Lasseter may return to Disney

TLJ was far too important of a moneymaker/film to go PC with - but they did it anyway, and paid for it with Solo (IMO). Please understand, I don't know anything about Ms Lee; perhaps she was the best candidate? I don't know. I do know that Disney is being sure to virtue signal at every turn these days: lots of PC programming, checking off all of the SJW subjects in their films, etc. Their actions, and the politically-laden recent films like Zootopia and Last Jedi make me suspect their intentions at every turn. They brought this suspicion on themselves. This is exactly why affirmative action is such a scourge on our society today.

As an aside: You imply that she directed Frozen? I honestly don't know, but if they really wanted the person who made that film a mega-hit they would have hired the couple that wrote "Let It Go." That movie's success mostly starts and ends there.

She was brought in as a fixer after she finished her work with Wreck-It-Ralph. The Snow Queen was imploding (again) and she had to write a new screenplay and basically take over the production. She was given free reign to do whatever she wanted by Catmull.

There would be no Let it Go and no Frozen without Jennifer Lee. In the original script, Elsa was evil and that song wasn’t a part of it.

Catmull, one of the actual co-founders of Pixar, is 73. It’s time for a new generation to take the helm.

Catmull does have a good eye for talent though. I mean, he hired John Lasseter to work at Pixar after Disney fired him.
 
She was brought in as a fixer after she finished her work with Wreck-It-Ralph. The Snow Queen was imploding (again) and she had to write a new screenplay and basically take over the production. She was given free reign to do whatever she wanted by Catmull.

There would be no Let it Go and no Frozen without Jennifer Lee. In the original script, Elsa was evil and that song wasn’t a part of it.

Catmull, one of the actual co-founders of Pixar, is 73. It’s time for a new generation to take the helm.

Catmull does have a good eye for talent though. I mean, he hired John Lasseter to work at Pixar after Disney fired him.

I understood that Lasseter agreed to a rewrite of what would become Frozen after Let It Go was written. The screenplay was written around the song, no?
 
This is truth. Pretty much every Disney animated movie since forever has basically been a morallity play. It's their nature.

Correct. ...but not shoehorned into a movie just to make a ham-handed statement (thinking of the useless casino/racetrack sequence in TLJ). That was an eyeroller...
 
Correct. ...but not shoehorned into a movie just to make a ham-handed statement (thinking of the useless casino/racetrack sequence in TLJ). That was an eyeroller...

I have no comment on that, but I was referring only to the Animated fare. Not all Disney live-action films are morality plays (some are).
 


TLJ was far too important of a moneymaker/film to go PC with - but they did it anyway, and paid for it with Solo (IMO). Please understand, I don't know anything about Ms Lee; perhaps she was the best candidate? I don't know. I do know that Disney is being sure to virtue signal at every turn these days: lots of PC programming, checking off all of the SJW subjects in their films, etc. Their actions, and the politically-laden recent films like Zootopia and Last Jedi make me suspect their intentions at every turn. They brought this suspicion on themselves. This is exactly why affirmative action is such a scourge on our society today.

As an aside: You imply that she directed Frozen? I honestly don't know, but if they really wanted the person who made that film a mega-hit they would have hired the couple that wrote "Let It Go." That movie's success mostly starts and ends there.

I was going to respond to this more harshly until I realized that this person has had an account for one month, has 31 posts, and appears to be trying to pick a fight - I advise everyone to temper your response in that light. But in case this person really wants a friendly debate.

So I will just say this: I work for a large corporation (not Disney) that encourages idea of hiring women and minorities. However, in the end we are always tasked to hire the most qualified candidate. I am 100% certain there was discussion among the Disney brass that did the hiring of Mrs. Lee about that it would look favorable to hire a woman, but I also 100% guarantee that they chose her because they thought she was at LEAST equally qualified to others to do the job. Hiring at this level isn't just beholden to outside shareholders, but these people line their pockets with the success of Disney stock. They are not hiring someone that they feel cannot do the job. And if that someone is a woman, then they are the better for it.

Do you think the fact that less than 5% of directors of motion pictures are women is because:
A) Women don't WANT to direct movies
B) Women are incapable of directing movies
C) Men get the jobs because they have always gotten the jobs, and women simply aren't given the chance.

If you answer A or B I guess I really have nothing for you. If you answer C, then wouldn't you agree that something should be done to change it?
 
TLJ was far too important of a moneymaker/film to go PC with - but they did it anyway, and paid for it with Solo (IMO). Please understand, I don't know anything about Ms Lee; perhaps she was the best candidate? I don't know. I do know that Disney is being sure to virtue signal at every turn these days: lots of PC programming, checking off all of the SJW subjects in their films, etc. Their actions, and the politically-laden recent films like Zootopia and Last Jedi make me suspect their intentions at every turn. They brought this suspicion on themselves. This is exactly why affirmative action is such a scourge on our society today.

