Disney Skyliner (Gondola Transportation System) Read Post 1 Now Open!

[TheMaxRebo]

Do we really believe that "back in the day" (whenever that actually was), DL/WDW projects received every dime of funding that the company could throw at them? There has always been give and take between ideas dreamed up by the creatives and what the bookkeepers were willing to spend.

If you want to judge a finished project as being "cheap", so be it. But the mere fact that Imagineering didn't get 100% of what they originally sought doesn't necessarily make it a lesser product.

Even look at opening day at Disneyland - tons of empty area and Tomorrowland had like one attraction

Lots of films even under Walt got budgets cut. Walt was big at not caring about budgets for things he was really and personally into but lots of other things got cut. Heck for Swiss Family Robinson, Walt wanted to film it on a soundstage.

There just wasn't message boards like this one back then

 

[rteetz]

Do we really believe that "back in the day" (whenever that actually was), DL/WDW projects received every dime of funding that the company could throw at them? There has always been give and take between ideas dreamed up by the creatives and what the bookkeepers were willing to spend.

If you want to judge a finished project as being "cheap", so be it. But the mere fact that Imagineering didn't get 100% of what they originally sought doesn't necessarily make it a lesser product.

I am not saying there weren't budget cuts back in the day but usually the theming wasn't part of the cuts rather entire pieces were cut out. Take Animal Kingdom for example. They didn't skip put on theming but instead cut out Beastly Kingdom.

 

[Flyerjab]

I think the wdwmagic posters including myself are a bit more old school. We like high class theming that Disney is known for. Skimping out on that upsets many of us.

And this is where I disagree with that angle. Something can always be themed more. Even the plans Martin sees that we don’t could be approved upon. At some point you have to decide when enough is enough. And I always choose to hold off until we really see it and experience it first hand. To me, the concept art is high class theming. Just because Martin says they cut back does not mean the version we get is not high class. And remember, the plans from a year a ago might not have been high class enough for some. This is an aesthetics arena with arbitrary lines of demarcation.

Don’t take this as overtly negative towards yourself because I think you do a great job here and I value your opinion. I just appreciate the civility of the boards you moderate here, especially when the wdwmagic boards get a bit unbearable at times.

 

[Roxyfire]

And this is where I disagree with that angle. Something can always be themed more. Even the plans Martin sees that we don’t could be approved upon. At some point you have to decide when enough is enough. And I always choose to hold off until we really see it and experience it first hand. To me, the concept art is high class theming. Just because Martin says they cut back does not mean the version we get is not high class. And remember, the plans from a year a ago might not have been high class enough for some. This is an aesthetics arena with arbitrary lines of demarcation.

Don’t take this as overtly negative towards yourself because I think you do a great job here and I value your opinion. I just appreciate the civility of the boards you moderate here, especially when the wdwmagic boards get a bit unbearable at times.

The few times I've ventured over there, it felt very much like an echo chamber. I get it, a message board is meant for discussion. But sometimes people tend to form their views or respond based on what others say. Eventually, not even Walt Disney (or Roy for that matter) could convince them otherwise. I appreciate those who come over here and distill the useful information so I don't have to wade through the never ending sea of bitterness and negativity.

 

[DISNEYSQUIRRELS]

Please forgive me but I am just not getting it when it comes to this Skyway. In terms of aesthetics, is it going to be all criss-crossed cables everywhere? I am trying to envision it & I don’t see how it could look very pretty. Also, what happens for big families that can’t fit in 1 gondola?

 

[rteetz]

Please forgive me but I am just not getting it when it comes to this Skyway. In terms of aesthetics, is it going to be all criss-crossed cables everywhere? I am trying to envision it & I don’t see how it could look very pretty. Also, what happens for big families that can’t fit in 1 gondola?

Gondolas fit 8-10. That could go down with strollers/wheelchairs/ECVs. There will be cables and towers but nothing that I would think inside the parks. Sort of like monorail beams you see along the roads.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

The few times I've ventured over there, it felt very much like an echo chamber. I get it, a message board is meant for discussion. But sometimes people tend to form their views or respond based on what others say. Eventually, not even Walt Disney (or Roy for that matter) could convince them otherwise. I appreciate those who come over here and distill the useful information so I don't have to wade through the never ending sea of bitterness and negativity.

