College Board's new SAT "Adversity Scores" will impact college admissions

[ronandannette]

I don’t know. This article was a helpful read.
https://ed100.org/lessons/poverty
https://www.educationnext.org/americas-mediocre-test-scores-education-poverty-crisis/

Some kids are able to overcome their upbringing and succeed in college. A had a couple of friends in college who grew up very poor, one was also first generation and they worked their butts off, graduated and are now successful with good paying jobs in the engineering field.

Thank you. Do you happen to know how they performed in highschool? Just speculating but my guess is they were equally motivated and successful there, which is a little different from my understanding of this discussion.

I like the idea. I think there are a lot of kids from disadvantaged areas that are prepared for higher education, but who don't look as good on paper due to a lack of AP classes (our public high school doesn't offer them) and weighted GPAs, the money to cultivate a stellar extracurricular resume, etc., but unless they're applying only to local colleges, it is unlikely that the admissions officer reviewing their applications has any idea what kind of environment they come from. Yes, there is the school profile counselors are suppose to submit along with the transcript, but with the number of applications schools are receiving hitting all-time highs year after year, that's something we've been told a lot of schools don't really have time to spend much time on. Reducing those same factors to a score that is attached to the student's SAT score increases the chances that admission officers will be able to take it into account.

Those are very insightful thoughts and not ones that immediately came to mind. Thanks.

 

[QueenIsabella]

I am very uncomfortable with the idea of comparing and ranking adversity. Some adversity is obvious, some is not-and it is not always linked to your neighborhood stats or your wealth. Often times we have no idea what trials people are facing because they keep them private. To say "your adversity counts while yours doesn't" seems wrong on many, many levels.

This. There are obvious disadvantages, and less obvious ones. Your family might have money and a good zip code, but how do you account for a parent with a mental illness, or gambling addiction, or terminal cancer? Any of those is going to affect a child's approach to life.

 

[mjkacmom]

I recently attended a county athletic scholar award ceremony, 2 kids from each school with top stats who were also HS athletes, ranging from very low income towns to very high income towns ($30,000 median income vs. $600,000). The stats for each student was announced. There were valedictorians with 3.4 GPA’s and 1050 SAT scores going to local community colleges, and students with 4.5 GPA’s and 1570 SAT’s ranked only in the top 10% of their class going to Princeton. Our town was more in the middle, but I can’t imagine the #1 in the class only having a 1050 SAT or 3.4 GPA. Obviously there is more opportunities for those with money, including education.

 

[georgina]

I like the idea. Both of my DDs who grew up in mostly white suburbs were looking for diversity in college. The youngest ended up at a liberal arts school which met full need and her class was quite diverse. I think she learned a lot from those with different perspectives. The school did have a lot of supports, not just for poorer students, but for every student.

As for how you talk about adversity other than being poor, there are a couple of chances. The student essay is a good opportunity to talk about that, also the guidance counselor writes something for the application.

It has always been said that the hardest part of Harvard is getting in. Many students would be able to do the work.

 

[Wishing on a star]

We are talking about college Academia here.
This is just another sounds-feel-good, and backhanded way to try to hand something to one person, and make the other person 'pay' because they don't have enough 'supposed' disadvantage.
Nothing more. Nothing less.

Two things that I find troubling.
1. This is very private and personal information, which should not be requested and evaluated by a public institution. (Private Colleges can do as they wish)
In any other world/situation, this kind of thing could be called discriminatory.
2. The fact that all of this information is not even made available to the college applicant (or parent(s)). This is personal information and a judgement is being made based on this information, and the individual has no right to this information and this judgment call that is affecting their life. Too much Big Brother for me.

The lack of transparency, to me, is disturbing and makes me wonder what 'stinks' here, what are they hiding.

 

[Wishing on a star]

I was in a zero disadvantage zip code. Double the value of the 'advantaged' score.
But, personally, I was VERY disadvantaged in many many ways.
There is absolutely no way anybody would apply a meaningful score to a college application based on what is being described.
And, I would have no way to even know my 'score', much less challenge or question it.

 

[QueenIsabella]

I like the idea. Both of my DDs who grew up in mostly white suburbs were looking for diversity in college. The youngest ended up at a liberal arts school which met full need and her class was quite diverse. I think she learned a lot from those with different perspectives. The school did have a lot of supports, not just for poorer students, but for every student.

As for how you talk about adversity other than being poor, there are a couple of chances. The student essay is a good opportunity to talk about that, also the guidance counselor writes something for the application.

It has always been said that the hardest part of Harvard is getting in. Many students would be able to do the work.

Yeah, sure, if you want to put it "out there" in a personal essay, rather than talk about something else. Or if the guidance counselor actually knows that your dad, the successful executive, actually is an alcoholic who beats his kids. I know when I was writing college essays, I wouldn't have wanted to talk about my bi-polar mother. Now, it doesn't bother me, but it's something you have to be careful about putting out there. For one thing, my mother would have made my life a living hell if she found out. For another, sometimes people are, shall we say, concerned about it being genetic. So, I can see why a HS aged kid might not want that to be the focus of a college essay.

