First time Disneyland Resort thoughts from WDW Veteran.

[dieumeye]

Do you think most merch, dining reservations, hotel property stays, etc are being spent by locals?

I bet a lot more are than you might think. Do not underestimate how much locals spend. This idea that locals only come to the park for an hour or two, don’t spend any money, and then go home is not everyone, and maybe not even typical.

Why does DL constantly have new limited time stuff in the park - food, cups, popcorn buckets, ears, etc? And who keeps visiting and buying it? If it’s only infrequent visitors, then they don’t need to constantly change things up.

An out of town visitor might have a couple meals, a snack, buy a couple shirts, and some souvenirs. There are locals who will do all that and more many many times over in a year... some even weekly. And out of town guests have already spent money on travel, so they are probably looking to spend less than someone who has no travel expenses and has already paid off their pass.

My point is, I know I spend way too much in the park (!!!) and yet I’m a total lightweight when it comes to other APs I know. So it’s just hard for me to imagine that someone visiting from out of town for a few days could possibly spend as much as a local who visits all the time.

 

[IAmDis]

YESSSSSSSS! Disney needs to get through their heads that they need to stop trying to appease locals so much and start acting like a tourist destination. Sure, it's close to actual residents and SoCal has so many people. But the monthly payments, SoCal resident ticket promotions are ruining the guest experience IMO. Not because locals are poor guests but because the millions of passholders are becoming where they don't appreciate the park as much (I'm generalizing, I know MANY are not this way and I myself am a passholder but not local). Disneyland is starting to feel like it's a right instead of a privilege or something to work towards. Whenever I suggest eliminating the monthly payments for CA residents, I can't tell you how many people say "then I can't afford to take my kids like I do now"... okay, totally get that. But who says your kids should go to DL 5-10 times a year? I know I'm going to get a lot of flack for this. And I totally get on a soapbox tangent about that. I just think Disney is afraid for the bad publicity the locals will give them for eliminating the monthly payments and no more SoCal pass. Or they no longer care about the guest experience. Okay I'm done. I hope I didn't offend anyone. It's just observations I have found over the past handful of years.

I can't stand the monthly option. I'm perfectly happy to pay full price up front for it. It's expensive, but worth it.

What bugs me the most is NOW they introduce this Flex pass and it just invites MORE hoards of people to the park. Doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

The #1 complaint from guests is that the price is too high and it's too crowded. So what do they do? Add a pass that's cheaper, allow monthly payments on it AND have reservation days for almost any day they want. They literally created a monster. This is just asking for peak capacity days. Remove the monthly pass option!

As for the OP - I kinda liken it to people from New York who come to LA. When they get here, they are very confused, as LA is on a whole different vibe and has a very odd way of how the county and cities work (freeways, cars, traffic, etc). But if you grew up in SoCal, you eventually understand it and appreciate it for what it is. Same goes for WDWers who come here. It's definitely a Disney culture shock. But you gotta remember, there is no WDW without DL, and this is where it all started. Areas are smaller, outside traffic can be heard outside, bums walk the streets right up to the entrance, CMs wait for buses and locals crowd the park like crazy, but that's the charm of the DLR. It's very old-school.

DLR will never be a tourist destination because people in in SoCal make up the majority of the park attendance. 80% locals, 20% tourists, while WDW is the opposite. People in LA and OC grew up at the park, especially OCers, as this is our home away from home. This is where we hung out as kids with our families, then when High School came around, this is where we hung out every Fri and Sat night, smoking cigarettes, trying to get girls, go on rides, eat bad food, and live life. Some of us got our first kiss here (not me, mine was at Knotts!), or was the first place where you got to hang out with your friends without parents around, etc. And this was during the school year because when Summer came around, forget it! It was mayhem. Teens ruled the park in every which way. Can you imagine 100-200 kids smoking and hanging out in front of the castle every Fri/Sat night? I remember those days. DL security couldn't do anything, so they eventually had to renovate Tomorrowland, remove benches to ease loitering and ban kids smoking cigarettes... ah, the days...

For a lot of SoCal residents, the DLR is home, life and everything else wrapped into one. If they start making this a tourist destination, it will backfire badly for them.

 

[Mike_M]

I’ve been trying to come up with a way to describe what I’m thinking here. In the end, I think what it is is this:

Disneyland (for me at least) is a very Californian experience.

