Are bookings down?

[The Pho]

The difference is you don't need a ticket to go, and therefore i don't count it as part of WDW. If i buy a ticket, I spend the entire day in the park or a very nearby resort to eat like the Poly. I am guessing a significant portion of all WDW guests never go to DS and wouldn't consider their options as part of their Disney World vacation offerings any more than you would include other nearby restaurants. The fact is locals can go there to eat and shop without ever going near a park so no, this isn't really in the consideration in the equation.

That's an odd distinction to make. There's a ton of stuff you don't need a ticket to do and why should that be the line. Don't need a park ticket to golf, or ride the monorail, or ride the boats, or to go to any of the hotels. Did Springs count when Disney Quest was around because that required a ticket? And a significant number of people only go to Magic Kingdom and none of the other parks so even that isn't a great distinction. More people go to Springs than go to the water parks, but those are ticketed. There are a lot of people that go to Disney World and don't do any parks, just as there are people that go and don't do any rides. It's all part of what Walt Disney World resort offers, a very wide range of choices, with Theme Parks being the center pieces.

 

[tlmadden73]

The difference is you don't need a ticket to go, and therefore i don't count it as part of WDW. If i buy a ticket, I spend the entire day in the park or a very nearby resort to eat like the Poly. I am guessing a significant portion of all WDW guests never go to DS and wouldn't consider their options as part of their Disney World vacation offerings any more than you would include other nearby restaurants. The fact is locals can go there to eat and shop without ever going near a park so no, this isn't really in the consideration in the equation.

But it is part of the equation.

Disney Springs just suffers from not being really well connected to a resort or a park.
Is City Walk part of the Universal resort? I'd say yes. Disney Springs probably would be seen by a lot more as "part" of the experience if that was the case.

But there are a lot of people (myself included) that do Disney springs on arrival or departure day .. or a day off to still get that Disney feel without having to buy a ticket. Sure ... a lot of it isn't uniquely "Disney" . but it is owned and operated by Disney .. has the Disney name and it is purposely tied into their resorts. It is literally within the confines of the Walt Disney World property.. just like the water parks, just like the mini-golf .. just like the campground (and its activities).

To each their own though.

 

[Farro]

The difference is you don't need a ticket to go, and therefore i don't count it as part of WDW. If i buy a ticket, I spend the entire day in the park or a very nearby resort to eat like the Poly. I am guessing a significant portion of all WDW guests never go to DS and wouldn't consider their options as part of their Disney World vacation offerings any more than you would include other nearby restaurants. The fact is locals can go there to eat and shop without ever going near a park so no, this isn't really in the consideration in the equation.

The restaurants at Disney Springs are included on the dining plan, so you can bet that guests are considering it as part of their WDW vacation offerings!

 

[kydisneyfans]

Owing DVC is really the only reason we continue to go back, it's a getaway with cheap flights and no lodging costs. We do the AP to strategically take multiple trips with the rolling 1 year period to save ticket costs, and we.....GASP....cook in our condo instead of spending $15 on a hamburger. Our Disney food costs are no more than if we spent the week at home.

Other vacation destinations are based on cost. We did 10 days in Great Britain cheaper than our 7 day budget was for Seattle. Disney is out of hand with nickel and diming though, and it's more difficult by the month to find ways around it.

I also think Disney will be fine until the next recession, then it will be interesting to see how many fees and price reductions have to happen to get people back.

 

[Viking7641]

Owing DVC is really the only reason we continue to go back, it's a getaway with cheap flights and no lodging costs. We do the AP to strategically take multiple trips with the rolling 1 year period to save ticket costs, and we.....GASP....cook in our condo instead of spending $15 on a hamburger. Our Disney food costs are no more than if we spent the week at home.

Other vacation destinations are based on cost. We did 10 days in Great Britain cheaper than our 7 day budget was for Seattle. Disney is out of hand with nickel and diming though, and it's more difficult by the month to find ways around it.

I also think Disney will be fine until the next recession, then it will be interesting to see how many fees and price reductions have to happen to get people back.

None. Even during a recession we are in a state where there will still be plenty of people with access to the parks, that are still rolling in disposable income, a recession might inconvenience them, but there is a class of wealth Disney caters to that will be relatively insulated from such things. They don't need the middle classes money anymore, there is a global upper class that will continue to get richer, continue to have more leisure time, and spend that leisure time doing "experiences" like Disney in order to not feel guilty about hoarding TVs and luxury items

 

[ChipnDale79]

None. Even during a recession we are in a state where there will still be plenty of people with access to the parks, that are still rolling in disposable income, a recession might inconvenience them, but there is a class of wealth Disney caters to that will be relatively insulated from such things. They don't need the middle classes money anymore, there is a global upper class that will continue to get richer, continue to have more leisure time, and spend that leisure time doing "experiences" like Disney in order to not feel guilty about hoarding TVs and luxury items

That wasn’t the case 10 years ago, Disney had to offer massive discounts to get people to come.

