I love credit cards so much! v2.0 (see first page for add'l details)

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SouthFayetteFan

Saving Money on Disney Vacations since 2006
Joined
Sep 6, 2014
Drinking from the CIPpy cup...what could go wrong?

I've been pondering something today, and I feel it's worth sharing. I want to preface this by saying, I personally am ok with the risk of CIPpy and will continue to drink until the cup spills over.

That said, it's worth pointing out that Chase is not afraid to shutdown accounts if they feel abuse has taken place. Earlier this year, a loophole was shared on r/churning that you could generate support links to any Chase card by manipulating the link. This essentially unlocked a backdoor self-support method. Shortly thereafter, it was discovered that these support bonuses had to be posted manually by Chase and could draw unwanted attention to your account. We subsequently decided here, that we would not support this backdoor "self-support" method and we removed all mention of it.

After this occurred, Chase sent letters out to some of r/churning's support link "super users" (more like super receivers) who had used the ability to PC their card multiple times to max out support points two and three times on the same card within one year. Some of these users also had participated in the link manipulation shared above.

The text in that letter said:
We reviewed your credit card account and it appears as though certain transactions represent a misuse of the rewards program...If this activity continues or if there is any other misuse or misrepresentation by you, we may close this and any other accounts you have with Chase.

A picture of that letter can be seen here:
The users who received these warning letters all were clear that they felt it tied to support links and I believe a couple may have called in to confirm that. Then, in a somewhat shocking move, one of those folks who received a letter actually had some of their cards shutdown by Chase (presumably for the same activity as there was no other logical reason for the shutdown). It's worth noting though, that in all instances, they did not clawback any rewards.

How does this tie to CIPpy you may ask? Well it seems that Chase can decide in their sole discretion what they deem to be abuse of their rewards program. Could they decide that repeatedly getting the same card to earn the signup bonus while simultaneously "self-supporting" was an abuse? I certainly think so. It is almost a certainty that this loophole will cease to exist at some point in the future. Nobody can tell you how far away that is, and nobody can tell you what (if any) consequences may occur when it gets shutdown. I will reiterate, that I am not going to stop drinking from CIPpy... But, I am going to try my best to follow some rules to cip safely:
  • I will always do P1=>P2 or P2=>P1 clicks. I know that might not be possible for all (especially those in 1 player mode) but if this is an option, embrace it! Avoiding a true "self-support" click is much more defensible. In the recent Amex clawback debacle, nobody who was supporting via this method experienced any clawback,.
  • Follow your pacing guidelines, don't try to accelerate the timeline and do 1 a month. It's just not worth the risk of getting yourself shutdown on your own.
  • If you want to be paranoid, you may also consider trying to mix up your business type with each application. Perhaps you own multiple successful "businesses" and you purely were pursuing the best small business card on the market for each business...
Please don't stop drinking from CIPpy because of this comment...just make sure you've weighed all the options and are doing it in the most safe way possible for your situation.

Additionally, as we are advising new folks on this option, I think it's important that we make sure they understand that this is not without risk. I don't want to spook them, but it's irresponsible as a "DISchurner" adviser to not at least make sure they understand that this is a loophole and (a) could be shutdown and (b) could come with some level of consequence at some point in the future.


I'm interested to hear anybody else's thoughts on this - even if you're opposed or feel I'm being overly paranoid here...
 
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  • Haley R

    With all the strength of a raging fire
    Joined
    Sep 3, 2017
    Drinking from the CIPpy cup...what could go wrong?

    I've been pondering something today, and I feel it's worth sharing. I want to preface this by saying, I personally am ok with the risk of CIPpy and will continue to drink until the cup spills over.

    That said, it's worth pointing out that Chase is not afraid to shutdown accounts if they feel abuse has taken place. Earlier this year, a loophole was shared on r/churning that you could generate support links to any Chase card by manipulating the link. This essentially unlocked a backdoor self-support method. Shortly thereafter, it was discovered that these support links had to be posted manually and could draw unwanted attention to your account. We subsequently decided here, that we would not support this backdoor "self-support" method and we removed all mention of it.