Now I am picturing them arguing with Walt

Poster: This is not how it would go if Walt was around!!!

Walt: actually I like it, makes sense and should be a good ....

Poster: no, you are wrong!! Don't you see all my exclamation points?!?!?!?!

 

[Roxyfire]

Now I am picturing them arguing with Walt

Poster: This is not how it would go if Walt was around!!!

Walt: actually I like it, makes sense and should be a good ....

Poster: no, you are wrong!! Don't you see all my exclamation points?!?!?!?!

"Fire up the pitchforks!"

 

[jade1]

In terms of aesthetics, is it going to be all criss-crossed cables everywhere?

Kinda agree on the cables, but the flipside I have a feeling riding it will provide some cool views-at least compared to most transport methods there.

 

[DISNEYSQUIRRELS]

Gondolas fit 8-10. That could go down with strollers/wheelchairs/ECVs. There will be cables and towers but nothing that I would think inside the parks. Sort of like monorail beams you see along the roads.

Time will tell, but I haven't been excited about this since it was announced. I picture it to be an eyesore. Cables & towers just don't sound sexy to me.

 

[Q-man]

Gondolas fit 8-10. That could go down with strollers/wheelchairs/ECVs. There will be cables and towers but nothing that I would think inside the parks. Sort of like monorail beams you see along the roads.

Also, they will run < 15 seconds apart.

 

[DBDiz]

I love that they're bringing a new high-volume people mover to WDW. I appreciate that it's a new take on an old concept. The fact that it should be more environmentally friendly than a fleet of buses is promising. The Epcot area of WDW is a perfect testing ground for proof-of-concept and as a pilot for possible expansion to the rest of the property. I think the crux of the whole system is going to be the CBR Changing Station. Namely, how efficiently and quickly you disembark from the AoA/POP or park spurs and the amount of time spent waiting in line waiting to transfer/reboard onto your final destination spur. If they can keep total end to end travel time under 30 minutes, they're golden. But if you end up approaching 45mins to an hour plus because of inefficiency or high volumes going through a central transfer point, you're going to have many guests unhappy with being forced into a new transport method that is far less convenient than the buses it intends to replace.

 

[DanBoris]

guess in the grand scheme of things that doesn't seem like the biggest deal. Much rather they cut a little theming on a turn station than have to cut funding to the Guardians ride or something like that

There was a time when Disney wouldn't have considered skimping on anything.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I love that they're bringing a new high-volume people mover to WDW. I appreciate that it's a new take on an old concept. The fact that it should be more environmentally friendly than a fleet of buses is promising. The Epcot area of WDW is a perfect testing ground for proof-of-concept and as a pilot for possible expansion to the rest of the property. I think the crux of the whole system is going to be the CBR Changing Station. Namely, how efficiently and quickly you disembark from the AoA/POP or park spurs and the amount of time spent waiting in line waiting to transfer/reboard onto your final destination spur. If they can keep total end to end travel time under 30 minutes, they're golden. But if you end up approaching 45mins to an hour plus because of inefficiency or high volumes going through a central transfer point, you're going to have many guests unhappy with being forced into a new transport method that is far less convenient than the buses it intends to replace.

I agree with all of this. I always associate Disney with different forms of transportation so I am glad they are trying something new. I also agree about the key being the transfer station as it is one thing to have a sky ride that connect 2 point - another thing for it to be a full on system

Only thing is I have no idea if we would ever ride it as this will only increase prices for hotels on the system and we already generally stay offsite

 

[TheMaxRebo]

There was a time when Disney wouldn't have considered skimping on anything.

Not true - they would cut things a lot of times - heck if it was up to Walt Swiss Family Robinson would have been shot on a Sound stage

I think prior though they would more likely just cut entire projects (be it Beastly Kingdom when's AK opened or the fact Tomorrowland opened tab disneyland with one attraction) vs doing something but doing it "on the cheap" .... but things always have a budget - just didn't have message boards like this back in the day when people talk over plans and permit filings, etc

 

[DanBoris]

Not true - they would cut things a lot of times - heck if it was up to Walt Swiss Family Robinson would have been shot on a Sound stage

I think prior though they would more likely just cut entire projects (be it Beastly Kingdom when's AK opened or the fact Tomorrowland opened tab disneyland with one attraction) vs doing something but doing it "on the cheap" .... but things always have a budget - just didn't have message boards like this back in the day when people talk over plans and permit filings, etc

That's sort of what I was getting at, if they couldn't do something right, they wouldn't do it at all.

