses close early on Christmas Eve as a way to give their employees the opportunity to be with their families. Disney does not. So it should live with its policy. You can’t have your cake (the show) and eat it too (rush everybody out the door).

3) I don’t even see the point of all this unrest. What’s the end goal? An apology? I find that, in a lot of these types of cases, the two opposing parties don’t even know what they’re fighting over. It’s just two sides giving each other the middle finger.
Yes, agreed about Christmas Eve, if they wanted people rushed out, they should have let that be known before the show started, with an announcement that they wouldn't be doing photos that night, or a note on the door, etc. I know lots of stores and businesses close for their workers to get home, but like you said. They can't have their cake and eat it too without it causing problems (which, it did).

I think the end goal SHOULD be that the Security at Fort Wilderness change. I am reading over and over again that this happens there (multiple people in this post have mentioned that it has happened there and not just at HDD). There is no reason for it to have escalated like it did, even with Sean getting upset. There were many working there that night who at the very least need to be retrained, I think even fired for their behaviour. Especially when Pete mentioned that it has happened many times in the past at HDD. At the very least, Sean did get the apology, but he should NOT have had to contact multiple people and go up levels of management to get that apology either. Also, the Security Guards should be held accountable for how they are just protecting themselves at the expense of how they are treating people. That (to me) would be what the end goad should be.
 
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I have had a similar experience with Hoop Dee Doo staff. The whole team there is flawed and a great example of where things are going. I hope that they hear what people are saying and make true steps to fix whats happening. The power is with us, and we need to make our voices heard.
 
The fact that this incident happened after the HDD to me is irrelevant. I wouldn't boycott that show, Fort Wilderness in general, or any other part of WDW simply based on the interaction with this security guard and superiors.

I completely agree with you, Jeff! HDD and FW are both great experiences and we shouldn't let a poor interaction with security staff get in the way of enjoying our well earned vacations with family. However, what I can say... is for members of this board to continue to remain hyper-vigilant while on vacation to ensure that what happened to Sean does not transpire again. And to the degree you experience lackluster cast members, report them immediately to management and tweet @WDWToday... The only way for Disney to return to its core values is with our assistance... as with any large conglomerate... management remains blind of bad seeds until something like this occurs!
 
I have had a similar experience with Hoop Dee Doo staff. The whole team there is flawed and a great example of where things are going. I hope that they hear what people are saying and make true steps to fix whats happening. The power is with us, and we need to make our voices heard.

Wow ...are we sure this isn't just "Wild West" humor being used? I mean, if it was real ...they would have just grabbed Sean by his belt buckle and tossed him out the swinging saloon doors -right?
 


What really upset me about this whole thing was not only was Sean's family needlessly pushed into this uncomfortable situation on Christmas Eve of all nights, but mostly because it was their first Christmas Eve without his dad. I lost my dad in 2018 and that first Christmas was so hard to do without him. Here they were trying to find some joy after the sadness of loss and keep their loved one in their hearts, and even said that to the guards, and still that happened with very little compassion. My heart really went out to them. I probably would have been in tears.
 
What really upset me about this whole thing was not only was Sean's family needlessly pushed into this uncomfortable situation on Christmas Eve of all nights, but mostly because it was their first Christmas Eve without his dad. I lost my dad in 2018 and that first Christmas was so hard to do without him. Here they were trying to find some joy after the sadness of loss and keep their loved one in their hearts, and even said that to the guards, and still that happened with very little compassion. My heart really went out to them. I probably would have been in tears.
@iWouldRatherBeAtDisney - I know it's been awhile, but may I express my condolences on the loss of you Dad. Especially since we just passed 2019's "holidays times", which I know are always unusually hard after a loss.
 
After listening to the story, the security at this event sound just like a many small (and some large) town police forces. Under trained, chip on shoulder, dishonest, power crazy, and cover for each other when they're wrong.

You can look up YouTube videos (search cop watch as a start) and dozens of videos will crop up. Every security guard/manager responding at the event should be fired. There's just no excuse for it.
 
Wow ...are we sure this isn't just "Wild West" humor being used? I mean, if it was real ...they would have just grabbed Sean by his belt buckle and tossed him out the swinging saloon doors -right?
What's "Wild West" about the guard lying about Sean taking a beer outside the restaurant?
 