    After this occurred, Chase sent letters out to some of r/churning's support link "super users" (more like super receivers) who had used the ability to PC their card multiple times to max out support points two and three times on the same card within one year. Some of these users also had participated in the link manipulation shared above.

    The text in that letter said:
    We reviewed your credit card account and it appears as though certain transactions represent a misuse of the rewards program...If this activity continues or if there is any other misuse or misrepresentation by you, we may close this and any other accounts you have with Chase.

    A picture of that letter can be seen here:
    The users who received these warning letters all were clear that they felt it tied to support links and I believe a couple may have called in to confirm that. Then, in a somewhat shocking move, one of those folks who received a letter actually had some of their cards shutdown by Chase (presumably for the same activity as there was no other logical reason for the shutdown). It's worth noting though, that in all instances, they did not clawback any rewards.

    How does this tie to CIPpy you may ask? Well it seems that Chase can decide in their sole discretion what they deem to be abuse of their rewards program. Could they decide that repeatedly getting the same card to earn the signup bonus while simultaneously "self-supporting" was an abuse? I certainly think so. It is almost a certainty that this loophole will cease to exist at some point in the future. Nobody can tell you how far away that is, and nobody can tell you what (if any) consequences may occur when it gets shutdown. I will reiterate, that I am not going to stop drinking from CIPpy... But, I am going to try my best to follow some rules to cip safely:
    • I will always do P1=>P2 or P2=>P1 clicks. I know that might not be possible for all (especially those in 1 player mode) but if this is an option, embrace it! Avoiding a true "self-support" click is much more defensible. In the recent Amex clawback debacle, nobody who was supporting via this method experienced any clawback,.
    • Follow your pacing guidelines, don't try to accelerate the timeline and do 1 a month. It's just not worth the risk of getting yourself shutdown on your own.
    • If you want to be paranoid, you may also consider trying to mix up your business type with each application. Perhaps you own multiple successful "businesses" and you purely were pursuing the best small business card on the market for each business...
    Please don't stop drinking from CIPpy because of this comment...just make sure you've weighed all the options and are doing it in the most safe way possible for your situation.

    Additionally, as we are advising new folks on this option, I think it's important that we make sure they understand that this is not without risk. I don't want to spook them, but it's irresponsible as a "DISchurner" adviser to not at least make sure they understand that this is a loophole and (a) could be shutdown and (b) could come with some level of consequence at some point in the future.


    I'm interested to hear anybody else's thoughts on this - even if you're opposed or feel I'm being overly paranoid here...
    I am actually a little nervous about the whole CIPpy cup but I keep doing it because I want the points lol. Has anyone gone for #4 yet?
     

    palhockeymomof2

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Nov 14, 2001
    Drinking from the CIPpy cup...what could go wrong?

    I've been pondering something today, and I feel it's worth sharing. I want to preface this by saying, I personally am ok with the risk of CIPpy and will continue to drink until the cup spills over.

    That said, it's worth pointing out that Chase is not afraid to shutdown accounts if they feel abuse has taken place. Earlier this year, a loophole was shared on r/churning that you could generate support links to any Chase card by manipulating the link. This essentially unlocked a backdoor self-support method. Shortly thereafter, it was discovered that these support bonuses had to be posted manually by Chase and could draw unwanted attention to your account. We subsequently decided here, that we would not support this backdoor "self-support" method and we removed all mention of it.

    After this occurred, Chase sent letters out to some of r/churning's support link "super users" (more like super receivers) who had used the ability to PC their card multiple times to max out support points two and three times on the same card within one year. Some of these users also had participated in the link manipulation shared above.

    The text in that letter said:
    We reviewed your credit card account and it appears as though certain transactions represent a misuse of the rewards program...If this activity continues or if there is any other misuse or misrepresentation by you, we may close this and any other accounts you have with Chase.

    A picture of that letter can be seen here:
    The users who received these warning letters all were clear that they felt it tied to support links and I believe a couple may have called in to confirm that. Then, in a somewhat shocking move, one of those folks who received a letter actually had some of their cards shutdown by Chase (presumably for the same activity as there was no other logical reason for the shutdown). It's worth noting though, that in all instances, they did not clawback any rewards.

