9-year-old charged with murder in 5 Illinois fire deaths

[TeresaBelle]

https://www.mercurynews.com/2019/10/09/9-year-old-charged-with-murder-in-5-illinois-fire-deaths/
What a horrible story! The article states:

No arrest warrant is to be issued for the suspect, Minger said. The suspect will be appointed an attorney and will be subject to a bench trial, in front of a judge, he said.

Under Illinois law, a suspect younger than 10 cannot be detained. And a minor is not given a public jury trial and not entitled to one — unless the minor is charged as an adult.

I saw a video interview with his mother also and she says she forgives him and loves him, no matter what. I would too, as a mother, but I would be afraid to live with him. I cannot believe he's not been detained in some sort of juvenile facility!

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=466519983951012

 

[DLgal]

Well, considering his mental health diagnoses, something like this isn't really his fault, so I understand not treating him like a criminal. The poor kid, though...and his mom. It's very sad. Hopefully he will be placed in a good residential treatment facility. He is obviously a danger to himself and others and in need of some serious medical care.

 

[kimblebee]

I don’t even know how to process this.

I am very conflicted on this. Yes, mental health is a serious issue and doesn’t necessarily make someone evil, but geez lady.

Im sure she is in immense shock. She seems so detached from it. I can’t even imagine the guilt you’d feel.

I wonder if he was being medicated at the time of the fire. I’m really surprised they showed his picture.

That’s all I can come up with now.

 

[low-key]

Even if he killed intentionally you cant throw the book at anyone that young.

Just not long ago I was reading all kinds of stuff on this kid, he was charged with rapping and killing a white girl, put to death without much of a trial, we cant have that

 

[TeresaBelle]

I definitely agree he should not be put to death, but at the very least, if found guilty, or even not guilty due to mental defect, he surely needs placement in a mental health facility.

It's just so sad!

 

[dez1978]

He’s 9 years old for Christ’s sake. Even if the fire was set intentionally his brain likely didn’t even understand the finality of the consequences. Does he need some help? Absolutely. But having worked several years in both adult and juvenile justice, locking him up would likely be more detrimental for him than anything else. Locking him up in “juvy” is just going to subject him to the bigger kids who know what they are doing and will just teach him how to be a better criminal. Sadly the mental health system is underfunded and unequipped to deal with a child like this. He’d likely be medicated into oblivion and not given the treatment needed. I don’t know what the answer is but I know what it isn’t.

 

[DLgal]

I don’t even know how to process this.

I am very conflicted on this. Yes, mental health is a serious issue and doesn’t necessarily make someone evil, but geez lady.

Im sure she is in immense shock. She seems so detached from it. I can’t even imagine the guilt you’d feel.

I wonder if he was being medicated at the time of the fire. I’m really surprised they showed his picture.

That’s all I can come up with now.

This child is schizophrenic. His actions aren't "evil." He is sick. As a mother, how could you just write off your 9 YEAR OLD child? You can't. My heart aches for this mother and all she is going through.

"Geez lady" is more than a bit insensitive.

 

[LSUmiss]

This child is schizophrenic. His actions aren't "evil." He is sick. As a mother, how could you just write off your 9 YEAR OLD child? You can't. My heart aches for this mother and all she is going through.

"Geez lady" is more than a bit insensitive.

Sorry IM (professional)O there are no schizophrenic children. I’m not saying he doesn’t have some mental health issues, but that’s a ridiculous diagnosis for a 9 yr old.

 

[kimblebee]

This child is schizophrenic. His actions aren't "evil." He is sick. As a mother, how could you just write off your 9 YEAR OLD child? You can't. My heart aches for this mother and all she is going through.

"Geez lady" is more than a bit insensitive.

You don’t have to lecture me about mental heath issues. I know.

Also, I said I didn’t know how to process it. I was just writing words. I stand by what I said.

 

[brockash]

I don’t even know how to process this.

I am very conflicted on this. Yes, mental health is a serious issue and doesn’t necessarily make someone evil, but geez lady.

Im sure she is in immense shock. She seems so detached from it. I can’t even imagine the guilt you’d feel.

I wonder if he was being medicated at the time of the fire. I’m really surprised they showed his picture.

That’s all I can come up with now.

Mom agreed/asked for his picture to be shown. I'm very conflicted on it as well and will just say I'm grateful not to be in any of their situations.

 

[brockash]

This child is schizophrenic. His actions aren't "evil." He is sick. As a mother, how could you just write off your 9 YEAR OLD child? You can't. My heart aches for this mother and all she is going through.

"Geez lady" is more than a bit insensitive.