As an aside: You imply that she directed Frozen? I honestly don't know, but if they really wanted the person who made that film a mega-hit they would have hired the couple that wrote "Let It Go." That movie's success mostly starts and ends there.

I get the PC stuff on Zootopia, but don't see it on The Last Jedi. I've heard people say that the men are weak and women are strong, but that ignores the main characters. Kylo Ren is very strong (bested only by Luke) and Rey is pretty much doomed to death based on her misreading of Kylo. If Kylo doesn't save her, she's toast at the hands of Snoke. I thought the stuff with the casino was interesting, but not given enough coverage to make much of an meaningful point.

She was brought in as a fixer after she finished her work with Wreck-It-Ralph. The Snow Queen was imploding (again) and she had to write a new screenplay and basically take over the production. She was given free reign to do whatever she wanted by Catmull.

There would be no Let it Go and no Frozen without Jennifer Lee. In the original script, Elsa was evil and that song wasn’t a part of it.

Catmull, one of the actual co-founders of Pixar, is 73. It’s time for a new generation to take the helm.

Catmull does have a good eye for talent though. I mean, he hired John Lasseter to work at Pixar after Disney fired him.

The original premise sounds like a much better movie to me. I know Frozen made a bajillion dollars, but I always thought it was a mess of a movie - Elsa's character in particular.

I'm not enthused by Lee as the choice, as I haven't found her work to be very good (Ralph, excepted). I certainly don't know enough about the players to offer any alternatives, though.
 
This is all pretty sad that everyone judges and finds John Lassester guilty when there has been no charges or allegations against him filed in a court. Wake up people !

Ewww. No thanks.

100% disagree on that one. Disney's virtue signaling is leading the pack these days - except for maybe Starbucks. I am absolutely certain that 'affirmative action' helped this hire.

Gross.

TLJ was far too important of a moneymaker/film to go PC with - but they did it anyway, and paid for it with Solo (IMO). Please understand, I don't know anything about Ms Lee; perhaps she was the best candidate? I don't know. I do know that Disney is being sure to virtue signal at every turn these days: lots of PC programming, checking off all of the SJW subjects in their films, etc. Their actions, and the politically-laden recent films like Zootopia and Last Jedi make me suspect their intentions at every turn. They brought this suspicion on themselves. This is exactly why affirmative action is such a scourge on our society today.

As an aside: You imply that she directed Frozen? I honestly don't know, but if they really wanted the person who made that film a mega-hit they would have hired the couple that wrote "Let It Go." That movie's success mostly starts and ends there.

You mean the couple that composed “Book of Mormon” and “Avenue Q” - two of the most obscene musicals of all time?

Your Hot Takes need a little research.
 


TLJ was far too important of a moneymaker/film to go PC with - but they did it anyway, and paid for it with Solo (IMO). Please understand, I don't know anything about Ms Lee;
You admit don't know anything about her, her accomplishments, qualifications, etc....yet you conclude that it's definitely an affirmative action hire? Sounds legit.
perhaps she was the best candidate? I don't know. I do know that Disney is being sure to virtue signal at every turn these days: lots of PC programming, checking off all of the SJW subjects in their films, etc. Their actions, and the politically-laden recent films like Zootopia and Last Jedi make me suspect their intentions at every turn. They brought this suspicion on themselves. This is exactly why affirmative action is such a scourge on our society today.
Perhaps their "intentions" are an attempt to reflect the way society is shifting? To make women, people of color, LGBTQ people, etc. feel like they can relate to their films, and that they matter? That's Disney getting with the times and being savvy to their customer base.
As an aside: You imply that she directed Frozen? I honestly don't know,
You can do this, I know you can.
 
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You mean the couple that composed “Book of Mormon” and “Avenue Q” - two of the most obscene musicals of all time?

Your Hot Takes need a little research.

I'm not the person you're replying to, but I don't think the obscenity of other artists' work really addresses what Lee has or hasn't done or if the Disney movies have become too PC.

I took the argument to be that it was the Frozen songs that were the core of Frozen's success, not Lee. If anything, that Robert Lopez helped write those other musicals (I don't think his wife was involved) would actually seem to reinforce that point. If one is looking to have "less PC" in the movies, the Lopez couple (or at least the husband) would certainly be a fitting choice based on his other work.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding the argument, though.
 
Well, in the interest of keeping this thread open and productive, here is a new story out:

https://variety.com/2018/film/news/pixar-boys-club-john-lasseter-cassandra-smolcic-1202858982/


I don't think we will ever know the exact truth of what he did or didn't do, but there are just too many stories about the culture there being suppressive to women and not part of the "boys club" for it to be completely fabricated

And to me, this is why he couldn't come back - the message that would send, that we don't care about the culture that has not been inclusive, he is worth more than everyone negatively impacted, just can't happen
 
Well, in the interest of keeping this thread open and productive, here is a new story out:

https://variety.com/2018/film/news/pixar-boys-club-john-lasseter-cassandra-smolcic-1202858982/


I don't think we will ever know the exact truth of what he did or didn't do, but there are just too many stories about the culture there being suppressive to women and not part of the "boys club" for it to be completely fabricated

And to me, this is why he couldn't come back - the message that would send, that we don't care about the culture that has not been inclusive, he is worth more than everyone negatively impacted, just can't happen

Yeah...this is kind of where I'm at. When there's one or two accusations - then there is a level of doubt involved - unfortunately for many women - but it is often a "he said, she said" environment. However, anytime you hear multiple stories saying the same thing...well, it becomes hard to believe that a bunch of women got together to overthrow Lasseter for no reason.

