If the new gondola, Skyliner, is successful, will they create more lines?

I don't disagree with the total increase which is a lot more than inflation ... I wasn't necessarily arguing now vs then, more just in general when these studies are done comparing a Disney trip to a certain % of total income that people allocate to vacations, my point was just that it isn't one years worth of income to compare it to if you are only going every few years

Right...I don't necessarily disagree with the pieces...but vacation is a puzzle and you have to buy all the pieces. It can't happen without them.

I rail on two things:
1. The aggregate raises...which are huge
2. Upsells replacing normal schedules...which again have started to become huge.
 
What's your math come from?

I just priced out CBR with a water or pool view just for kicks. 2 adults, 2 kids. Easter Week. 3/24-3/31 2018. 8 days, 7 days of park hoppers, Disney Dining Plan (the middle option), Memory Maker. $5390.77 without flights. Figure $400 per person for flights depending on where you are coming/going, and you get $6990.77.

Now, important to remember here, I did zero looking for basic ways to save, I didn't chose a base level room, I'm paying a full 8 nights, I'm paying for a very expensive dining plan for 8 days, and I'm getting 7 days of hoppers. On a holiday week. At a moderate.
 
Right...I don't necessarily disagree with the pieces...but vacation is a puzzle and you have to buy all the pieces. It can't happen without them.

I rail on two things:
1. The aggregate raises...which are huge
2. Upsells replacing normal schedules...which again have started to become huge.

I don't disagree with either but for the later, I think they have been able to keep most of the upsells from impact the normal too much, but you are seeing more and more things creep in and I am weary of that ... and goes with what I also go on and on about that it is more important for Disney to maintain giving a top shelf experience to every guest than worry about keeping costs low
 
Where are you getting the $8k for a moderate stay? I've priced out values and moderates the last three years and never once come up with a figure over $5k, and that's with hoppers, dining plan, memory maker, and airfare.

I got $6415.90 for that type of package in a middle price (which is ridiculous since all rooms are the same) at carribean for a week in January flying from Cleveland (always need to escape there...)...

So if that's "middle" of the chart...then the range is probably $3000 ish stripped down to in excess of $10,000 at the deluxes with bells and whistles for the week.

Compared to historic pricing that is pretty astounding.

I wish I knew what the average rate and tickets for a family of 4 ran at the moderates in...say...2003? The raw number...if only...

Want to take a shot at what it was? Tickets and room?
 


I don't disagree with either but for the later, I think they have been able to keep most of the upsells from impact the normal too much, but you are seeing more and more things creep in and I am weary of that ... and goes with what I also go on and on about that it is more important for Disney to maintain giving a top shelf experience to every guest than worry about keeping costs low

Not so scarys - now that October is juiced - , Christmas parties, and "after hours magic" are exaclty that...charging for what should be normal hours...

Top shelf? They haven't served Dom or the 40 year port for a long time...

...especially at the table.
 
I just priced out CBR with a water or pool view just for kicks. 2 adults, 2 kids. Easter Week. 3/24-3/31 2018. 8 days, 7 days of park hoppers, Disney Dining Plan (the middle option), Memory Maker. $5390.77 without flights. Figure $400 per person for flights depending on where you are coming/going, and you get $6990.77.

Now, important to remember here, I did zero looking for basic ways to save, I didn't chose a base level room, I'm paying a full 8 nights, I'm paying for a very expensive dining plan for 8 days, and I'm getting 7 days of hoppers. On a holiday week. At a moderate.

Right...I got a similar figure...for Caribbean. Actually it was a less crowded time.

See my earlier post and "spin the wheel" on the trivia.

And by the way...do you think that's a good value?

Or even if you do...it doesn't address the real point I was making:

Can that be competitive longterm to a MASS audience as they raise the price and the economic means decline...which is a certainty?
 
Not so scarys - now that October is juiced - , Christmas parties, and "after hours magic" are exaclty that...charging for what should be normal hours...