 

[snappy]

That wasn’t the case 10 years ago, Disney had to offer massive discounts to get people to come.

Yes, I benefitted from the discounts too. It was great!

 

[Viking7641]

That wasn’t the case 10 years ago, Disney had to offer massive discounts to get people to come.

Wealth is more global now and more concentrated. The new rich want it all to, and will fly for it

 

[manning]

Wealth is more global now and more concentrated. The new rich want it all to, and will fly for it

And eventually they will get it all. More than they want. Things go up and they go down. I grew up at a time when I entertain myself and happy as a lark. What was Disney back then? A cartoon.

 

[prink022]

But it is part of the equation.

Disney Springs just suffers from not being really well connected to a resort or a park.
Is City Walk part of the Universal resort? I'd say yes. Disney Springs probably would be seen by a lot more as "part" of the experience if that was the case.

But there are a lot of people (myself included) that do Disney springs on arrival or departure day .. or a day off to still get that Disney feel without having to buy a ticket. Sure ... a lot of it isn't uniquely "Disney" . but it is owned and operated by Disney .. has the Disney name and it is purposely tied into their resorts. It is literally within the confines of the Walt Disney World property.. just like the water parks, just like the mini-golf .. just like the campground (and its activities).

To each their own though.

I don't know if I really get this argument (or need for it ) that Disney Springs is considered part of the resort. It's not a "shopping mall", it's a themed area that does add value and convenience onto a Walt Disney World trip. While you may plan Disney Springs for arrival or departure day, some people plan entire days around it.

Disney Springs is VERY much Disney. You may not need a ticket to get in, but the restaurants do accept the dining plan, it does have the Disney name, and one of the best Disney gift shops on property (even if I do prefer the old WoD over the new one).

Saying that Disney Springs doesn't add value is like saying The Boardwalk doesn't, or the mini golf, Trader Sam's doesn't (listen, I really like Trader Sam's).

I'm agreeing with you here, obviously, just didn't have a desire to reply response.

 

[DisFanDad]

I'm kind of starting to wonder about the galaxies edge "stall" and then "boom". Like I have no doubt it's going to draw crowds ... but ... I haven't seen a lot of people, even here, saying thru are delaying trips because of it. A few here and there, sure, but I think I've seen as many or more people GOING before things "get crazy". Yet people keep talking about the quiet before the storm ...

At the same time we often talk about how "normal" people are clueless as to what's happening at wdw generally speaking. I can't imagine "average" non-fansite folk are staying away because they are waiting for SWGE.

Therefore I am left with the conclusion that if there is availability, if disney starts sending out more promos and pins, bookings must be down, and not in anticipation of SWGE. Maybe, just maybe, when SWGE opens it will draw enough back to even it out or increase crowds. But I have to wonder if a combination of increased prices and an extended period of a good economy and vacation market saturation aren't having an impact here.

Not enough data points to confirm the lack of bookings, but I know Pete on the unplugged cast had said the summer was crazy slow.

Its interesting anyway.

And a recession is coming, maybe a year, maybe 2 ... but it's coming.

 

[prink022]

I'm kind of starting to wonder about the galaxies edge "stall" and then "boom". Like I have no doubt it's going to draw crowds ... but ... I haven't seen a lot of people, even here, saying thru are delaying trips because of it. A few here and there, sure, but I think I've seen as many or more people GOING before things "get crazy". Yet people keep talking about the quiet before the storm ...

At the same time we often talk about how "normal" people are clueless as to what's happening at wdw generally speaking. I can't imagine "average" non-fansite folk are staying away because they are waiting for SWGE.

Therefore I am left with the conclusion that if there is availability, if disney starts sending out more promos and pins, bookings must be down, and not in anticipation of SWGE. Maybe, just maybe, when SWGE opens it will draw enough back to even it out or increase crowds. But I have to wonder if a combination of increased prices and an extended period of a good economy and vacation market saturation aren't having an impact here.

Not enough data points to confirm the lack of bookings, but I know Pete on the unplugged cast had said the summer was crazy slow.

Its interesting anyway.

And a recession is coming, maybe a year, maybe 2 ... but it's coming.

The latest I read was financial experts were saying closer to five years for the recession, but yeah it's coming. Though I don't think it's going to effect as much as people think. It'll be harder to go visit the parks, yes... but I think it'll still happen for a lot of people.

