Permit Filed: "Project S" at Epcot

[mcjaco]

I completely agree but your picture isn't the problem or where the problem started.

When would you say it started then? When the Lion King characters invaded The Land in the Circle of Life?

haha, I don't know if you're trying to be funny or not, but you're making me laugh. The whole Norway pavilion is patterned after a fictional town and you're wondering why people dislike it. I'd be alright with Anna and Elsa being in the pavilion, if they didn't totally toss the real Norway in the nearest trash can. The World Showcase is supposed to be about the countries and their customs and foods, etc.

What are they teaching us in Arendelle, how to build a snowman? It should have been built in the Magic Kingdom with the other fictional lands. If you had your way you would have all the countries knocked down and replaced by their fictional counterparts.

Yeah....better stop while you're ahead. Nowhere do I say anything close to needing to knock countries down.

The Norway pavilion was a mishmash of Norwegian countries and cultures, much like "Arendale." It's "close enough" and fits in. At least better than two birds not native to Mexico, and a duck....

 

[rteetz]

When would you say it started then? When the Lion King characters invaded The Land in the Circle of Life?

I don't even know if it started then. That attraction was still centered around education. Character meet and greets in Innoventions would likely be the first step. Frozen in Norway was the biggest step.

 

[Dfan79]

Yeah....better stop while you're ahead. Nowhere do I say anything close to needing to knock countries down.

The Norway pavilion was a mishmash of Norwegian countries and cultures, much like "Arendale." It's "close enough" and fits in. At least better than two birds not native to Mexico, and a duck....

Well, you seem to have no problem with creating a whole fictional land in Norway.

"It's close enough" is all you got? At least everything in Mexico is Mexican. From the temple to the items to the artifacts. Also the ride you made fun of actually shows the real Mexico and things that represent it. It even looks like Mexico inside the temple with the faux houses and busy markets selling Day of the Dead skulls.

What is real about Frozenland? You see the sisters singing with a talking snowman in a fictional town and a large evil snow monster tries to kill you.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I think having characters like that is okay but having all the attractions based around Disney films isn't exactly what Epcot was meant to be.

Exactly...and I don't know who said "no characters"...but it wasn't I

 

[umichigan10]

I don't even know if it started then. That attraction was still centered around education. Character meet and greets in Innoventions would likely be the first step. Frozen in Norway was the biggest step.

The Seas change was also a big step in that direction, but I will say the aquarium area is still fairly educational with nemo providing interest

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I think we're past that point.



So how are Elsa and Ana not okay for Norway? Just because it's Arendale? A fake version of Norwegian countries??? Sounds like they fit into your criteria to me.

Mickey and Friends were used for all sorts of stuff in the early years (ie: shows like Splashtacular), when they figured out, Figment couldn't hold the park up on his own. Or those creepy big headed country characters. I still shudder when I think about those things headed my direction for a photo op.

IPs are easily identifiable for customers. It's kind of a no brainer at this point for a park that no one gets anymore, because it's been so dumbed down.

This is in no way stating that I want GoG in Epcot. That's a terrible IP inclusion.

It's 100% made up...and the same princess nonsense that is all over magic kingdom and studios...just off the top of my head...

 

[Dfan79]

Exactly...and I don't know who said "no characters"...but it wasn't I

No one did, mcjaco is just having an argument with himself.

Everyone I've seen in this thread has said "They don't like IP's that don't fit with the theme or they'd just rather have a different attraction."

 

[lockedoutlogic]

No one did, mcjaco is just having an argument with himself.

Everyone I've seen in this thread has said "They don't like IP's that don't fit with the theme or they'd just rather have a different attraction."

Ehh...I'm sure it's my fault..."thou shalt not reject groupthink and protest shortsighted management decisions"

I violated the first Disney Commandment.

 

[jknezek]

Ehh...I'm sure it's my fault..."thou shalt not reject groupthink and protest shortsighted management decisions"

I violated the first Disney Commandment.