 

[georgina]

Yeah, sure, if you want to put it "out there" in a personal essay, rather than talk about something else. Or if the guidance counselor actually knows that your dad, the successful executive, actually is an alcoholic who beats his kids. I know when I was writing college essays, I wouldn't have wanted to talk about my bi-polar mother. Now, it doesn't bother me, but it's something you have to be careful about putting out there. For one thing, my mother would have made my life a living hell if she found out. For another, sometimes people are, shall we say, concerned about it being genetic. So, I can see why a HS aged kid might not want that to be the focus of a college essay.

OK, so you had a terrible childhood, that means no one else should get any extra consideration for their circumstances? Absolutely nothing will satisfy everyone. It doesn't mean they shouldn't try.

 

[Colleen27]

This. There are obvious disadvantages, and less obvious ones. Your family might have money and a good zip code, but how do you account for a parent with a mental illness, or gambling addiction, or terminal cancer? Any of those is going to affect a child's approach to life.

Of course there is no system that can account for every circumstance. But individual hardship is something that can be leveraged into a powerful admissions essay. General lack of opportunity in the schools and community, not as much.

Besides, is the fact that a system can't objectively measure every hardship really a good reason that no one's hardship should ever be taken into account?

 

[MillauFr]

let the cream rise to the top

Except the cream is usually money, not talent.

 

[QueenIsabella]

OK, so you had a terrible childhood, that means no one else should get any extra consideration for their circumstances? Absolutely nothing will satisfy everyone. It doesn't mean they shouldn't try.

Of course there is no system that can account for every circumstance. But individual hardship is something that can be leveraged into a powerful admissions essay. General lack of opportunity in the schools and community, not as much.

Besides, is the fact that a system can't objectively measure every hardship really a good reason that no one's hardship should ever be taken into account?

I think for sure, colleges should take into account someone's background and adversities they may have had to overcome. I just don't see a place for it in the SAT tests. That's why colleges use a number of factors, including essays and personal interviews, to get to know candidates better. And for sure if you've filled out an application, the college knows your zip code. And certainly, if a student has less than stellar stats, they should use the essay or interview to explain that they're working full-time to support their family since Mom had a stroke.

 

[Skippy918]

I think for sure, colleges should take into account someone's background and adversities they may have had to overcome. I just don't see a place for it in the SAT tests. That's why colleges use a number of factors, including essays and personal interviews, to get to know candidates better. And for sure if you've filled out an application, the college knows your zip code. And certainly, if a student has less than stellar stats, they should use the essay or interview to explain that they're working full-time to support their family since Mom had a stroke.

What about the schools who get tens of thousands of applications? Do they read thru each essay? I also know that most apps the essay is optional.

 

[QueenIsabella]

What about the schools who get tens of thousands of applications? Do they read thru each essay? I also know that most apps the essay is optional.

I have no idea how schools weed through applications.

If I had a compelling story, I'd be making a point of doing an optional essay.

In any case, none of what you said makes an argument for the SATs being the place for this. IMHO, there already are devices in place to identify students who have overcome hardships in their lives.

 

[Colleen27]

I think for sure, colleges should take into account someone's background and adversities they may have had to overcome. I just don't see a place for it in the SAT tests. That's why colleges use a number of factors, including essays and personal interviews, to get to know candidates better. And for sure if you've filled out an application, the college knows your zip code. And certainly, if a student has less than stellar stats, they should use the essay or interview to explain that they're working full-time to support their family since Mom had a stroke.

There's a difference between knowing a zip code and knowing that zip code means that a 3.95 is a major accomplishment because there are no weighted classes or understanding that the student didn't avoid calculus or other very challenging courses out of lack of interest but rather because they weren't offered. The adversity score isn't dealing with individual circumstances like working because Mom had a stroke; that would make a great essay topic and would give the school real insight into the student's life and abilities. It is providing the information already available in school profiles and demographic data in a way that school admissions departments are more able to use, given the tens of thousands of applications they have to sort through each year. Admissions officers aren't going to take the time to look up each applicant's zip code to learn about the demographics of the area or browse their high school's course catalogs to get a sense for the rigor of the available curriculum, but if it is simplified into a single score, they can far more easily understand where the applicant is coming from.

 

[Sandeep1]

I always wondered if I could be a minority because I was raised in Appalachia?

I thought there was another thread in which you admitted your ancestors owned slaves? Pretty sure that alone eliminates the possibility of claiming minority status.

 

[mummabear]

I thought there was another thread in which you admitted your ancestors owned slaves? Pretty sure that alone eliminates the possibility of claiming minority status.

You cannot blame someone for the sins of their fore bearers.

 

[Sandeep1]

You cannot blame someone for the sins of their fore bearers.

Who's blaming them? They just aren't a minority.

 

[mummabear]

Who's blaming them? They just aren't a minority.

Native Americans held slaves, and yet the are absolutely a minority group.

One doesnt not rule out the other

 

[Sandeep1]

Native Americans held slaves, and yet the are absolutely a minority group.

One doesnt not rule out the other

Strawman. I was very clearly talking about Caucasians holding Black slaves.

 

[pxidst119]

The students are feeling so stressed and judged for the entire college admissions process as it is. This is just adds another thing.

I think colleges are already accessing much of the data they are trying to capture with this new score. I also don’t think you can truly measure the wide variety of hardships students have had to overcome.