Beach Club Availability

[_auroraborealis_]

Most DVC owners are bargain hunters. If they have a choice between 18/20 points for a Standard Riviera Studio (Dream) or a BCV Studio at 16/20, that's 10 points saved on a week's stay that includes two weekend nights.

The difference is more pronounced in Magic and Premier seasons (22/25 a night in Magic, 28/32 in Premier for Riviera, versus 18/22 and 25/28 at BCV). In Adventure, it's closer together, but good luck getting BCV at 7 months most of Adventure anyway. And that's assuming you can get Standard at Riviera, versus Preferred.

 

[RivShore]

BWV and BCV both have boat transportation to Epcot and DHS so no need to walk if you don't want to. I do have to say that it's much more convenient for BWV guests to get the boat then it is for BCV guest...



Don't take this the wrong way but I can see that Riviera is now going to be in competition with BW & BC as to which resort is better. There have been so many threads on this topic between BC & BW, it really boils down to personal preference and choice. To each his/her own, each resort is special in its own way. That is the beauty of DVC, there is a resort for everybody. What I like you might not and vice versa.

That being said I do look forward to visiting Riviera on my next trip to WDW. I will hold my opinion on this resort until I see it first hand and yes I do hope the Skyliner proves to be a reliable form of transportation.

No problem Ms. Minnie! And great to see you are reserving judgement until seeing it. So many have already decided it's the worst without ever setting foot in it.

 

[RivShore]

If your in search of low point rooms, you can certainly save over Riviera but I was just trying to point out that you actually get something for that 10-20% increase in points - you get 2 bath areas, 20% more square footage, 2 real queen beds, and its all brand new. If you were comparing rent on 2 apartments, you would expect expect to pay more monthly rent for one that had all those extras. Why would this be any different.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

If your in search of low point rooms, you can certainly save over Riviera but I was just trying to point out that you actually get something for that 10-20% increase in points - you get 2 bath areas, 20% more square footage, 2 real queen beds, and its all brand new. If you were comparing rent on 2 apartments, you would expect expect to pay more monthly rent for one that had all those extras. Why would this be any different.

All brand new is temporary. Point charts are forever.

 

[RivShore]

All brand new is temporary. Point charts are forever.

OK, even if you ignore the "new" part, you are still getting an objectively bigger and better room. For those 10-20% of additional points, you get 20% more space, a 2nd bath and a 2nd real bed. How can those extras be worth zero points? It's fine if you personally don't put any value on those extras, but larger families who spend more time in their resorts would, so there is logic in the higher points.

 

[Sandisw]

OK, even if you ignore the "new" part, you are still getting an objectively bigger and better room. For those 10-20% of additional points, you get 20% more space, a 2nd bath and a 2nd real bed. How can those extras be worth zero points? It's fine if you personally don't put any value on those extras, but larger families who spend more time in their resorts would, so there is logic in the higher points.

All great points and it goes back to the choice of individual owners deciding what is and is not worth it when using points.

I am now both a BWV and RIV owner..along with SSR...and can see the benefit of both resorts, irrespective of what it costs me to stay at each.

I will choose BWV and spend less points there when my trip, and those that I go with, makes sense to stay there. I will choose RIV when that makes sense,

I will also trade out of both those resorts, including SSR, when I want to stay elsewhere.

I just think there are no absolutes when it comes to DVC and what most will do. I agree with you that RIV comes with aspects that may make spending the extra points worth it, depending on ones needs.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

I think desirability of Riviera for a resort stày will come down to on site amenities.

People love BCV for the pool. The unit space matters less if your approach to resort time involves loungers.

 

[ScubaCat]

I considered trying Riviera, but it's more points for a 1br preferred (assuming that's all I'd get at 7 months) than a 2br at BCV. I can't ever justify that kind of difference. And I can walk to the epcot skyliner in a few minutes and drop by Riviera to partake in its restaurants and other amenities if I wanted to. If I paid the premium for Riviera, I'd lose access to SAB. Not much contest to me. I'll definitely check it out, but am not likely to ever stay there.

 

[ray3127]

I am not trying to bash Riviera or tell people that bought there they made a mistake. But when we talk about point charts, we should be clear. It's not just a 10-20% difference. Here are the numbers showing the average number of additional points required at Riviera. "Average" means the average number of points needed across all seasons, accounting for the number of days in each season.

STUDIOS
	RIV - Standard	RIV - Preferred
BCV	12%​	36%​
BWV - Standard	42%​	73%​
BWV - Preferred	12%​	35%​

1-BEDROOMS
	RIV - Standard	RIV - Preferred
BCV	16%​	43%​
BWV - Standard	43%​	77%​
BWV - Preferred	15%​	42%​

2-BEDROOMS
	RIV - Standard	RIV - Preferred
BCV	15%​	39%​
BWV - Standard	63%​	63%​
BWV - Preferred	14%​	38%​

	Tower Studio
BCV	-12%​
BWV - Standard	13%​
BWV - Preferred	-13%​

So the ONLY time it's "just" a 10-20% difference in points for Riviera is when you're comparing:

• BCV to Standard RIV rooms (which owners are unlikely to get at 7 months)
• Preferred view BWV rooms to Standard view RIV rooms (which pits different view types against each other ... yet, the higher view category is still cheaper)
• Tower studios (RIV requires fewer points than BCV or BWV preferred ... but not by much ... and BWV standard is cheaper than Tower Studios)

RIV requires a boatload more points to get the same length of stay.