Growing up in the Bay Area, we would make our every other year or so pilgrimage south on highway 101 with DL as the final destination. Along the way, I’d stare out the window at the sights along the highway. The towns we’d pass through. Seeing the Ocean. It was all magical in its own way.

We’d get to one of the motels on Katella in the early afternoon, check in, then head to Knotts for the rest of the day. It was always our ‘warm up’ park. We’d hit some rides, then settle down for their fried chicken dinner before heading back to the motel for a good night’s rest in anticipation of our usual three full days in DL. Some trips, we’d stay longer and go explore Universal Studios and parts of L.A. also.

Most of my other family trips back then had similarities to those Disneyland trips. Going up to the Redwoods or down to Monterey or Santa Cruz, we’d still have plenty to see out the window of the car. We stayed at motels and enjoyed not only the destination, but the area itself too.

With that, I put my vote in with keeping it a locals focused park. Even though I haven’t lived in CA for over 20 years, When I go, it feels like I’ve gone back home;

and I think it’s because of that focus.

I’m not saying you have to be a Californian to enjoy or feel connected to DL. Just that for those of us that did live close enough to not have to fly there, it was definitely part of the experience of living there. It’s a different bubble, but a bubble none the less.

 

[tinkerjo]

We live in Ohio and have been to WDW every other year forever but we’re fortunate to go to DL a couple years ago when visiting our daughter ( a wife of a marine) in San Diego. While we loved different aspects the the parks, we thought the CMs were rude and we felt more like we were at Cedar Point then at Disney. The “feel” wasn’t there. It definitely was a different experience, not bad, just not what I was expecting

 

[Brett Wyman]

Did you not use max pass or fast pass? We just got back from WDW-man, we got so much less done in a day with FP+ than we do at DL with MP.

Yes we had Maxpass, park hopper and were staying at an onsite hotel. So we had all the perks. My only real complaint, but is a big one for me as it changes my touring style, is the fact that the most popular ride's FPs are gone by noon and that once you grab one of those FPs they are usually later in the day and then you are stuck for nearly 2 hours with no way to book a FP. Sure you could not grab one early and refresh the app later in the day and see if you get lucky, but its not ideal. The wall of people coming to a full stop just after the entry gates to grab their FPs shows me something is not perfect with this system : )

 

[dieumeye]

My only real complaint, but is a big one for me as it changes my touring style, is the fact that the most popular ride's FPs are gone by noon

FPs gone by noon?? Well, that’s better than FP+ gone weeks in advance!

 

[midnight star]

Yes we had Maxpass, park hopper and were staying at an onsite hotel. So we had all the perks. My only real complaint, but is a big one for me as it changes my touring style, is the fact that the most popular ride's FPs are gone by noon and that once you grab one of those FPs they are usually later in the day and then you are stuck for nearly 2 hours with no way to book a FP. Sure you could not grab one early and refresh the app later in the day and see if you get lucky, but its not ideal. The wall of people coming to a full stop just after the entry gates to grab their FPs shows me something is not perfect with this system : )

For maxpass usage, it's generally better to pick rides with immediate or close return times early on. Then when you feel like waiting 90 minutes, you pick a ride like RSR. That way you get a lot done and have a better chance of "stacking" return times.

What days did you go? If fastpasses were gone by noon then that must've been a high crowd week. So yeah I could see how if you aren't used to the maxpass system it could make it seem like the fastpass go too fast.

 

[Brett Wyman]

FPs gone by noon?? Well, that’s better than FP+ gone weeks in advance!

Right but I didn't have to enter the park at 9am to get them. I got those FPs from the comfort of my computer 60 days before. And I can enter the park at noon for my 1pm 7DMT FP. If you entered CA at noon you would not be riding Mission Breakout or Radiator Racers without a 90 minute wait. And if you DO enter at 9am and grab one you are then blocked out of any other FPs rides for 90 minutes. Those are my issues.

For maxpass usage, it's generally better to pick rides with immediate or close return times early on. Then when you feel like waiting 90 minutes, you pick a ride like RSR.

This points out my issues with the system. I NEVER have to get in long standby lines at WDW.