As a pp stated I believe he showed characteristics of schizophrenia; not an actual diagnosis. The whole thing is just sad. Mental health issues can really feel like a hopeless battle to everyone. There are so many other factors (influence of how someones raised, the ability to have the education to understand what care is needed, the financial resources to obtain it... the list goes on and on.) There's eeally just not a good simple answer as to how to best help mental health issues in anyone.

 

[kimblebee]

I keep thinking about his mom. I can’t imagine how she is feeling. We all say we’d love our kids unconditionally, but would we really? He killed two of her children (his siblings), her mom (his grandma), her fiancée, and her niece (his cousin).

She just seems so indifferent when she says she called out to her kids sorry I can’t save you. She’s got to be on Valium or something. Awful, awful, awful.

 

[brockash]

He’s 9 years old for Christ’s sake. Even if the fire was set intentionally his brain likely didn’t even understand the finality of the consequences. Does he need some help? Absolutely. But having worked several years in both adult and juvenile justice, locking him up would likely be more detrimental for him than anything else. Locking him up in “juvy” is just going to subject him to the bigger kids who know what they are doing and will just teach him how to be a better criminal. Sadly the mental health system is underfunded and unequipped to deal with a child like this. He’d likely be medicated into oblivion and not given the treatment needed. I don’t know what the answer is but I know what it isn’t.

I totally agree, however not locking him up (or any realistic outcome "treatment") really isn't the answer either... I would bet anything if he's not locked up there's VERY little likelihood that he will not severely harm someone again. - If we're being honest the chances of him even getting close to the kind of mental health care he needs is slim to none. I see it every day...there is just not a decent answer for mental health care.

 

[ronandannette]

I totally agree, however not locking him up (or any realistic outcome "treatment") really isn't the answer either... I would bet anything if he's not locked up there's VERY little likelihood that he will not severely harm someone again. - If we're being honest the chances of him even getting close to the kind of mental health care he needs is slim to none. I see it every day...there is just not a decent answer for mental health care.

I'm not without compassion, although admittedly I don't deal with any similar issues personally. I'd just like to ask a "devil's advocate" kind of question: If the bolded is indeed the case, when does society require the protection of basically throwing away the key? There must be some point at which the potential risks outweigh the best interest of this child. Please give me your opinion.

 

[Welsh_Dragon]

The child started the fire intentionally but did he intend to damage property or harm people? Just yesterday on the radio the British comedian Lenny Henry, while promoting his new autobiography, recounted a story from his childhood about putting some inflammable spirit in a bottle and lighting it, because he didn’t have a torch and wanted to read a comic or magazine. The family home was damaged but no one was injured. He recalled it as one of the only times when he was ‘naughty’ that his Jamaican Mother didn’t shout and punish him with a smack. No one is suggesting that Mr Henry was a criminal or mentally unwell. Children do stupid, irresponsible things. If the boy was so obviously mentally unwell, for his own safety and the safety of others would it have been in his best interest for him to be supervised more closely?
As to the best interest question, we should always seek out the least restrictive option and balance that with any assessed danger posed.

 

[kaytieeldr]

He killed two of her children (his siblings), her mom (his grandma), her fiancée, and her niece (his cousin).

Just for accuracy (you know me), the oldest victim was her grandma, so her son's great grandmother.

 

[kimblebee]

Just for accuracy (you know me), the oldest victim was her grandma, so her son's great grandmother.

I stand corrected.

 

[LSUmiss]

I'm not without compassion, although admittedly I don't deal with any similar issues personally. I'd just like to ask a "devil's advocate" kind of question: If the bolded is indeed the case, when does society require the protection of basically throwing away the key? There must be some point at which the potential risks outweigh the best interest of this child. Please give me your opinion.

Generally speaking it’s an age thing b/c we like to believe there is still hope for someone that young. But, I will admit, having seen these kids irl, I honestly don’t think there is at least not with our current system in place. But, I’m torn b/c I also don’t want to live in a society where we give up on 9 yr olds.

 

[C&Jx2]

What about something like a therapeutic foster home type deal? Where it is nurturing, but also extremely monitored? Do those kind of places exist?

 

[luvsJack]

Actually it is possible for him to have very early onset schizophrenia. It is rare but possible.

But either way he does need intensive psychiatric care. If he didn’t before the fire he definitely will now. But I would find it extremely sad if all that was done is that he is thrown in a hospital setting and fed drugs. He needs more than that. “Juvy” isn’t the answer. That will just make him worse in the long run.

As for the mom, I would assume shock and grief both for her family members that died and her living son. She still loves him and he is still her son. A parent loves a child unconditionally. But I am sure she is pulled and twisted with her emotions.