Top shelf? They haven't served Dom or the 40 year port for a long time...

...especially at the table.

The parties yeah, but they have been around for a while. As for the paid after hours events, I haven't seen anything definitive tying reduced regular hours to those happening. I have no issue with them if they are literally taking place when the park would be closed anyways. If they are closing specifically for them, then that isn't great
 


The parties yeah, but they have been around for a while. As for the paid after hours events, I haven't seen anything definitive tying reduced regular hours to those happening. I have no issue with them if they are literally taking place when the park would be closed anyways. If they are closing specifically for them, then that isn't great

What are you looking for that's definitive? You think anyone would cop to that?!?

Common sense works here: if they have enough sales to open the park...then they have enough foot traffic to not close it at 7 pm to normal tickets...

Pretty simple and hard to dispute.

If it's "dead", they wouldn't sell it...they have to make the normal
Day uncomfortable to sell the tickets at $40 per hour.
 
Right...I got a similar figure...for Caribbean. Actually it was a less crowded time.

See my earlier post and "spin the wheel" on the trivia.

And by the way...do you think that's a good value?

Or even if you do...it doesn't address the real point I was making:

Can that be competitive longterm to a MASS audience as they raise the price and the economic means decline...which is a certainty?

I don't think it's a good value. But I own a 1976 GMC motorhome and have 3 kids. Our big vacation this year was at a FL State Park 10 minutes from the Panhandle beaches in June. It cost me $24 a night plus tax, plus the grocery bill, which I would have had at home anyway, gas and a $10 week long family pass to the Gulf Shores National Park. It rained one day so we also splurged about $50 on bowling and snacks. Probably a hundred bucks more in oil, grease, and basic mechanical upkeep and repair on a 40 year old motorhome as a direct result of this one trip. We might have gone out to dinner one night as well. We are splurging next year staying in a beach front commercial campground so my parents can rent a cabin next to us. I think the CG is costing $300 for a week, which is probably total what we spent for a week this year.

Our Disney trip last year was 7 nights at Fort Wilderness, 6 day park hoppers, the middle dining plan, no memory maker, MVMCP tickets (never again), and about $4000 for the five of us all in. I figured it to be a little less than $130 a day per person with gas, but we splurged because the grandparents were going and staying at WL and wanted the DP and party tickets. We are booked again for early 2019 in the campground, no Dining Plan this time, no specialty tickets, no Park Hoppers. It should easily come to less than $100 per person per day even after two annual price increases.

So you can see what we do. We have the luxury of an RV that is paid off and I do most of the work to keep running. We take very cheap vacations for 2 years and save up for a cheap Disney vacation, which is actually a very expensive real vacation.
 
I don't think it's a good value. But I own a 1976 GMC motorhome and have 3 kids. Our big vacation this year was at a FL State Park 10 minutes from the Panhandle beaches in June. It cost me $24 a night plus tax, plus the grocery bill, which I would have had at home anyway, gas and a $10 week long family pass to the Gulf Shores National Park. It rained one day so we also splurged about $50 on bowling and snacks. Probably a hundred bucks more in oil, grease, and basic mechanical upkeep and repair on a 40 year old motorhome as a direct result of this one trip. We might have gone out to dinner one night as well. We are splurging next year staying in a beach front commercial campground so my parents can rent a cabin next to us. I think the CG is costing $300 for a week, which is probably total what we spent for a week this year.

Our Disney trip last year was 7 nights at Fort Wilderness, 6 day park hoppers, the middle dining plan, no memory maker, MVMCP tickets (never again), and about $4000 for the five of us all in. I figured it to be a little less than $130 a day per person with gas, but we splurged because the grandparents were going and staying at WL and wanted the DP and party tickets. We are booked again for early 2019 in the campground, no Dining Plan this time, no specialty tickets, no Park Hoppers. It should easily come to less than $100 per person per day even after two annual price increases.

So you can see what we do. We have the luxury of an RV that is paid off and I do most of the work to keep running. We take very cheap vacations for 2 years and save up for a cheap Disney vacation, which is actually a very expensive real vacation.