    How does this tie to CIPpy you may ask? Well it seems that Chase can decide in their sole discretion what they deem to be abuse of their rewards program. Could they decide that repeatedly getting the same card to earn the signup bonus while simultaneously "self-supporting" was an abuse? I certainly think so. It is almost a certainty that this loophole will cease to exist at some point in the future. Nobody can tell you how far away that is, and nobody can tell you what (if any) consequences may occur when it gets shutdown. I will reiterate, that I am not going to stop drinking from CIPpy... But, I am going to try my best to follow some rules to cip safely:
    • I will always do P1=>P2 or P2=>P1 clicks. I know that might not be possible for all (especially those in 1 player mode) but if this is an option, embrace it! Avoiding a true "self-support" click is much more defensible. In the recent Amex clawback debacle, nobody who was supporting via this method experienced any clawback,.
    • Follow your pacing guidelines, don't try to accelerate the timeline and do 1 a month. It's just not worth the risk of getting yourself shutdown on your own.
    • If you want to be paranoid, you may also consider trying to mix up your business type with each application. Perhaps you own multiple successful "businesses" and you purely were pursuing the best small business card on the market for each business...
    Please don't stop drinking from CIPpy because of this comment...just make sure you've weighed all the options and are doing it in the most safe way possible for your situation.

    Additionally, as we are advising new folks on this option, I think it's important that we make sure they understand that this is not without risk. I don't want to spook them, but it's irresponsible as a "DISchurner" adviser to not at least make sure they understand that this is a loophole and (a) could be shutdown and (b) could come with some level of consequence at some point in the future.


    I'm interested to hear anybody else's thoughts on this - even if you're opposed or feel I'm being overly paranoid here...
    I have similar concerns and am maybe being too cautious but I’ve thought about alternating CIP applications with CIU....or a Chase personal card
    right now we each have 2 CIPs...both of mine with SS...DH has one with SS and one with EIN.....wouldn’t do another Chase application until September so time to think about it
     
    Last edited:

    disfanforlife

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Nov 9, 2006
    I have similar concerns and am maybe being too cautious but I’ve thought about alternating CIP applications with CIU....
    right now we each have 2 CIPs...both of mine with SS...DH has one with SS and one with EIN.....wouldn’t do another Chase application until September so time to think about it
    I have been thinking about it too. But since I am new to this, we aren’t there yet. DH has his first CIP right now and I plan to use referral from him in September for my first. I may just space them out more than 3 months or try for double dip CSR/CSP in between.
     

    GlamMistress

    Resident Metalhead
    Joined
    Jul 18, 2017
    Drinking from the CIPpy cup...what could go wrong?
    Shorter: Bulls make money. Bears make money. Pigs get slaughtered. Don't be a pig. That's the number 1 rule that I believe applies to ALL of churning.

    Don't go so hard that it is clear you are abusing a method and drawing eyes to your account (and thus exposing a loophole).
     
  • palhockeymomof2

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Nov 14, 2001
    I have been thinking about it too. But since I am new to this, we aren’t there yet. DH has his first CIP right now and I plan to use referral from him in September for my first. I may just space them out more than 3 months or try for double dip CSR/CSP in between.
    I like your strategy....if we didn’t each have a Sapphire card I’d do the same....DH is at 4/24...so just business cards for him until 4/20.....I am 3/24...and drop to 2/24 ..10/19...but the only Chase personal card I’m interested in is the CF....hard to go for 15k URs vs CIPs100k
     

    Judique

    Dis Veteran, Beach Lover at BWV, BCV, HHI, VB
    Joined
    Aug 1, 2003
    We're under a heat advisory here now...the power went out a couple hours ago. Hopefully it comes back soon. Went to Sam's to kill time and did my shopping. Did not get Dosh. :(
    Got the call from Pepco that today is an energy savings day, meaning if you reduce energy consumption between 1-5pm they will give you a bill credit. I usually try to do this. The plan is do errands during that time frame, so today I'll visit Staples and CVS.
     
  • miztressuz

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Feb 23, 2011
    HT to u/lulz_were_had on r/churning - the new Hilton personal sign up bonuses are available through the support links now.