 

[sjmac42]

Nope, keep the 60 day 3 FP system in WDW thanks all the same, I much prefer the FP system at DL. I’m actually worried MaxPass may well lead to advance booking of FP at DLR. hopefully the fact there are so many more AP’s for DL will stop that happening.
Yes it is smaller but MK manages to seem just as crowded, if not more so, with half again the area. Also means everything is right there, both parks, the hotels, DD. No need for a bus, taxi, rideshare, boat or monorail.
No need to add any more FP attractions, I found it silly that everything at WDW has a Fastpass. I mean Lion King, really . . . . Also, standby lines move much quicker without a FP line.
DLR is also much more spontaneous IMO. With 2-3 days you can turn up and do pretty much anything you want, rides, shows, wander around. You can’t do that at WDW.
Anyway, glad you enjoyed yourself, I won’t be back to WDW for a long long time, I’ll stick with Disneyland and the Asian Parks.
All the best.

 

[DizMe]

I enjoyed your report. It was thoughtfully written and honest. I think it would be rare to have grown up with a park, then go to the sister property and not find it less comfortable. That's just human nature. I'm glad you could acknowledge that and appreciate the good things.

I'm one of those that grew up with Disneyland. My family lived an hour away and my grandma lived a few miles away. My parents grew up in the area. My first visit was in 1956; I'm 6 months younger than DLR so I don't remember that visit but I have so many fond memories--going with my family and then back to my grandma's while my mom and dad went dancing in Tomorrowland; several birthdays celebrated by bringing a friend; getting dropped off at the front gate with my brother and sister for kid-only visits (I doubt that's legal anymore but we felt so free). I feel like DL and I grew up together.

When I went to WDW in my 30s, I was enchanted by the vastness and beauty of the area. I loved the monorail ride! I loved much of what I saw but I was disconcerted by Magic Kingdom. This is a bad analogy but it was like walking into a Target in another town where the layout is nearly the same as your own store but the differences throw you off and make you uncomfortable. So I understand completely that it's hard to prefer something different to what you've always known and loved. I found it impossible to like MK as much as I love DL, in spite of many things I thought were awesome and--yes--better than my park. I think that's why you prefer DCA; it's not that same-but-different thing and there really isn't anything that your mind & heart (for lack of a better word) is trying to compare it to.

 

[DLgal]

Tourists are the bread and butter now. Locals spend a couple hours at the most, pay $30 a month for a pass. Do you think most merch, dining reservations, hotel property stays, etc are being spent by locals? And the locals live in SoCal... if they are making monthly payments on a DL AP, will they continue to do so with skyrocketing rental prices to still pay? I'm totally seeing what you're saying (and you could be totally correct in the future when the economy hits the skids), but I think the tide has turned in terms of the type of park Disneyland is now. It's not a locals park and with everything they have in store, it won't change anytime soon regardless of economy. Just my personal opinion and I know it's not shared by all.

Saying that, I've taken this way off the point of the post so I apologize.

No, tourists are not the bread and butter. Disneyland survives on its AP population. Not everyone in So Cal is poor. Arguably, the ones with APs are the ones with money to spend. Not everyone rents and rents are not always perpetually going up. We have rented for 18 years now and some years, our rent went down. It's all a function of the market. Regardless, the APs DO spend a ton of $$$, collectively, on food, merch, and hotel stays. If they didn't, Disney wouldn't offer discounts on those things. I spend more on merch at DL than I do as a tourist at WDW. Just got back from WDW and spent a grand total of $150 on merch, because I kept saying "I can just buy that at DL 20% cheaper." I've posted it before, but we spend $250/month for our AP payment (that's just the half of the cost of 4 signature passes plus maxpass that we financed), but have already dropped a collective $10000 as local DL visitors in the last 9 months. We go a LOT. Like, every weekend, plus I go randomly duringbthe week JUST to have lunch and shop. We are not rich, are renters, but this is how we spend our disposable income.

 

[midnight star]

This points out my issues with the system. I NEVER have to get in long standby lines at WDW.

The 90 minutes isn't the standby line, but the time you pick your next fastpass. You would start the day choosing close return times, then you would choose a ride return time that allows you to wait 90 minutes before choosing another (sorry, I'm horrible at explaining fastpass stuff, I rarely do it lol).

