"specialty" us sailings under return to sailing

[Starwind]

I realize the answers to these are all not known, but worthy of things to think about...

The Transatlantic and PC crossings are one-offs, in that they can't really practically do a "test cruise" before the "real" cruise as they'll already be in their destination.

Do cruise ships get a discount on the Panama Canal fees if they are sailing through with crew only ? Is the bulk of the fee just based on "ship of X size" ?

For itineraries like Alaska... would they have to turn the first sailing into the "test" ? How long after the test does it take to get approved for real sailings ? What does that mean for that rest of the sailings... does May become a wash ?

Fortunately there is no Hawaii to worry about until 2022, by which time we should be out of this.

Thoughts ?

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Do cruise ships get a discount on the Panama Canal fees if they are sailing through with crew only ?

Nope!

Is the bulk of the fee just based on "ship of X size" ?

In general, tolls are based on ship size, based on tonnage, but cruise ships pay pay by berths, and I believe it is based on the number of potential passengers, not the number of actual passengers (ie. paid on max not actual, so an empty ship doesn't get a discount). Fee as of a couple years ago was $138 per berth.

This is also why when the Wonder came through and people were still hoping for a California-Mexico season, most of us thought that the early transit made that a no - the expense of coming back is nasty.

 

[jdb in AZ]

The Canal also charges extra for ships going through during daylight hours.

 

[otten]

I realize the answers to these are all not known, but worthy of things to think about...

The Transatlantic and PC crossings are one-offs, in that they can't really practically do a "test cruise" before the "real" cruise as they'll already be in their destination.

Do cruise ships get a discount on the Panama Canal fees if they are sailing through with crew only ? Is the bulk of the fee just based on "ship of X size" ?

For itineraries like Alaska... would they have to turn the first sailing into the "test" ? How long after the test does it take to get approved for real sailings ? What does that mean for that rest of the sailings... does May become a wash ?

Fortunately there is no Hawaii to worry about until 2022, by which time we should be out of this.

Thoughts ?

Alaska is probably a non issue to be honest. By the time Canada allows cruise ships again it’ll be because enough people are vaccinated and numbers are down low enough that the CDC guidelines won’t be in effect anyway. Canada’s stance on cruising and travel in general has been much more restrictive that the US

 

[lilsonicfan]

I don't think it's true that it costs the same to take a nearly empty ship through the Panama Canal as a nearly full ship. As I understand it, the PC fees are at least in part paid on the basis of the number of passengers. However, that cost is also borne by the passengers. The port fees and taxes for a PC cruise in 2022 are almost $450 per person. For the EBTA in 2021, they are only $114 per person.

 

[Starwind]

Found an article on PC pricing for passenger ships: https://www.seatrade-cruise.com/new...ority-proposes-higher-tariffs-passenger-ships

Yep, appears to be based on combo of tonnage and maximum passenger capacity. So no passengers won't matter.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Pretty sure the cost is the same based on this, from the Canal authority site:

In 2007, continuing with the price differentiation efforts begun in 2002, the ACP modified its regulations for the admeasurement of vessels and the tolls system of the Panama Canal to more closely align Canal toll charges to the value of the route. In the case of passenger vessels, the ACP assessed tolls based on the maximum passenger capacity in accordance with the International Tonnage Certificate 69, or the vessel’s passenger ship safety certificate; vessels over 30,000 gross tons and whose PC/UMS ÷ maximum passenger capacity ratio is equal to or less than 33 were charged on a per berth basis.

 

[Starwind]

Alaska is probably a non issue to be honest. By the time Canada allows cruise ships again it’ll be because enough people are vaccinated and numbers are down low enough that the CDC guidelines won’t be in effect anyway. Canada’s stance on cruising and travel in general has been much more restrictive that the US

True. The Alaska season, at least involving any Canadian ports, may be a non issue {as not not happening] or a late start for 2021.

Canada is only getting 6 million doses between both Pfizer and Moderna vaccine by end of March, enough for 3 million people [population is nearly 37 million (editedto correct pop # typo)], and will be prioritizing order of vaccination.

Doesn't seem likely they will have managed to have enough vaccinated + more doses arrived & vacinated just a month and a half later to be able to have made enough difference for start of Alaska cruising season in mid-May.

 

[otten]

True. The Alaska season, at least involving any Canadian ports, may be a non issue {as not not happening] or a late start for 2021.

Canada is only getting 6 million doses between both Pfizer and Moderna vaccine by end of March, enough for 3 million people [population is nearly 6 million], and will be prioritizing order of vaccination.

Doesn't seem likely they will have managed to have enough vaccinated + more doses arrived & vacinated just a month and a half later to be able to have made enough difference for start of Alaska cruising season in mid-May.

I live in Canada. Our population is about 37 million. The population of the province of BC, where cruises sail from in around 6 million. Besides that, our government has made it pretty clear that our borders will stay closed and quarantine requirements in place until the pandemic isn’t just under control in Canada but also elsewhere. It isn’t just about our population getting the vaccine.

 

[Starwind]

I live in Canada. Our population is about 37 million. The population of the province of BC, where cruises sail from in around 6 million. Besides that, our government has made it pretty clear that our borders will stay closed and quarantine requirements in place until the pandemic isn’t just under control in Canada but also elsewhere. It isn’t just about our population getting the vaccine.

Sorry, the population # was a typo. I live in Canada too.

And you are quite correct. But the first hurdle for an Alaska season sailing out of Vancouver will be getting it under control and vaccinated in Canada, and that doesn't seem feasible for a May start, just based on when the vaccine will arrive and its # of doses. The other issues become meaningless at that point, though would influence whether a "late start with restrictions" could be possible.

For the general lifitng of borders... I could see in the future [many many months from now] when it does come time to start lifting the border closure, Canada may do it in some kind of selective way, allowing some countries in but still blocking most. And the experiments being done in IIRC Alberta with rpid testing to shorten the quarantine period may be helpful in that regard if successful.

 

[LizzyDragon]

True. The Alaska season, at least involving any Canadian ports, may be a non issue {as not not happening] or a late start for 2021.

Without Canadian ports, there's no Alaska season, unless the PVSA is suspended. I agree that the season, if it happens at all, won't be till late 2021. And since the normal Alaska cruise season ends in September, I'm thinking 2021 will end up being a bust for large cruise ships.