    The Surpass 130k+FNC and no fee 90k both show when I look from our Hilton Biz link. The Hilton Biz link itself is still showing the 125k offer. I don't know if that's just because it's not updated yet or if I'd have to generate a new support link from that card to see it. Someone else would have to check on that :)

    Edit:formatting
     
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    Judique

    Dis Veteran, Beach Lover at BWV, BCV, HHI, VB
    Joined
    Aug 1, 2003
    So before I could contact chase about upgrading my Marriott Rewards Visa (it’s now the Bonvoy Visa I believe), I got an email from them.
    It gave me the chance to get two free nights at a 35,000 point or less hotel if I upgraded to the Marriott Bonvoy Boundless. Then my yearly fee would go up to $95, and I would get a free 35,000 a night hotel night each year on the anniversary.
    WWYD? Is it worth it to contact chase and ask for something better? Or is this the best I’m going to get?
    I never use this card and was honestly thinking about just closing it bc the free night at 25,000 points or less seemed worthless to me, but I have a balance on a card to pay off first. The upgrade to 35,000 a night free night may be worth it but I’m not sure? I get a 35,000 a night hotel stay from my Amex.
    If it matters I’m currently at 4/24. I have Gold Elite status. I have the following cards:
    Citibank AA card
    Amex Bonvoy (original SPG one)
    CF
    Disney Visa
    CSP
    SW Plus
    SW premier

    Sorry for the ramble...Thanks in advance to you super helpful experts:)
    I would do it for 2 free 35k nights. 70K points would be better for flexibility but you can get a lot of value out of the offer, if you are planning a points trip or a free weekend somewhere. It mostly depends on whether you will use them. I figure at some point they will have gotten most upgraded and will stop offering an incentive, so there is a sweet spot somewhere.
     

    speedyfishy

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Apr 3, 2016
    It's honestly starting to feel like an absurd joke that I still haven't been able to order MBs. I really don't understand how Disney has screwed up the $10 MBs so badly.
    It’s so annoying. I have stopped trying. My next trip is in December so hopefully it’s fixed by then. They were available for our June trip but I never got an order to go through so we missed out. I’m still bummed about that. There are so many I want for $10 lol
     

    amalone1013

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Jan 15, 2016
    Got the call from Pepco that today is an energy savings day, meaning if you reduce energy consumption between 1-5pm they will give you a bill credit. I usually try to do this. The plan is do errands during that time frame, so today I'll visit Staples and CVS.
    I keep waiting for there to be a power limit here, since its been so warm. Then we have to keep our usage below a certain limit which for us basically means shut it down... sometimes we can buy our way through though. Ah, capitalism :rotfl:
     

    DisneyMandC

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Feb 18, 2015
    It’s so annoying. I have stopped trying. My next trip is in December so hopefully it’s fixed by then. They were available for our June trip but I never got an order to go through so we missed out. I’m still bummed about that. There are so many I want for $10 lol
    I have 30 more days to order but I've literally been trying everyday, multiple times a day and can't get anything to go through. It's ridiculous.
     

    Lain

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Oct 4, 2014
    HT to u/lulz_were_had on r/churning - the new Hilton personal sign up bonuses are available through the support links now.

    The Surpass 130k+FNC and no fee 90k both show when I look from our Hilton Biz link. The Hilton Biz link itself is still showing the 125k offer. I don't know if that's just because it's not updated yet or if I'd have to generate a new support link from that card to see it. Someone else would have to check on that :)
    I think this news needs to be in bold with a larger font size! This is what people have been waiting for!
     

    Judique

    Dis Veteran, Beach Lover at BWV, BCV, HHI, VB
    Joined
    Aug 1, 2003
    0/2 in trying to get Marriott nights paid with my points credited to hubby's account. This time seemed promising as front desk was able to add hubby's number to the reservation and asked if we wanted points or pantry item, went with points - mistake. Since whatever she did didn't take, no points and no night credit. Doesn't seem to be in the cards for us.
    Hmmm,,,,,this was the original point of contention when we had problems with a stay last May. I was trying to pay, and was trying to give the credits to daughter for plat status for next year. It got incredibly confused and I basically ended up with a free stay and cash credit (none of which I asked for or felt entitled to). Marriott's system doesn't seem to like change or any 'change' requests. It also took a while but eventually night credit showed on both our accounts.
     
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