Also, on a per point basis:

• BCV's 2020 dues are 15% less than RIV's
• BWV's 2020 dues are 11% less than RIV's

So you need more points at RIV, those points cost more upfront, and the ongoing MF's per point are higher.

Again, I am not bashing RIV, or its owners... I get the arguments for it. I'm pointing out numbers. Facts. That is all. It's more than a 10-20% difference in points. The qualitative factors can (and should) be debated. But the numbers are the numbers.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

BCV to Standard RIV rooms (which owners are unlikely to get at 7 months)

And Tower Studios are pretty much going to be a NO at 7.

 

[Sandisw]

I am not trying to bash Riviera or tell people that bought there they made a mistake. But when we talk about point charts, we should be clear. It's not just a 10-20% difference. Here are the numbers showing the average number of additional points required at Riviera. "Average" means the average number of points needed across all seasons, accounting for the number of days in each season.

STUDIOS
	RIV - Standard	RIV - Preferred
BCV	12%​	36%​
BWV - Standard	42%​	73%​
BWV - Preferred	12%​	35%​

1-BEDROOMS
	RIV - Standard	RIV - Preferred
BCV	16%​	43%​
BWV - Standard	43%​	77%​
BWV - Preferred	15%​	42%​

2-BEDROOMS
	RIV - Standard	RIV - Preferred
BCV	15%​	39%​
BWV - Standard	63%​	63%​
BWV - Preferred	14%​	38%​

	Tower Studio
BCV	-12%​
BWV - Standard	13%​
BWV - Preferred	-13%​

So the ONLY time it's "just" a 10-20% difference in points for Riviera is when you're comparing:

• BCV to Standard RIV rooms (which owners are unlikely to get at 7 months)
• Preferred view BWV rooms to Standard view RIV rooms (which pits different view types against each other ... yet, the higher view category is still cheaper)
• Tower studios (RIV requires fewer points than BCV or BWV preferred ... but not by much ... and BWV standard is cheaper than Tower Studios)

RIV requires a boatload more points to get the same length of stay.

Also, on a per point basis:

• BCV's 2020 dues are 15% less than RIV's
• BWV's 2020 dues are 11% less than RIV's

So you need more points at RIV, those points cost more upfront, and the ongoing MF's per point are higher.

Again, I am not bashing RIV, or its owners... I get the arguments for it. I'm pointing out numbers. Facts. That is all. It's more than a 10-20% difference in points. The qualitative factors can (and should) be debated. But the numbers are the numbers.

No question that if one stays at BCV or BWV it can cost less points. But in reality isnt that only a factor for those who don’t see the resort as a choice anyway?

Lets be honest, OKW can be stayed at for less than BCV as well. So is AKV in some cases. So if it about cheapest option, then there are better options.

So you are right, it comes down to all the qualitative aspects of each resort, and depending on individuals, each holds its own, I stayed at BCV once, didn’t use SAB at all, and didn’t find it a resort i have any desire to go back to. VGF is my favorite and point heavy tool.

For. me, DVC is about the resort and individual needs and regardless of cost, for many, that will play a bigger role I where one stays. People that find RIV a great resort will not be bothered by the points needed. People thst don’t, will

 

[ray3127]

No question that if one stays at BCV or BWV it can cost less points. But in reality isnt that only a factor for those who don’t see the resort as a choice anyway?

Lets be honest, OKW can be stayed at for less than BCV as well. So is AKV in some cases. So if it about cheapest option, then there are better options.

So you are right, it comes down to all the qualitative aspects of each resort, and depending on individuals, each holds its own, I stayed at BCV once, didn’t use SAB at all, and didn’t find it a resort i have any desire to go back to. VGF is my favorite and point heavy tool.

For. me, DVC is about the resort and individual needs and regardless of cost, for many, that will play a bigger role I where one stays. People that find RIV a great resort will not be bothered by the points needed. People thst don’t, won’t

100% agree! The points are one of many factors.

For me, the qualitative factors of BCV far outweigh the lower point charts of OKW or AKV (mostly walkability + SAB). But I get others feel differently, and everybody should choose what is best for them.

Really I just wanted to point out it wasn't a 10-20% difference in point charts, more like 30-60% more points for same class rooms (though again, I realize the room layouts are different). It is all our choice as to what is/isn't worth it.

 

[Sandisw]

100% agree! The points are one of many factors.

For me, the qualitative factors of BCV far outweigh the lower point charts of OKW or AKV (mostly walkability + SAB). But I get others feel differently, and everybody should choose what is best for them.