The shame of it is that there's a good chance Disney corporate knew about this for a long time. (Though I suppose it's POSSIBLE that the CEO and upper management didn't know...but certainly all the management at Pixar did.)
 
Yeah...this is kind of where I'm at. When there's one or two accusations - then there is a level of doubt involved - unfortunately for many women - but it is often a "he said, she said" environment. However, anytime you hear multiple stories saying the same thing...well, it becomes hard to believe that a bunch of women got together to overthrow Lasseter for no reason.

The shame of it is that there's a good chance Disney corporate knew about this for a long time. (Though I suppose it's POSSIBLE that the CEO and upper management didn't know...but certainly all the management at Pixar did.)


I don't think we will ever know who knew what - and I also suspect it becomes one of those things where upper management doesn't *want* to know. I am sure they knew something though, but perhaps not the extent of it

I also think it often becomes one of those things that you hear of a small infraction and you overlook it and then then next time something happens you also have to overlook that one or else it comes out that your overlooked the first one and why, etc.
 
I don't think we will ever know who knew what - and I also suspect it becomes one of those things where upper management doesn't *want* to know. I am sure they knew something though, but perhaps not the extent of it

I also think it often becomes one of those things that you hear of a small infraction and you overlook it and then then next time something happens you also have to overlook that one or else it comes out that your overlooked the first one and why, etc.

Yeah - and if NBC/Comcast can ignore "He had a button made on his desk to lock the door." then it's easy to believe Disney ignored "The guy can be a bit handsy."
 
Well, in the interest of keeping this thread open and productive, here is a new story out:

https://variety.com/2018/film/news/pixar-boys-club-john-lasseter-cassandra-smolcic-1202858982/


I don't think we will ever know the exact truth of what he did or didn't do, but there are just too many stories about the culture there being suppressive to women and not part of the "boys club" for it to be completely fabricated

And to me, this is why he couldn't come back - the message that would send, that we don't care about the culture that has not been inclusive, he is worth more than everyone negatively impacted, just can't happen

I've heard the exact same story over and over again too. Women being warned to avoid Lasseter, getting harassed, not being able to advance due to said harassment and leaving the industry when it all becomes too much. That perception of Pixar couldn't have helped as they're trying to recruit new employees at Disney and Pixar. Also, considering that 60% of new animation graduates are female, that probably hindered their recruitment efforts as they were seeking top applicants from the Class of 2018.

Statistically, due to his obesity, replacing him is something they'd probably have to do in the next 5 years anyway. I guess we probably won't ever know all of the factors, but clearly they saw him as too big of a liability to keep around. Getting it out of the way now makes sense and advancing Lee now protects her from headhunters at a presumably lower cost. I know Pete Docter has been kind of gotten lost in the discussion, but I think he's a great pick too.
 
Statistically, due to his obesity, replacing him is something they'd probably have to do in the next 5 years anyway. I guess we probably won't ever know all of the factors, but clearly they saw him as too big of a liability to keep around. Getting it out of the way now makes sense and advancing Lee now protects her from headhunters at a presumably lower cost. I know Pete Docter has been kind of gotten lost in the discussion, but I think he's a great pick too.

I don't think Lasseter is unhealthy enough that he'd be dead in five years (though apparently he does enjoy binge drinking, so who knows), but I do think it's kind of funny how everyone seems to be acting like if this didn't happen he would *never* have left the company. Even on the podcast, people are saying that Pixar will be doomed without him, and like...that was inevitably going to happen whether he was a perfect gentleman or the man he's being revealed to be. Sure, maybe this is sooner than people would have expected, but he is in his 60s - he probably had less than 10 years at the company before retirement anyways. Disney's action is not only bringing an inevitability about sooner, but hopefully they're cleansing a toxic culture now instead of 10 years from now when that culture may be too far gone to be salvaged.
 
Even on the podcast, people are saying that Pixar will be doomed without him, and like...that was inevitably going to happen whether he was a perfect gentleman or the man he's being revealed to be. Sure, maybe this is sooner than people would have expected, but he is in his 60s - he probably had less than 10 years at the company before retirement anyways.

I just am not sure how much credit he should get anymore. Pixar still makes some great movies, but the highs of the 2000s are behind them. I think maybe Lasseter's most revolutionary idea was the use of the "brain trust" instead of leaving the decisions on each movie to one or two directors, using a group of directors to look at problems and come up with solutions. There's no reason to think that this can't still work without him.
 

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