"...let the court recognize the witness...no further questions..."
 
What are you looking for that's definitive? You think anyone would cop to that?!?

Common sense works here: if they have enough sales to open the park...then they have enough foot traffic to not close it at 7 pm to normal tickets...

Pretty simple and hard to dispute.

If it's "dead", they wouldn't sell it...they have to make the normal
Day uncomfortable to sell the tickets at $40 per hour.

Well, someone did the counting of park hours year over year and saw they were down a tick, but they are down year round, not just when the paid extra hours are offered. And those are the ones I meant - when the park is open for a few hours form 11 to 2am or whatever, not when it closes at 7 - the parties I totally think is double dipping
 
I just priced out CBR with a water or pool view just for kicks. 2 adults, 2 kids. Easter Week. 3/24-3/31 2018. 8 days, 7 days of park hoppers, Disney Dining Plan (the middle option), Memory Maker. $5390.77 without flights. Figure $400 per person for flights depending on where you are coming/going, and you get $6990.77.

Now, important to remember here, I did zero looking for basic ways to save, I didn't chose a base level room, I'm paying a full 8 nights, I'm paying for a very expensive dining plan for 8 days, and I'm getting 7 days of hoppers. On a holiday week. At a moderate.

Not sure if you want to chase down the math but with that length of stay look at 1 adult buying an annual pass as it includes PhotoPass and 10% off most TS restaurants and 20% off merchandise which is likely a better deal than the DP. If you buy an AP you can add Tables in Wonderland for $150 and bump the discount to 20% at most restaurants on property. http://www.disneyfoodblog.com/disney-dining-references/tables-in-wonderland/
 
I got it up to $6512 for a family of 4, 11 year old and 6 year old, Caribbean Beach Standard View, June 2-9. With 7 day park hoppers, flights from O'Hare (not that someone would buy those this early), and middle-range dining plan. So depending on kids ages and whether or not you choose dining plan and flights, that can really push it up there. People going the whole nines can't be that common. I know buying tickets separately can be a lot cheaper but sometimes it's better to dip your toe in the water with those.

As a side note, the room rate on the standard view is 209 a night so I can easily see the gondola pushing that up another 30-50 a night during the summer.
 
Disney's goal is to pack the place to make stock dividends...not to keep you comfy...

...so don't hold your breath.

Yea prob right, yet the last 3 pages seem to be about over pricing and resulting in entire generations lost.

It has to be one or the other.

Can always pack the place with lowering prices, discounts and packages if needed. That's the part I hope not.

Too busy now. HEA right now is shoulder to shoulder, as I look around.
 
Yea prob right, yet the last 3 pages seem to be about over pricing and resulting in entire generations lost.

It has to be one or the other.

Can always pack the place with lowering prices, discounts and packages if needed. That's the part I hope not.

Too busy now. HEA right now is shoulder to shoulder, as I look around.

It probably WILL be one or the other...

...but there's downsides to both.


What the hell is "HEA"?
 
Well, someone did the counting of park hours year over year and saw they were down a tick, but they are down year round, not just when the paid extra hours are offered. And those are the ones I meant - when the park is open for a few hours form 11 to 2am or whatever, not when it closes at 7 - the parties I totally think is double dipping

The hours are down BY CHOICE...

Why would 10-12 am closes be the normal during moderate to busy times - 7 days a week - years ago and not be the norm with 20% higher attendance now?

Cause they want it...that's why.

Now...overall hours maybe somewhat flat be used they don't do "10-7" during the absolute dead periods that used to exist anymore.

But make no mistake: the hours should be longer...larger crowds, more distribution over the year.
 
Come on now you've been here long enough. There are acronyms for things not even open yet.

True...doesn't make it right though...

Coincidentally...the only firsthand assessment I got off HEA Is that it was all projection and little fireworks...

...not that I needed to have that confirmed:sad2:
 

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