 

[Farro]

Before I wasn't a fan, now I really want to try them!

So, do you think since now the moderate and value resorts have a new transportation option similar to the monorail, will their prices go up? Or stay the same because they are getting rid of the bus option? If the rumors are true that they are changing the pricing model from value, moderate, deluxe to something else, these gondolas may play a part in that.

Selfishly, I'm hoping that prices are now more spread out across the hotels, still giving a good value option - although I suppose they will never lower prices at the deluxe hotels. Polynesian - it's just insanity at this point. We stayed there this year, but I don't think we can afford it again! And we make a good salary.

 

[rteetz]

Before I wasn't a fan, now I really want to try them!

So, do you think since now the moderate and value resorts have a new transportation option similar to the monorail, will their prices go up? Or stay the same because they are getting rid of the bus option? If the rumors are true that they are changing the pricing model from value, moderate, deluxe to something else, these gondolas may play a part in that.

Selfishly, I'm hoping that prices are now more spread out across the hotels, still giving a good value option - although I suppose they will never lower prices at the deluxe hotels. Polynesian - it's just insanity at this point. We stayed there this year, but I don't think we can afford it again! And we make a good salary.

There is a good chance the resorts with access to this will have increase in room prices.

 

[tjkraz]

I love that they're bringing a new high-volume people mover to WDW. I appreciate that it's a new take on an old concept. The fact that it should be more environmentally friendly than a fleet of buses is promising. The Epcot area of WDW is a perfect testing ground for proof-of-concept and as a pilot for possible expansion to the rest of the property. I think the crux of the whole system is going to be the CBR Changing Station. Namely, how efficiently and quickly you disembark from the AoA/POP or park spurs and the amount of time spent waiting in line waiting to transfer/reboard onto your final destination spur. If they can keep total end to end travel time under 30 minutes, they're golden. But if you end up approaching 45mins to an hour plus because of inefficiency or high volumes going through a central transfer point, you're going to have many guests unhappy with being forced into a new transport method that is far less convenient than the buses it intends to replace.

Let's assume the average gondola will house 5 passengers and they depart the station every 10 seconds. The system would move about 1800 guests per hour in a single direction (5 passengers x 6 cabins per minute x 60 minutes).

If we compare a peak bus guest load of 50 passengers including standing room, that's the equivalent of about 36 full bus loads per hour.

The killer route on this thing from Disney's perspective would be the CBR to IG spur. Right now, most Disney buses are only maximized in one direction. In the morning, a bus going from CBR to Epcot is full on the way in but then departs Epcot virtually empty. At night, it leave Epcot full but picks up few passengers at CBR. But that gondola route will be simultaneously used in BOTH directions all day long; guests going from Epcot resorts to Hollywood studios and back, while guests from Pop/AOA/CBR go to Epcot and back. Using my numbers above, in a single hour that spur will move 3600 guests or 72+ bus loads. (Though admittedly there could be bottlenecks if a car switch is required for some trips.)

During peak periods, Cast Members could group multiple parties together, coming closer to the 8-10 maximum capacity for every gondola. And I suspect bus or boat service will still be offered between these resorts & parks, albeit with reduced frequency. They simply cannot mandate that every guest ride in these windowed cabins 50' off the ground.

I'm curious to see if guests will actually have to change cars at CBR or if they'll use some computerized switching system to have cars just pass thru that station if headed to or from Hollywood Studios.

 

[Spridell]

Another slightly less interesting point, the DHS and Epcot stations show lines that angle upward pretty quickly out of the station - the CBR hub on the other hand does not, and appears to stay fairly low. This is a minor point and might even be artistic over actual.

My guess is out of Epcot they need it to get up quickly over the boat dock and water? Dont know about DHS though.