But anyway, glad you guys had fun! I haven't been to WDW since I was little, but from what I've heard from my parents, and on the boards is that they are both fun in their own right, just different! Hopefully I'll take a trip to WDW in the near future to see how this FP+ stuff works

 

[DLgal]

Yes we had Maxpass, park hopper and were staying at an onsite hotel. So we had all the perks. My only real complaint, but is a big one for me as it changes my touring style, is the fact that the most popular ride's FPs are gone by noon and that once you grab one of those FPs they are usually later in the day and then you are stuck for nearly 2 hours with no way to book a FP. Sure you could not grab one early and refresh the app later in the day and see if you get lucky, but its not ideal. The wall of people coming to a full stop just after the entry gates to grab their FPs shows me something is not perfect with this system : )

You did it wrong, then. I had an out of state friend come visit last August and we spent 3 days in the parks and never waited more than 20 min in a standby line, and did all the major rides several times. You need to stack the Maxpasses by getting the next one with the earliest time and just go from one fastpass entrance to the next, to the next. When you want to do a headliner, you grab it and then find the rides with the lowest waits and do those for 90 minutes. It's not hard. You also have to know about and use single rider lines to your advantage. There are several at DL and DCA (way more than WDW has).

We used at least 10-15 maxpasses each day, easy. At WDW 2 weeks ago, even using refresh and the 4th FP, we never did more than about 6 FP rides. The issue with the revolving 4th and having to wait until you ride that one to get another was a hindrence when the only return times were late at night.

 

[Rich M]

I think there will always be the people love DL crowd and the people love DW crowd. I am in the middle. I love the MP and I like the 60 day advance FP at DW. I find that MP is far better when getting multiple FP but I do like booking my evening FP at DW ahead of time and going for rope drop getting in line. I prefer to stand in line in the morning then in the evening. I have never been to Cedar Fairs so not sure if that is an insult to DL or not but I will say if you go to Six Flags Magic Mountain and then go to DL you will notice that DL is superior in cleanliness and Customer Service. Overall one thing brings us all together and that is our love for Disney.

 

[KPeterso]

I definitely agree with you on many points and I am a die hard DLR go-er of maybe 35+ times in the past almost 34 years. The GC couch sleepers is definitely a problem. I was annoyed to no end about that. I am a DVC owner there so it definitely grinds my gears and it takes a way from the cozy escape that GC really is (or can be if they stopping people from doing this!). I also love DCA and find myself there a lot more than I used to- especially when I'm not with my kids. Also agree about GOTG (and I was a huge ToT fan!), etc.

Now, saying that... the CM's. I will say 95% of them are absolutely fantastic and magical. The only place I don't find this is actually in Fantasyland. I feel like the CM's on those rides hate their lives or something haha. But I have experiences so much Disney magic every single time I go by a CM. I love MaxPass- I would rather have that than scheduling my FPs 60 days out and sometimes never having a chance at FoP or SDMT at WDW. And I am a planner. But I also like to where if I want to do something, I have a good opportunity to do so. If I attend at rope drop, I can go on as many as 6-8 very popular attractions before lunch. Sometimes more. Impossible at WDW. Saying that, there are a few things WDW does than I wish DL would do so I'm not trying to be a totally biased DL fan.



YESSSSSSSS! Disney needs to get through their heads that they need to stop trying to appease locals so much and start acting like a tourist destination. Sure, it's close to actual residents and SoCal has so many people. But the monthly payments, SoCal resident ticket promotions are ruining the guest experience IMO. Not because locals are poor guests but because the millions of passholders are becoming where they don't appreciate the park as much (I'm generalizing, I know MANY are not this way and I myself am a passholder but not local). Disneyland is starting to feel like it's a right instead of a privilege or something to work towards. Whenever I suggest eliminating the monthly payments for CA residents, I can't tell you how many people say "then I can't afford to take my kids like I do now"... okay, totally get that. But who says your kids should go to DL 5-10 times a year? I know I'm going to get a lot of flack for this. And I totally get on a soapbox tangent about that. I just think Disney is afraid for the bad publicity the locals will give them for eliminating the monthly payments and no more SoCal pass. Or they no longer care about the guest experience. Okay I'm done. I hope I didn't offend anyone. It's just observations I have found over the past handful of years.