I've seen people - loads on other sites - saying they're waiting for SWGE, but then you also have to keep in mind that this isn't some small expansion. Everyone knows it's happening. I have customers tell me they're excited for it, and they've never been to Disney before.

I don't necessarily think it will be AS BIG as they say, but it'll be big.

Either way, I still attribute these booking advertisements as money and prep for the anniversary... especially since the fall months have been exceptionally busy.

 

[mshanson3121]

I'm kind of starting to wonder about the galaxies edge "stall" and then "boom". Like I have no doubt it's going to draw crowds ... but ... I haven't seen a lot of people, even here, saying thru are delaying trips because of it. A few here and there, sure, but I think I've seen as many or more people GOING before things "get crazy". Yet people keep talking about the quiet before the storm ...

At the same time we often talk about how "normal" people are clueless as to what's happening at wdw generally speaking. I can't imagine "average" non-fansite folk are staying away because they are waiting for SWGE.

Therefore I am left with the conclusion that if there is availability, if disney starts sending out more promos and pins, bookings must be down, and not in anticipation of SWGE. Maybe, just maybe, when SWGE opens it will draw enough back to even it out or increase crowds. But I have to wonder if a combination of increased prices and an extended period of a good economy and vacation market saturation aren't having an impact here.

Not enough data points to confirm the lack of bookings, but I know Pete on the unplugged cast had said the summer was crazy slow.

Its interesting anyway.

And a recession is coming, maybe a year, maybe 2 ... but it's coming.

I've seen people - loads on other sites - saying they're waiting for SWGE, but then you also have to keep in mind that this isn't some small expansion. Everyone knows it's happening. I have customers tell me they're excited for it, and they've never been to Disney before.

@prink022 On other Disney sites I would assume. Here's the thing, the people on those sites, and the ones here, are not the average guest. In fact, not even close to it. They're the absolute, minuscule minority. So, just because people on the Disney boards, who have a wealth more knowledge of happenings, say they're waiting to go, really means nothing when it comes to what the general population is doing.

Also, while some are aware, there are many, many people out there, who have no idea that SWGE is being built. Or that Pandora was built. Or anything really that is going on at Disney. The majority of people are aware of Disney, but not educated about Disney. I could name many people - young parents with families, who are Disney's prime targets, who have no idea what is going on there at any given time. And some of these are people who have been before! Or are considering going! These people either have no idea SWGE is being built or are aware of it but have no idea what it's really going to be like, that it's actually something considering postponing a trip for.

So all that to say, I really agree with @DisFanDad , I'm not convinced that it's waiting for Star Wars that have caused the potential drop in bookings. I think it's a combination of many factors.

 

[Q-man]

I've been reading a lot of reports where people have been saying this is the least crowded October they have ever seen.

In recent years, October has become quite a crowded month...but not this year!

Was there Thursday to yesterday and would agree crowds were very low.

Wondering if all the price hikes are sending people to Potterworld? Can't wait to see year end attendance numbers.

$5.75 for a Mickey bar was the most egregious to me.

 

[Q-man]

None. Even during a recession we are in a state where there will still be plenty of people with access to the parks, that are still rolling in disposable income, a recession might inconvenience them, but there is a class of wealth Disney caters to that will be relatively insulated from such things. They don't need the middle classes money anymore, there is a global upper class that will continue to get richer, continue to have more leisure time, and spend that leisure time doing "experiences" like Disney in order to not feel guilty about hoarding TVs and luxury items

A. Good luck getting them to fill the values and moderates.
B. How many have already bought DVCs?

 

[Q-man]

That wasn’t the case 10 years ago, Disney had to offer massive discounts to get people to come.

Yep. Stayed at the GF with 'free' deluxe dining for 2 adults and 2 kids for less than $250 a night.

 

[snappy]

Wasn’t just Disney hotels. We stayed at a Disney springs area hotel for $20.02 per night in 2002. Hell of a deal but it was in September. Crazy rain.

 

[Animal]

A. Good luck getting them to fill the values and moderates.
B. How many have already bought DVCs?

Yep. I’m not seeing someone who is insensitive to the state of the economy staying at All Star Sports.

 

[DisFanDad]

Yep. Stayed at the GF with 'free' deluxe dining for 2 adults and 2 kids for less than $250 a night.

Good lord, I need to get back to building a time machine ...

 

[Planogirl]

I question whether that many of the truly rich flock to WDW. There are no actual luxury hotels on property and fancy dining experiences are limited too. That's not to say that all rich people expect such things but I bet that many do.