Riviera = DVC “lite”

Novakm

Mouseketeer
Joined
Mar 9, 2013
The Riviera POS deeds fewer rights to direct buyers. That’s how they can eliminate trading out for resale buyers. It’s no longer a deeded right. It’s now a “perk for direct buyers only” (subject to change)

It’s like DVC “lite”

People have been thinking this is a way to hurt resale, but I think that misses the bigger picture. By giving away fewer rights in the POS, it puts them in a position to charge everyone for these “perks” down the road.

Would they ever do this? They did with valet parking!

What if they could start charging for something really valuable once the resort is sold out?

Trading out to DVC?
Priority booking?
Access to certain room types?
Access to certain times of the year?
Ability to book in advance?
Ability to book last minute?


What do you think? How much can they water down the POS and stay legal?
 
The Riviera POS deeds fewer rights to direct buyers. That’s how they can eliminate trading out for resale buyers. It’s no longer a deeded right. It’s now a “perk for direct buyers only” (subject to change)

It’s like DVC “lite”

People have been thinking this is a way to hurt resale, but I think that misses the bigger picture. By giving away fewer rights in the POS, it puts them in a position to charge everyone for these “perks” down the road.

Would they ever do this? They did with valet parking!

What if they could start charging for something really valuable once the resort is sold out?

Trading out to DVC?
Priority booking?
Access to certain room types?
Access to certain times of the year?
Ability to book in advance?
Ability to book last minute?


What do you think? How much can they water down the POS and stay legal?
They can sell it as a RTU and remove the ability of the owners of the contracts to rent out their points.
 
Would they ever do this? They did with valet parking!

Valet parking was handled badly but since it was a 3rd party arrangement, not sure how it makes any sense as a comparison here.

With that said, I'm not recommending DVC to friends going forward. The Disney Difference has been dead for a few years and the trend is downward. Just because Westgate has a policy doesn't mean it's ok for Disney to copy it. I don't see a big issue for current owners but new owners will be taking some big risks.
 


Where did you find the Riviera POS?

I didn’t find the POS, but they can’t restrict Resale rights to book other resorts without taking them out of the POS.

I got thinking about this when they announced cash customers will be able to book before DVC buyers. I bet They expect the POS to take longer to be approved by FLA because they are making significant changes.
 
Valet parking was handled badly but since it was a 3rd party arrangement, not sure how it makes any sense as a comparison here.

With that said, I'm not recommending DVC to friends going forward. The Disney Difference has been dead for a few years and the trend is downward. Just because Westgate has a policy doesn't mean it's ok for Disney to copy it. I don't see a big issue for current owners but new owners will be taking some big risks.


I think valet parking is an appropriate comparison because it used to be a free perk. Now they charge for it. They can do this with any perk, and for Riviera, trading Out to DVC is a perk, not a right of ownership.

I agree with your sentiment. Disney used to try to be the industry leader. Won’t affect me, but it doesn’t bode well for future buyers.
 
I didn’t find the POS, but they can’t restrict Resale rights to book other resorts without taking them out of the POS.

I got thinking about this when they announced cash customers will be able to book before DVC buyers. I bet They expect the POS to take longer to be approved by FLA because they are making significant changes.

I thought you might have actually seen it. I have been waiting to see a POS precisely to see how DVD gets around the clear language in the ones for the existing sites which, in summary says: (a) both all those who purchase from DVD and purchase resale become Members of the Disney Vacation Club entitled to its rights and benefits; (b) a key benefit that Members have is to be able to make reservations at all DVC Resorts (current and future) via use of the DVC Reservation Component operated by BVTC; (d) BVTC's contract likewise provides that any Member, including resale purchasers, is entitled to make reservations at any DVC Resort, including any that BVTC adds to the DVC program; and (e) that same contract says BVTC can add a new DVC Resort to the Club but only if it enters into a contract with substantially the same terms as the one BVTC has with the existing resorts.

In other words, there appears to be no way under the current DVC system that BVTC can add Riviera to the system as a new DVC Resort with the resale restrictions that DVD has created. What I am waiting to see is how DVD tries get around the problems it faces in trying to add Riviera as a resort that can trade with other DVC Resorts at 7 months out and still keep the new resale restrictions; perhaps it may be just another trade out option like RCI, although that may raise its own legal issues.

You mention that perhaps approval is being delayed, but I question if that is the issue. The prerequisite to seeking approval of the official POS is to actually file it, and then we could find it, and I have not yet seen anything being filed (although it might have already been filed and there is just a delay by the authorities making it available to the public).
 


I agree with your sentiment. Disney used to try to be the industry leader. Won’t affect me, but it doesn’t bode well for future buyers.
Yes. While many argue, and not without merit, that Disney is simply being as efficient as can be to keep their major shareholders happy, I've been saying what you have for a couple of years now: Disney now touts "industry standard" as their goal; Disney used to set the standard.
 
I did not realize all that language regarding booking at all the now and future resorts is in there.

That’s pretty interesting. So how do u get around that then?
 
I did not realize all that language regarding booking at all the now and future resorts is in there.

That’s pretty interesting. So how do u get around that then?

The language is booking resorts that are included in the "Club". That is why there is the expectation or suspicion that they are essentially forming DVCII or else they will not be including new resorts in any "club" and will just have to establish some sort of trade relations.
 
I thought you might have actually seen it. I have been waiting to see a POS precisely to see how DVD gets around the clear language in the ones for the existing sites which, in summary says: (a) both all those who purchase from DVD and purchase resale become Members of the Disney Vacation Club entitled to its rights and benefits; (b) a key benefit that Members have is to be able to make reservations at all DVC Resorts (current and future) via use of the DVC Reservation Component operated by BVTC; (d) BVTC's contract likewise provides that any Member, including resale purchasers, is entitled to make reservations at any DVC Resort, including any that BVTC adds to the DVC program; and (e) that same contract says BVTC can add a new DVC Resort to the Club but only if it enters into a contract with substantially the same terms as the one BVTC has with the existing resorts.

In other words, there appears to be no way under the current DVC system that BVTC can add Riviera to the system as a new DVC Resort with the resale restrictions that DVD has created. What I am waiting to see is how DVD tries get around the problems it faces in trying to add Riviera as a resort that can trade with other DVC Resorts at 7 months out and still keep the new resale restrictions; perhaps it may be just another trade out option like RCI, although that may raise its own legal issues.

You mention that perhaps approval is being delayed, but I question if that is the issue. The prerequisite to seeking approval of the official POS is to actually file it, and then we could find it, and I have not yet seen anything being filed (although it might have already been filed and there is just a delay by the authorities making it available to the public).

Or perhaps all they'll do is state that it was actually only applicable for the first year. :duck:
 
So technically that’s why I don’t read fine print stuff ever because a large company can always do what they want. There is always a way around anything with large companies.
 
It's not that extreme or Disney would be doing more to screw with the original 14.

But Disney does have a lot of control. Historically, they have been a benevolent dictator but the times appear to be changing.
 
[QUOTE="chalee94, post: 60177779, member: 123393"

But Disney does have a lot of control. Historically, they have been a benevolent dictator but the times appear to be changing.[/QUOTE]

I think that is a very good description.
 
It's not that extreme or Disney would be doing more to screw with the original 14.

But Disney does have a lot of control. Historically, they have been a benevolent dictator but the times appear to be changing.

Yup, the good old days.
 
I didn’t find the POS, but they can’t restrict Resale rights to book other resorts without taking them out of the POS.

I got thinking about this when they announced cash customers will be able to book before DVC buyers. I bet They expect the POS to take longer to be approved by FLA because they are making significant changes.
It was approved on 12/18.

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