I think most of us violate that commandment when it comes to the misplaced idiocy of FEA. But what is done is done.

 

[Dfan79]

Ehh...I'm sure it's my fault..."thou shalt not reject groupthink and protest shortsighted management decisions"

I violated the first Disney Commandment.

It's Ok, I'll hide the body... I mean body.. what body?

I mean't it's perfectly fine Locked, I've broken many commandments in my lifetime. Some of them I should probably not mention on a message board.

Ok... I stole the nickel candy when I was 8 years old. I just pretended to put change in the tin.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I think most of us violate that commandment when it comes to the misplaced idiocy of FEA. But what is done is done.

Uh oh...you're treading hallowed grounds there...how were we to keep our DDs entertained without a fast pass to FEA?

It's done...I just don't want to have the dealer split my hand and double down...

Disney treated their customers like simpletons with that overlay. The reasons/excuses made sense neither then nor now...

...and of course...their lack of faith has been rewarded...as many have come on DIS ever since pleading for more nonsense in the same style.

 

[mcjaco]

Well, you seem to have no problem with creating a whole fictional land in Norway.

"It's close enough" is all you got? At least everything in Mexico is Mexican. From the temple to the items to the artifacts. Also the ride you made fun of actually shows the real Mexico and things that represent it. It even looks like Mexico inside the temple with the faux houses and busy markets selling Day of the Dead skulls.

What is real about Frozenland? You see the sisters singing with a talking snowman in a fictional town and a large evil snow monster tries to kill you.

The Norway pavilion was already a made up land. It wasn't really Norway, it was a conglomeration. You're comparing oranges and apples. Yes, the Mexico pavilion is more authentic. The three feathered tourists are not. I have a bigger problem with that, if we're going for authenticy. Which is a ridiculous argument, over a friggin' theme park pavilion.

No one did, mcjaco is just having an argument with himself.

You're right. No one person said it. But the argument is about characters being introduced into EPCOT, and the trend has been going on since Epcot's inception.

You're the one that jumped in assuming I was calling out an individual. Maybe because you thought it was aimed at you..... (shocker - it wasn't).

 

[HopperFan]

Well, you seem to have no problem with creating a whole fictional land in Norway.

"It's close enough" is all you got? At least everything in Mexico is Mexican. From the temple to the items to the artifacts. Also the ride you made fun of actually shows the real Mexico and things that represent it. It even looks like Mexico inside the temple with the faux houses and busy markets selling Day of the Dead skulls.

What is real about Frozenland? You see the sisters singing with a talking snowman in a fictional town and a large evil snow monster tries to kill you.

Arendal is a real city in Norway with many similarities ..... the country of Norway isn't complaining.

https://dadfordisney.com/2014/10/21/arendal-or-arendelle/

Reality is the Epcot is not what Walt designed, it's a theme park. Reality is the "educational" parts of Epcot have become shells of themselves because the majority of guests are not interested. Disney is in business to make money, so if they choose to add IP to the park to bring in more guests and more money, so be it.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

The Norway pavilion was already a made up land. It wasn't really Norway, it was a conglomeration. You're comparing oranges and apples. Yes, the Mexico pavilion is more authentic. The three feathered tourists are not. I have a bigger problem with that, if we're going for authenticy. Which is a ridiculous argument, over a friggin' theme park pavilion.



You're right. No one person said it. But the argument is about characters being introduced into EPCOT, and the trend has been going on since Epcot's inception.

You're the one that jumped in assuming I was calling out an individual. Maybe because you thought it was aimed at you..... (shocker - it wasn't).

No...Norway does actually exist. If you're talking about the genesis of the pavilion...what does that actually matter? That collapsed and disney ran it for near 30 years anyway as NORGE.