Really I just wanted to point out it wasn't a 10-20% difference in point charts, more like 30-60% more points for same class rooms (though again, I realize the room layouts are different). It is all our choice as to what is/isn't worth it.

I think my thought thouggh is whether or not the actual difference really matters because every argument for or against staying there isn’t about the points it will take, but rather people deciding whether the point charts is or is not worth it and that is all based on qualitative value.

 

[RivShore]

100% agree! The points are one of many factors.

For me, the qualitative factors of BCV far outweigh the lower point charts of OKW or AKV (mostly walkability + SAB). But I get others feel differently, and everybody should choose what is best for them.

Really I just wanted to point out it wasn't a 10-20% difference in point charts, more like 30-60% more points for same class rooms (though again, I realize the room layouts are different). It is all our choice as to what is/isn't worth it.

Just FYI, when I brought up the 10-20% difference I was not looking at the full point chart, I was just basing it on this post:

Most DVC owners are bargain hunters. If they have a choice between 18/20 points for a Standard Riviera Studio (Dream) or a BCV Studio at 16/20, that's 10 points saved on a week's stay that includes two weekend nights.

Standard studio's are our preferred room choice so I really did not look at anything else. I think the extra space, beds, baths, etc. are worth the difference vs. BCV (and some others), but wow, your chart really shows what a great deal BWV's are.

 

[ray3127]

I think my thought thouggh is whether or not the actual difference really matters because every argument for or against staying there isn’t about the points it will take, but rather people deciding whether the point charts is or is not worth it and that is all based on qualitative value.

The actual difference in point charts has to matter. Yes, everybody should make a qualitative decision. But the point charts are one piece of the puzzle.

So for somebody comparing BWV to RIV and wanting to book standard rooms, the real question should be: is it worth buying 42% more points for the same length of stay, and then pay an extra 12% in MF's on those points? That gets you the true difference in financial cost. You can say "BWV costs 'x', and RIV costs 'y'."

THEN, it's 100% qualitative on justifying the higher cost of RIV. I'm not saying it's an irrational justification to prefer RIV after adjusting for the points charts. But part of deciding whether the point charts is worth it is necessarily crunching the numbers.

 

[ray3127]

Just FYI, when I brought up the 10-20% difference I was not looking at the full point chart, I was just basing it on this post:



Standard studio's are our preferred room choice so I really did not look at anything else. I think the extra space, beds, baths, etc. are worth the difference vs. BCV (and some others), but wow, your chart really shows what a great deal BWV's are.

Gotcha, I did not notice that. My bad.

So yeah, BWV is really a smoking deal with their points charts. We planned to add on this fall, so when we visited WDW in September we took some time there and really felt the place out. Then we went over to BCV, realized we were "home", and added on there instead. Which only proves the point that while point charts are important, they aren't everything! Strictly by them, we should've added on at BWV. But there's more to it.

 

[Sandisw]

The actual difference in point charts has to matter. Yes, everybody should make a qualitative decision. But the point charts are one piece of the puzzle.

So for somebody comparing BWV to RIV and wanting to book standard rooms, the real question should be: is it worth buying 42% more points for the same length of stay, and then pay an extra 12% in MF's on those points? That gets you the true difference in financial cost. You can say "BWV costs 'x', and RIV costs 'y'."

THEN, it's 100% qualitative on justifying the higher cost of RIV. I'm not saying it's an irrational justification to prefer RIV after adjusting for the points charts. But part of deciding whether the point charts is worth it is necessarily crunching the numbers.

Okay, I can see it from this standpoint from wanting to buy that someone has to decide that I can buy BWV or BCV for less to get the same length of stay.

It was when I spent $5k more to buy in at BLT in 2009 vs SSR cheaper to take advantage of the home resort period.

And, as you said, once you have the bottom line numbers, then it becomes all about the rest. Got it!

 

[crisi]

I am not trying to bash Riviera or tell people that bought there they made a mistake. But when we talk about point charts, we should be clear. It's not just a 10-20% difference. Here are the numbers showing the average number of additional points required at Riviera. "Average" means the average number of points needed across all seasons, accounting for the number of days in each season.
......

And that's why it won't drive changes to booking patterns at BWV BCV. You might get a bigger room, but you can't walk to Epcot, there is no SAB (at BCV), you don't have the plethora of BWV/BCV/Swan Dolphin restaurants within a walk and you are paying a LOT MORE for each night worth of stay. BWV/BCV remain point bargains for people who want to trade in, and RIV is expensive per night for some more square footage and bathroom? I just don't see enough DVC members seeing the value there to change BWV/BCV booking patterns. This is not bashing RIV, it is what it is - a very expensive per night (points wise) stay.

 

[The Jackal]

And Tower Studios are pretty much going to be a NO at 7.

And they are slightly bigger than the closet in a 1 bedroom at VGF.

 

[Gary Carter]

Is beach club really all that? I've never even been there, let alone stayed there. I just feel like for the points I'd rather stay at something a little easier to get into and not worry about it.