I 100% agree with you about eliminating the monthly payment plan. That is when the true overcrowding problem started. And there are ways to save monthly for a pass. I buy my pass outright every year (and i get Premier so uber expensive pass), but I put money aside every month towards my pass by buying Disney gift cards at Target and saving the 5% off. I try to buy around $200 per month to put towards the pass, but there are months where it is less.

 

[Brett Wyman]

When I went to WDW in my 30s, I was enchanted by the vastness and beauty of the area. I loved the monorail ride! I loved much of what I saw but I was disconcerted by Magic Kingdom. This is a bad analogy but it was like walking into a Target in another town where the layout is nearly the same as your own store but the differences throw you off and make you uncomfortable. So I understand completely that it's hard to prefer something different to what you've always known and loved. I found it impossible to like MK as much as I love DL, in spite of many things I thought were awesome and--yes--better than my park. I think that's why you prefer DCA; it's not that same-but-different thing and there really isn't anything that your mind & heart (for lack of a better word) is trying to compare it to.

Excellent point. Where there was nothing to compare I loved every minute of it. Still loved DL as well, but as you mentioned 40 years of comparisons to live up to. Even if one is better in some ways its still not "what you're use to".

You did it wrong, then. I had an out of state friend come visit last August and we spent 3 days in the parks and never waited more than 20 min in a standby line, and did all the major rides several times. You need to stack the Maxpasses by getting the next one with the earliest time and just go from one fastpass entrance to the next, to the next. When you want to do a headliner, you grab it and then find the rides with the lowest waits and do those for 90 minutes. It's not hard. You also have to know about and use single rider lines to your advantage. There are several at DL and DCA (way more than WDW has).

We used at least 10-15 maxpasses each day, easy. At WDW 2 weeks ago, even using refresh and the 4th FP, we never did more than about 6 FP rides. The issue with the revolving 4th and having to wait until you ride that one to get another was a hindrence when the only return times were late at night.

We didn't do it wrong. We did it just like that and simply don't care for the "go ride the other stand by rides for 90 minutes part". I never ride standby lines with waits at WDW, never. I can always get a FP for all but the top tier rides(which would have been booked previously) instantaneously. You're right Maxpass is not hard at all. I just don't care for it. But it does fit Disneyland's day park mentality.

 

[LizzyS]

I can see your points mostly, but with "To me MK is just much more magical.", you've lost me.

I just experienced MK last year and, though I absolutely enjoyed it in its own right, in no way did I find it more magical than DL because of wider pathways, bigger castle, or the like, that's for sure.

I'll take the park that Walt built. That's where the magic all originates- Walt Disney.

 

[twodogs]

Can anyone give a source for the 80% locals, 20% tourists statistic?

 

[nikerbokers]

Not everyone in So Cal is poor. Arguably, the ones with APs are the ones with money to spend. Not everyone rents and rents are not always perpetually going up.

I am pretty sure you took what I said and made it much worse. I didn't say everyone or anyone in SoCal was poor in the least. But CA is usually the most affected by downturn in economy because of the over inflated property prices and sky high rents. I lived in CA for over 30 years (I moved out 2 years ago) and have seen it happen almost a decade ago. I also didn't say AP's were the problem. I said monthly payments need to be eliminated. If they have the money to spend, then elimination of monthly payments shouldn't affect those people correct? I have an AP, I know the business and economics behind having annual passes. I don't think they should eliminate most AP's. I am saying there is no reason to have monthly payments at this time when the park is absolutely packed all the time. It's not a 80/20 anymore. I would say it's more of a 70/30 or even close to 65/35 in terms of locals and tourists.

 

[gerilyne]

I love both parks for different reasons. I like DLR where I don't have to plan as much and since I live on the west coast it is perfect for a quick getaway for a few days (for me that's a week) to ride rides, pop between parks and just go with the flow. I look at WDW (which granted I have only been to once with FP+ in my lifetime) as where I go when I want longer than a week, and want to plan out my days. I had no issues going in June to WDW getting the 3 FP+ selections in the morning, and then going with the flow the rest of the day. We were able to ride many headliners with ease during our time there, and even more so when my sister and her family left and there was just 2 of us maneuvering the parks. Each park has it's pluses and minuses, and everyone will love them differently but in the end, a trip to either Disney park is better than not being at one.