And having belle take pictures in the showcase is obviously different than doing iger "I'm proud I bought this" overlays that take the place of technology, education and cultures...not the same thing. One of the More ridiculously parsed arguments around.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Arendal is a real city in Norway with many similarities ..... the country of Norway isn't complaining.

https://dadfordisney.com/2014/10/21/arendal-or-arendelle/

Reality is the Epcot is not what Walt designed, it's a theme park. Reality is the "educational" parts of Epcot have become shells of themselves because the majority of guests are not interested. Disney is in business to make money, so if they choose to add IP to the park to bring in more guests and more money, so be it.

That movie was a fictitious kingdom that was surrounded by other fictitoous kingdoms with magical snowmen and ice princesses. It had not a thing to do with Norway...not during any part of the process and we all know it.

I see the defense of the first commandment has started: defending the indefensible to mask sheer corporate laziness/profit motive.

 

[hillg1868]

I think we're past that point.



So how are Elsa and Ana not okay for Norway? Just because it's Arendale? A fake version of Norwegian countries??? Sounds like they fit into your criteria to me.

Mickey and Friends were used for all sorts of stuff in the early years (ie: shows like Splashtacular), when they figured out, Figment couldn't hold the park up on his own. Or those creepy big headed country characters. I still shudder when I think about those things headed my direction for a photo op.

IPs are easily identifiable for customers. It's kind of a no brainer at this point for a park that no one gets anymore, because it's been so dumbed down.

This is in no way stating that I want GoG in Epcot. That's a terrible IP inclusion.

Anna and elsa made their way to norway due to closing of malestrom which was due to norway not supporting the country, financially, any more (2002 was the last time that the ACTUAL country of Norway donated money). The idea of frozen is like nails on a chalk board because the idea of learning about norway (the spirit of Norway *in my best viking accent*). is gone and therefore it defeats the purpose that was intended for Epcot.

 

[HopperFan]

That movie was a fictitious kingdom that was surrounded by other fictitoous kingdoms with magical snowmen and ice princesses. It had not a thing to do with Norway...not during any part of the process and we all know it.

I see the defense of the first commandment has started: defending the indefensible to mask sheer corporate laziness/profit motive.

 

[Lvsdisney]

When would you say it started then? When the Lion King characters invaded The Land in the Circle of Life?



Yeah....better stop while you're ahead. Nowhere do I say anything close to needing to knock countries down.

The Norway pavilion was a mishmash of Norwegian countries and cultures, much like "Arendale." It's "close enough" and fits in. At least better than two birds not native to Mexico, and a duck....

The Norway pavilion was already a made up land. It wasn't really Norway, it was a conglomeration. You're comparing oranges and apples. Yes, the Mexico pavilion is more authentic. The three feathered tourists are not. I have a bigger problem with that, if we're going for authenticy. Which is a ridiculous argument, over a friggin' theme park pavilion.



You're right. No one person said it. But the argument is about characters being introduced into EPCOT, and the trend has been going on since Epcot's inception.

You're the one that jumped in assuming I was calling out an individual. Maybe because you thought it was aimed at you..... (shocker - it wasn't).

As someone who is half Norwegian and has been to the REAL Norway (Have you?), I'm a little put off by your remarks. First, Norway is a country, it is not made up of countries. Also, the Norway Pavilion is a perfect representation of Old Norway. You have Bergen (west coast), a Stave Church (found all over the country), and Akershus Fortress, which is in Olso on the Eastern side of the country. I always love visiting the pavilion because I recognize the surroundings it and it feels real.

I agree with the others that adding Frozen to the pavilion does nothing to support the idea of Norway. I can also add I was very upset when the removed Maelstrom. I like the Frozen movie, and would probably like FEA, but I don't feel it belongs in EPCOT. It'd be like putting Aladdin's Flying Carpets in Morocco.... doesn't quite jive with the idea of learning about a REAL country.

 

[rteetz]

Let's stay on topic please

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Let's stay on topic please

Ok...I think "project S" stands for "stanley"...as in cups...as in multiple

(You had that one coming )