This whole thing is just so odd and doesn't make sense.
I was just at Hoop Dee Doo a couple of nights ago.

First off--if Sixpence Sean's brother? I was trying to figure out which one of the guys was his brother. There was a resemblance.
Anyway, the end of the show is so loud and chaotic. It's crazy to me that "security" even approached Sean about such a ridiculous non-infraction. There are hundreds of people moving around, it's loud and people are talking and laughing.

For some reason, they pegged Sean and it was on. It escalated and became so out of hand and ridiculous.
I'm sorry to hear this happened especially since he was with his family and it was a holiday. It was all so unnecessary and left a bad taste in everyone's mouth for the night.

Boo to Disney for the way this went down.
 
Anyway, the end of the show is so loud and chaotic. It's crazy to me that "security" even approached Sean about such a ridiculous non-infraction. There are hundreds of people moving around, it's loud and people are talking and laughing.
We were there last month and I was thinking the same thing. Actually, we go to Hoop Dee Doo annually and I can't think of a time that I've ever interacted with a security guard there, though I have seen them. I have a feeling that Sean's table must have been the absolute last table sitting there as every one cleared out, but we have a person in our group with mobility issues and we always wait until everyone else has exited before leaving. We also don't sit there hanging out either. Not that any of this excuses the security guard's terrible handling of the situation.
 
I personally don't agree with the idea that security guards at Disney need to be nice. It's not their job to be nice. It's their job to keep guests safe.

But then I also think about the cops here in NYC, particularly the ones in Times Square, where part of the job is extensive public interaction and outreach, usually with tourists. I guess I can understand the idea of expecting a similar level of friendliness from Bag Check CMs.

I understand your point but I think if you work security at Disney there is, or at least should be, an expectation of conducting yourself in line with the company values, ie customer service, the "Disney Magic" etc. Sure, courtesy gets thrown out the window when there's a public safety issue that needs to get addressed right away but there was nothing in this scenario that even remotely qualifies as that and I honestly can't think of too many situations at WDW where that would be the case.

Everything done by security was wrong and stupid in every sense of the word and i think everyone else has hit those points already. They are all quite frankly a huge liability for Disney. There's no possible way that demanding a guest's phone is within Disney's policy and something like that has lawsuit written all over it.

Burn out from extensive public contact is a real and normal thing so I agree with you that i can understand a stoic CM at bag check. A "not nice" security CM at bag check may also be a deliberate placement as it establishes an aggressive security posture. But I think a "not nice" security CM can still be polite and professional.

But just to be clear, I don't think that the security CM that Sean dealt with was burnt out, i think he was just an *******
 
As a foreign guest this would of been quiet scary. I think Disney security spend a lot of time interacting with international guest who know their rights even less and I have no doubt some of these security guards exploit this. A similar situation in the UK I would of stood up to the security guard, in the states I would feel under far more pressure to comply to these unreasonable demands and where this might escalate. i won’t be rushing to book for this show.
 
After hearing this I’m done with Hoop-Dee-Doo and probably FW in general if this is the managerial culture they’ve adopted. Never really was a huge fan in the first place but I always enjoyed the food.

You do realize that this has nothing to do with the show right? And, if Sean's brother is still there and people stop going to HDDR then that is a way for him to lose income. This is mainly an issue with the first security officer by being rude, aggressive, disrespectful, and lying to his superior. This has ZERO to do with the show or food.
 
So sorry to hear of Sean’s bad experience. I have cancelled a reservation next month for an 8:30 performance at Hoop. This was to celebrate my Daughter’s birthday. Will find another restaurant off property to celebrate. We do have other reservations on property, but I will be scaling those back also. I’m really tired of lack of customer service and over priced dining options. The Orlando area has very diverse and wonderful dining options to choose from. Time To Explore!
You do realize that this has nothing to do with the show right? And, if Sean's brother is still there and people stop going to HDDR then that is a way for him to lose income. This is mainly an issue with the first security officer by being rude, aggressive, disrespectful, and lying to his superior. This has ZERO to do with the show or food. But, you are correct in saying dining off property would be much less expensive.
 
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